Why are SoB good in 8th?

[TheShredder]

This might be a silly question, but I'm curious as to why SoB seem to be doing so much better in 8th

I know Celestine is good now but what else has improved for them?

[taikishi]

Lower points cost, more universal acts of faith, easily spammed list.

 

If you have the points to spare, Celestine and 2-3 Sisters units actually isn't a bad tactic for Imperium armies because it's a guaranteed AoF each turn for one unit and an additional on a 2+

[Atrus]

An across the board leveling of the playing field. All the special snowflake rules that made such large imbalances for the most part have been thrown away with the Indices.

As a result, everyone had had to relearn their army. What was crazy OP before isnt so anymore, strategies and tics have had to be redeveloped.

 

Except for us. It may be the one benefit we have of having such a limited range. Looking purely sisters we have like 5 units and theres only so much you can do with that. Other armies have units and options out the wazoo- more things to get messed up.

 

A more solid and simple core rule set. Our options are limited and the core of the rules benefit our options quite well.

Seriously look at what we have. The holy trinity. Thats about it. Other armies are freaking Swiss army knives compared to us, yet our limited options work so amazingly well probably because we dont try to be the jack of all trades but simply find what we do and do it exceptionally well.

 

No more instantantly dying characters to stray S6 shots.

 

Sisters players naturally superior tactical acumen forcibly developed by decades of neglect and sub standard rules :

 

A decent faith system. Not great at scaling and hit and miss, but when it goes off it goess off wiyh a bang.

Some might argue that it is a game winner for us. I disagree. Yes it can make a difference no argument here. But are we pulling off 5-10 AoF faith a turn? No, most of us are getting by on 2 a turn. Out of all the units that are eligible to use it in a game which might be upwards of 10+ faith is clearly not our winning crutch but an edge. A sharp edge. But only an edge.

 

We handle every foe with the trinity. Thats all sisters believe and thats all they need. Their performance on the table is a little hard to argue.

 

Maybe its just their uncommon appearance on the table that people dont know how to combat?

[Jacinda]

This might be a silly question, but I'm curious as to why SoB seem to be doing so much better in 8th

 

I know Celestine is good now but what else has improved for them?

Assaults after disembark helps.  SoB have traditionally had some decent melee units but no way to get them into combat.

Point cost that reflect S3, T3 and Armor 3.

Better Acts of Faith system.  Better in that it is reliable and each Act of Faith is a significant bonus.

 

Sisters of Battle have always been based in the fundamentals.  Bolter, flamer, melta in power armor.  It's like dribble, pass and tackle.  It is easy to carry all the tools you need for every target type.  With the scaled back armies in the indices, everyone has to use the fundamentals more and this falls into our strength.  We are not the most mobile or the highest volume of fire or the highest strength weapons but they are all solid choice for Sisters and they are all priced resonabily to carry.

 

[edit]

I should have read the whole thread first.  Atrus said the same thing, only differently.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Jacinda

[Atrus]

 

This might be a silly question, but I'm curious as to why SoB seem to be doing so much better in 8th

I know Celestine is good now but what else has improved for them?

 

Assaults after disembark helps.  SoB have traditionally had some decent melee units but no way to get them into combat.

Point cost that reflect S3, T3 and Armor 3.

Better Acts of Faith system.  Better in that it is reliable and each Act of Faith is a significant bonus.

 

Sisters of Battle have always been based in the fundamentals.  Bolter, flamer, melta in power armor.  It's like dribble, pass and tackle.  It is easy to carry all the tools you need for every target type.  With the scaled back armies in the indices, everyone has to use the fundamentals more and this falls into our strength.  We are not the most mobile or the highest volume of fire or the highest strength weapons but they are all solid choice for Sisters and they are all priced resonabily to carry.

 

[edit]

I should have read the whole thread first.  Atrus said the same thing, only differently.

Yeah but you said it in a much more eloquent non-sleep-deprived way.

[Servant of Dante]

Both of you put it very well I think:D

 

We'll see how much the codicies change things, I'm still hoping we'll get our own codex, but that's not a sure-thing.

[Gen.Steiner]

I'm still betting on a Codex: Adeptus Ministorum before Christmas.

[Noeh]

After hearing some of the things that Spess Marines got in their codex, I have a SMALL amount of hope sisters won't get screwed with our codex. Although now I'm not looking forward to the next few months until we get it. We now get to endure everyone else getting relics, strategems, detachments, decent warlord traits, and decent sub-faction specific abilities until we get ours...

[Servant of Dante]

Sounds like 7th, so nothing new :D

[Gen.Steiner]

And to be fair the Index list is good!

[CaptainMarsh]

Both of you put it very well I think:D

 

We'll see how much the codicies change things, I'm still hoping we'll get our own codex, but that's not a sure-thing.

It will happen. It has been ordained and it is as the Emperor Wills!

[ERJAK]

The biggest thing I want out of the a possible codex are more things I can use AoF on and more ways to get AoF. A 3 CP strategem that allows for a second 2+ roll would be awesome, especially if we had some bikes or Agressor equivalents to use them on.

[Gen.Steiner]

My two wish-list items for a new Codex are:

Frateris Militia with options for making them into Redemptionists

An actual, real, proper, physical, buy-it-and-hold-it-in-your-hands, Codex for Sisters of Battle players.

 

I'm not sure which of the two wishes will happen :P

[Servant of Dante]

Yeah, even if they don't change a single thing from the index, just a print codex would make me happy :D

 

That being said, the only addition I really really want is separate rules for the 6 Major Orders.

[Beams]

Yeah, even if they don't change a single thing from the index, just a print codex would make me happy :D

 

That being said, the only addition I really really want is separate rules for the 6 Major Orders.

I agree, wholeheartedly.

[CrusherJoe]

I imagine there will be an Ad Min codex.

 

Ah, but hope is the first step to disappointment...

[Gen.Steiner]

I imagine there will be an Ad Min codex.

 

Ah, but hope is the first step to disappointment...

 

And faith in the Emperor is its own reward. ;)

[CaptainMarsh]

Sisters are good because of really solid fundamentals, a powerful faction ability, an amazing character, and answers to readily available. The best answers? Not at all, but we don't lack the ability to act against much. Of course people are also very unaware of how Sisters work. As time moves on, our relative lack of advanced depth will be exploited, but we work exceptionally well until that time comes.

Edited August 1, 2017 by CaptainMarsh

[Gen.Steiner]

Sisters can function really well without Celestine, too; Acts of Faith and basic choices are a powerful combination in their own right. I quite agree that the longer we work with just the Index the less powerful we will be (lacking faction specific relics, stratagems etc) but I don't think it will be as uphill as struggle as it has been in the past.

[Montford]

I think one factor helping out my Sisters is our limited armory. We have had to learn to use what we have available to greatest effect. For example, at half-range meltas deal more reliable damage than lascannons, and all of our Infantry (except Repentia) can carry them. Marine players commonly equip lascannons which have longer range and are slightly less expensive in points, or plasma guns/ grav guns as special weapons. But these do not have the higher average damage of a melta when at half range. I rarely see meltas in the hands of a Marine. In my last game I had a Sisters Troop squad charged by a Bloat Drone which started its charge 5 inches out. That Squad had a multi melta and a melta. Both hit, wounded and wound up killing the Bloat Drone which still had 8 wounds left when it charged. A Marine Tactical Squad would have been harder pressed to do that with a lascannon and a plasma gun (assuming a Marine player was running a 10 model Tac Squad in the first place). I\

 

I find myself choosing tactics which capitalize on my weapons strengths, so you will always see my Seraphim getting in close to high value targets so that their Inferno Pistols can fire from 3 inches or less. The same thing with melta Dominions. Or Stormbolter Dominions now in 8th: they can put out a LOT of bolter shots for their points if you get them to 12 inch range! Or we figure out a way to get Repentia into decent charge range, something that's generally simpler for a Marine player with Terminators or Assault Marines as they are much more survivable than Repentia. These are just some examples and certainly not everything, but you get the idea. We have deadly weapons, we just need get out T3 girls into position to exploit them alive!

 

After all we have not gotten a single new piece of wargear since 2003, nor a new unit except for the stripper Canoness (Veridian? yeah, not a fan of spike heels on a soldier) however 8th Edition allows us to use what we have much more effectively. I am absolutely loving my Immolator w/ flamers especially when move it 12+ inches and toast a Unit my opponent didn't even realize was in threat range (25-30 inches!). And our Rretributors can move and still shoot, albeit with a penalty, which they could never do before. Our Acts of faith are also far more versatile now: previously they were unit specific, but now we can use them as we see fit and tailor their use to the Tactical situation present on the table. Good times.

Edited August 3, 2017 by Montford981

[Beams]

The people I play with get very... Passive aggressive? About my aof. "Well, that's jut her shooting phase before the shooting phase!"

 

But in all seriousness, it adds an absurd amount of firepower, and tactical flexibility.

 

Oh, that objective is too far? Double move and advance a BSS squad. 12+2d6 inches will prolly get you there. Or that seraphim squad who'll jump halfway across the board to drop a salvo of half range melta pistols in your tanks!

[UltiXorz]

Waaait a second ?

you can advance when using the move action AOF ?
I thought it was only the normal movement

[dracpanzer]

Waaait a second ?

you can advance when using the move action AOF ?

I thought it was only the normal movement

Yes you can advance when using your AoF, but you still count as having advanced for that turn. You could advance again during the actual movement phase, but there are rules that restrict your actions if a unit has advanced "this turn", rather than "in the movement phase".

[Gen.Steiner]

Yeah, just remember not to advance with the AoF if you want to do anything else that turn!

I second Montford's analysis, actually, it's taken the proverbial sharp metal thing and hit it with the proverbial handy heavy thing.

[Montford]

One exception is that a Dominion Squad could Advance for their AoF movement, and then Advance again in their normal move and still use their Assault weapons at -1 to hit. And if they are carrying flamers then that negative modifier means nothing. :)