fast attack options lacking?

[spafe]

Hi guys, Since the dropping of 8th I've put my renegades on hold (curse the lack of renegade stormtroopers/greneadiers), and have pulled out my guard. Old metal cadians to be precise. Now I got about halfway through repainting them before I flitted onto new projects, but with 8th I think I'm going to finish re-doing them.

 

To start with I have a good mix of stuff, but while learning/getting back into it at low power levels, I dont really want to start repainting my tanks yet. So I've got company commanders, commisars, platoon commants, stormtroopers, special weapons, veteran squads, command squads, infrantry squads, heavy weapon squads... that lets me fill out hq, elite, troops, heavy support... but we havent got anything that can go in fast attack.

 

Is it just me being strange, or does anyone else think we are lacking in that department? I have a hellhound, 2 armoured sents and 3 scouts that I can fill out a fast attack section with, but they are all armoured, and while I get cav are not armoured, I dont honestly know if I want to add cav to my army.

 

That said, I also dont really know what else fits with guard as a fast attack inf selection.

 

So yeah, is it jsut me or are we kinda light on the ground when it comes to fast attack options?

[Truesight]

 

 

So yeah, is it jsut me or are we kinda light on the ground when it comes to fast attack options?

 

Just you I think, yup.  You have a hellhound and 5 sentinels? Great, use them!  They pay off great on the tabletop.  Take three scouts with flamers and run them into the enemy with the hellhound. They are fast which is great for guard and flamers don't care how damaged they are.  Armored sentinels aren't as amazing but aren't bad either to be honest. 

 

Rough Riders work well too, getting into the backline and threatening multiwound charges for cheap. 

 

I don't think guard is weak in any of the slots at the moment, GW did well looking at our underused units.

[duz_]

Well as luck would have it we just started a series on reviewing each of guards fast attack options! So Im sure if there's any specifics regarding each of those units you maybe able to get feedback in those focus threads.

 

As for FA in general it depends on what youre hoping to achieve?

If its just unlocking the Brigade detachment maybe 3 cheap scout sentinels is the way to go. For a bit more utility substitute with Hellhounds (or Banewolfs). The Rough Riders aren't terrible either given they can "outflank" and their lances aren't 1 use only any more.

[spafe]

It is to unlock the brigade, and yeah, I can use the 3 scout sents to fil lthat out, but then I have an army of all inf and 3 lame ducks in a row... kinda the same issue with taking the hellhound, and/or the 2 armoured sents. When I repaint my armour to match, yeah I'll happily take them, but when the rest of my force is all manor of inf... there isnt really anything I can take that isnt armour or cav, even looking through krieg, eleysian, inq, mechanicus, priests, or... well anyhting bar power armour to keep pure inf while filling out my fast attack slots.

 

Just kinda annoying. But I guess it's just me whoes finding that, so no worries. I'll either use different detachments so i dont need any fast attack slots, or bite the bullet and fix up the scouts.

[Galron]

Our fast attack if awesome. Scout sents are worth their weight in gold screwing with enemy deep striking in your lines. Hellhounds as well do a great job taking first turn charges and incinerating them or simply denying the area because the enemy doesn't want to get incinerated on the first turn. I cant comment on rough riders since I haven't used or seen them used. But the above two are golden.

[Withershadow]

We went from pretty much no fast attack options worth their salt, to old hoary models like Sentinels and Rough Riders being awesome.

 

Sure some more options would always be nice, but we have no room to complain.

[Halfpint100]

I still want plastic rough riders so i can get some! I really want some but don't have the skills to convert ones i would like the look of

[olcottr]

There are many instances of infantry regiments using organic sentinel units. I don't see anything wrong with including them in an all-infantry army.

[spafe]

Okay, can I try another tack... Yes our choices are good... but if I wanted to run only inf, is there a way to use my fast attack choices? I've tried to find any, but can't, are there any that exist or are my options some form of cav/vehicle only?

 

Also halfpint, depending on the look you are going for, and if you want to keep with GW models only, perry minatures have some lovely cav, some dragoons with rifles, or various lancer options. I think I'll be looking at them when I expand to wanting cav.

 

Edit:

That's not a bad idea olcottr, I hadnt actually thought of that. I may well, although half of why I'm asking is if I have only inf on the table then the anti tank guns of my enemies are wasted... modelling wise though, I will look into some sort of beast riding things as a potential I think.

Edited August 1, 2017 by spafe

[olcottr]

Another way to get those 9 CPs is take 3 Battalions. That comes out to 6 Company Commanders/Lord Commissars and 9 infantry squads. Or if 7 CPs is enough, 2 Battalions and 1 Vanguard Detachment to get the Stormtroopers/Veterans in.  then you would only need 5 CC/LC.  With orders being so good now, taking multiple Detachments, and thus multiple HQs, is not too much of a burden.

[Mitchverr]

Sadly no pure inf FA.

 

Personally I would say if your going for an "infantry force" maybe look to real life history for some assistance in this.

 

The UK and French use light armour to support their infantry since WW2. I would say the sentinel or the Tauros/venator would be ideal in this reguard, kind of like how the AMX-10RC/ERC-90 were used by France in Africa and the middle east or how the Scimitar/Scorpion were used by the british in the Falklands, Afghan and Iraqi conflicts.

 

(just thought I would share this as theres no easy way to do it as you hope for, as i was considering something simular using elysian rules for a "paratrooper/marine" force and using the Tauros as my rapid support and recce troop).

Edited August 1, 2017 by Mitchverr

[Die4Emprah]

I use the DKoK Deathriders for 2(or one), a pair of scout sentinals for the second, and 1-3 Hellhounds for the third. (If I haven't broken up the big Deathrider Posse).

I think they're intentionally limiting out FA choices, to shape our gameplay strategy or trying to force us to outsource to "imperium" keyword.  

[duz_]

You've kind of put yourself inbetween a rock and a hard place tbh.

Infantry by their nature are slow, that's why you use mechanized support or augment them.

There's actually very few pure infantry fast attack options in the game in general. Assault Marines being an exception.

Having said that, if you want to stick to a theme of IG and Infantry what about this?

Grab some Elysians or suitable 3rd party minis convert them to jump pack models (even get some small flying bases) and have them as counts as Rough Riders? They move 10", but get any of the benefits of fly. After all guard generally dont get to play with the really nice things. We don't need that kinda stuff. ;)

[Die4Emprah]

 After all guard generally dont get to play with the really nice things. We don't need that kinda stuff.

 

All we need is wounds, and the ability to take a beating until your opponent loses on his own, or falls out drunk.

[Gloomfoe]

We could use some "jeep" or attack bike equivalents in my opinion

[Kinstryfe]

The obvious solution is to break out the renegades again and run some spawn. :) That aside, we do really need some kind of cheap fast attack solution. I like the idea of Jeeps, trucks, or something else cheap and fast. Even drop troops could be interesting and give an infantry alternative for the slot. As it is, it's the black sheep slot, with really limited options in it :(

[Stylian_StHugh]

We could use some "jeep" or attack bike equivalents in my opinion

Well the Tauros pretty much covers the former, and seen plenty of people convert Rough Riders into bikes.

[Minsc]

My 3 FA choices when I fill up a Brigade Detachment is;

1) 5x DKOK Death Riders. (I'd use Rough Riders if I didn't have Death Riders already.)

2) A Hellhound.
3) A unit of Armoured Sentinels. (Don't own Scouts)

For a pure infantry-army, there sadly isn't any FA-choices.

[mertbl]

I'd like to see some sort of forward observer or recon unit. Super light infantry, camo cloaks and rifles.

[CoffeeGrunt]

Get models on light bikes and use them as Rough Riders, it's what I plan to do. :)

[spafe]

Thanks guys, yeah that was more what I meant by limited, rather than our choices being bad on the table.

 

I like the idea of jeeps/taurox type things, I had also considered some sort of largish 'native' beast being used with spawn rules, or just rough riders (potentially as bikers, I like the eleysians flyers too, phantine style from the ghosts books).

 

Some good ideas, and thanks for letting me know I havent just been blind where the lists are all broken up now (with psykers i none list, priests in another etc) that I havent missed something.

[Plasmablasts]

I think the only Infantry fast attack choice in Index: Imperium 2 is the Seraphim squad. A conversion of Scions with grace-chutes and dual bolt pistols could look rather nice. Edited August 3, 2017 by Plasmablasts

[Commander Cutlet]

If you look at history the answer is clearly rough riders, dragoons (for any nation ) or Australian light horsemen where always considered "mounted infantry" not calvary, you could give your rough riders bayonet equipped Las guns instead of lances (charge of beersheba style)