Optimized Raven Guard Units

[defl0]

So I have enough games with Raven Guard to have a pretty good feel for them at this point. What are you thoughts on top units and combos? 

 

For me so far I really like the following: 

 

1. 6 aggressors w. bolt guantlets

2. 10 thunderhammer / storm shield teminators or vanguard vets

3. 10 scouts with shot guns

4. lascannon devs

5. 5 scouts, snipers, camo, hvy bolter (take one for the hellfire stratagem)

6. 5 scouts, snipers, camo, hvy bolter (take one for the missile launcher) 

7. Dev cents with lascanons and cent launchers

8. aegis defense line or trenches (I've also really liked bastions)

9. scorpius whirlwind and a speeder

10. 3 predators, one as a daemos everythign else with lascannons

11. jump pack librarian with null zone

12. venerable dreadnoughts with twin auto cannon and a captain

13. rievers with grapnel launchers

14. sternguard

15. hell blasters with plasma incinerators

16. storm raven with a leviathan dread and grav flux bombards

17. fire raptor with lascannons

18. shrike

19. chaplain with a jump pack

20. lias isoldon 

 

Roles:

 

A. Anti Horde - For Raven Guard, I think it's pretty hard to beat the value of bolt guantlet aggressors. That said, fire raptors and storm raven really excel at this as well and do well if you go second. I've also found the venerable dreads and sternguard to be really good at this as well. Not nearly as poitn efficient but they can be more dual purpose. 

 

B. Anti Assault - So 10 scouts with shotguns are amazing. You deploy them first, right on you opponents deployment zone edge... It stops an entire turn of movement for most armies. I've also played around with van guard vets and termies. The VV's can be far more flexible with their movement and can recover in from going second and more importantly can assault flyers, but the termies teleporting back into your deploymwnt zone has won me so many games. In either case, they just eat command points, as it's usually worth SftS with them and some character auras and then using 3 command point for them to attack against first turn when they are at strength. 

 

C. Scoring - So at first I thought camo scouts were definitely the way to go. But I'm beginning to come around to mixing a couple tac squads in for rear guard. Camo adds up! I've also had recent luck with small squads of intercessors with stalker bolt rifles. 

 

D. Tank hunting - So this is the real hard question. If you want to use the RG CTs you really only have devs, dev cents, multi melta assault bikes and dread variants. I've found devs to be the most efficient but a little fragile. Taking a bastion helps or a trench. In the end though, I think ven dreads with twin lascanoons are the the best tank hunter Raven Guard have, that use the combat tactics. 

 

Thoughts?

 

 

[autek mor]

for tank hunting what about the forgeworld mortis dread with twin lascannons and additional cyclone missile launcher? thats six anti tank shots a turn and you still benefit from chapter tactics.

[Race Bannon]

for tank hunting what about the forgeworld mortis dread with twin lascannons and additional cyclone missile launcher? thats six anti tank shots a turn and you still benefit from chapter tactics.

Point of order: GW dreads can do that combo too ^_^

[Helscream]

for tank hunting what about the forgeworld mortis dread with twin lascannons and additional cyclone missile launcher? thats six anti tank shots a turn and you still benefit from chapter tactics.

 

A Leviathan Dread with a cyclonic melta lance is probably the best if you can get him into range! Potential 6 shots doing 6 damage each is enough to cripple anything including Knights. Not to mention he has another melta gun and twin heavy flamers if he gets any trouble from charges. 

[SkimaskMohawk]

The Scorpius doesn't benefit from the stratagem since they didn't use the whirlwind keyword in it.

 

It's also not always a good idea to pigeonhole yourself just to benefit from legion / chapter tactics; ravens and Raptors are very good.

 

The shotgun scouts seem pretty bad. Shooting will just scrape them off, and are very likely to give first blood. 9" away from deployment doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things

[defl0]

The Scorpius doesn't benefit from the stratagem since they didn't use the whirlwind keyword in it.

 

It's also not always a good idea to pigeonhole yourself just to benefit from legion / chapter tactics; ravens and Raptors are very good.

 

The shotgun scouts seem pretty bad. Shooting will just scrape them off, and are very likely to give first blood. 9" away from deployment doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of thing

True. But  the scorpius whirlwind is still a whirlwind. If it was <relic scropius whirlwind> for example you might have a point. But it's not based on keywords, so it's far less strict. I would expect this to be FAQ'd though. Same thing with kill shot and forgeworld predators. 

 

As for the scouts, they are really game winning if used correctly in deployment. They are like servo skulls last edition. You are likely to give up first blood / first strike, but it's pretty hard not to give that up with infantry based RG anyway if you go second. But forcing push back really screws with a lot of armies. It also combos well with SftS, as you lock your enemy into their deployment zone for an extra turn. It also lets you have mid field control, which is enormous for Space Marines. All their best weapons are mid range and want to central. 

 

The way scouts deploy is one of the more powerful rules in the game and very few units can do it. 

[defl0]

for tank hunting what about the forgeworld mortis dread with twin lascannons and additional cyclone missile launcher? thats six anti tank shots a turn and you still benefit from chapter tactics.

Yeah. The Mortis contemptor is very good as well. You get a lot of the minor cost increase bwteeen the two platforms. Contemptors get 2 wounds and 5+ save but end up with a depreciation wound table.... So the contemptors stay on the board longer but end up shooting less effectively. 

[SkimaskMohawk]

If whirlwind was used as a keyword I'd agree with you. Currently it isn't bolded so it's just talking the whirlwind entry.

 

For the scouts, you're not locking them into a deployment zone. Purely with their natural rules you have to be 9" away from one; most units don't move 9" and the ones that do, fly. People can just move up, shoot and assault them, and then use pile in and consolidate for extra movement.

 

Also, you can establish midfield control with actual midfield weapons with any other infantry unit in a RG list because of SftS.

[Damo1701]

The Scorpius doesn't benefit from the stratagem since they didn't use the whirlwind keyword in it.

 

It's also not always a good idea to pigeonhole yourself just to benefit from legion / chapter tactics; ravens and Raptors are very good.

 

The shotgun scouts seem pretty bad. Shooting will just scrape them off, and are very likely to give first blood. 9" away from deployment doesn't mean much in the grand scheme of things

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/Relic-Datalink-Telemetry-2017

 

I'd allow relic units to use the Datalink Telemetry stratagem... FW obviously agrees.. .

[SkimaskMohawk]

I wouldn't until they FAQ it to be the whirlwind keyword. There's absolutely no reason they couldn't have bolded whirlwind like they did the land speeder.

 

When/if they do it'll be auto include. The Scorpius is one of the most over powered unit in the game already

[Noxnoctis22]

So with that both Whirlwind Hyperois and Relic Whirlwind Scorpius could benefit from that...

 

So could a Land Speeder Tempest and Relic Javelin Land Speeder work for the "Land Speeder" side of things as well?

[Race Bannon]

The Land Speeder Tempest has both "Land Speeder" and "Land Speeder Tempest" as keywords ^_^

[Noxnoctis22]

Also the Relic Javelin Land Speeder has the rule...

 

Gravitic Augur Haze: Your opponent subtract 1 from all hit rolls made for models that target at ranges greater than 8".

 

So does the stack with the RG Chapter Tactic for -2 to hit rolls???

 

 

NEVERMIND....damn vehicles...

Edited August 7, 2017 by Noxnoctis22

[duz_]

With the RG stratagems and CT there is a great number of combinations we can make

 

I don't think there will be a "core" build per say which is the awesome thing about this addition

 

I think the biggest point is make a balanced, well rounded and supported list

ie You'll need to take anti tank and anti horde, you'll probably want to have something that will take care of medium / heavy multi wound infantry too

If youre taking a lot of static back field units, youll need screens or forward placed units to give them breathing space

 

Which is great and it looks like you have plenty of units to play with, none of which I would consider unplayable in this edition! 

[Race Bannon]

I agree.  Yet, there are some ... less-than-reasonable (?) choices emerging: Devastator Centurions (cost) and Assault Squads (capability) top the list in my current perceptions.  I have yet to use either so I can't say my judgment is qualified.

[MajorNese]

I agree.  Yet, there are some ... less-than-reasonable (?) choices emerging: Devastator Centurions (cost) and Assault Squads (capability) top the list in my current perceptions.  I have yet to use either so I can't say my judgment is qualified.

Have used a fully kitted assault squad quite a few times, as it's fixed in my local campaign army (all list additions are fixed once submitted). DSing with a jump captain and overcharging against a single HVT, they do considerable damage. The movement range enables them to harass units all around, plasma enables them to damage anything until the squad is dead. They do attract too much fire by this, and usually die soon, unless backed up with more DS units. I'm currently adding reivers, as they offer longer ranged shooting, have the same number of attacks, but at 4ppm more than an assaulter, they have twice the wounds, though they are slower. Might add a second full assault squad to capitalize on the breach they create, but currently lacking the time to build them.