HH Book 47: Old Earth

[Marshal Loss]

 

(including possibly taking on/semi-winning against 3 other Primarchs at once and multiple bloodthirsters as well),

 

Yeah, no thanks. That would be ridiculous.

 

You don't need to throw absurd numbers of super powerful beings at Sanguinius to make his stand at the Eternity Gate a highlight of the series.

[Calas Typhon]

 

Are the Salamanders with Vulkan on Terra?

 

 

The three who accompanied him are. The others are all still either on Nocturne or scattered throughout the wider conflict.

 

 

That is really bloody unfortunate. I doubt they will get a good show now unless we see some homeworld invasions from Xenos. 

[JH79]

Given that this title has been out for some time now I'm going to forego the use of spoilers, so anyone who hasn't read this yet turn back now! 

 

So I'm wondering if anyone else noticed something very specific happen during Vulkan's battle with the Nurgle Daemon in the closing chapters of this book? Vulkan is basically getting his ass handed to him at the hands of the daemon and is eventually eaten whole... using the power of the 7 hammered Talisman that Vulkan created under The Emperor's guidance he is able to defeat the Daemon in a way I've not seen or heard of before. It was described as real death, as in really real. Not just bullet to the head and douch bag daemon of the week is back in the Warp for a few years ready to manifest once again. Really, really, really dead.

 

I found this fascinating as i thought it was impossible to truly kill daemons in the 40k universe. In reality this concept of a daemon being killed is something i secretly hoped to witness in Master of Mankind but that book played out very differently to how i imagined it would.

 

So how did everyone else find this scene, has this concept been covered before? Am I just massively late to the party and this is a thing that everyone knows about but doesn't really mention?

 

It makes me wonder what would happen if the Talisman were to detonate The Golden Throne should The Emperor remove himself or be removed from it. I'd like to think it's manifest power, held in for these past 10k years, would resonate outward through the Warp and literally destroy everything it touched, push back the great rift and maybe even one of the big four. We'll probably never know but it's always nice to speculate 

[Mellow]

I believe it was a doomsday device intended to do a “scorched earth” to deny Terra ending up in the hands of Chaos.

 

Winning by denying them the homeworld. But obviously just an act of spite really as it wouldn’t help Humanity in the rest of the Galaxy.

[Moonreaper666]

I believe it was a doomsday device intended to do a “scorched earth” to deny Terra ending up in the hands of Chaos.

 

Winning by denying them the homeworld. But obviously just an act of spite really as it wouldn’t help Humanity in the rest of the Galaxy.

 

Wouldn't the destruction of Terra basically doomed the Imperium?

 

 

-God-Emperor would die in the explosion along with the Astronomican

 

-Dorn, Vulkan, Sigismund and Khan would be dead

 

(If a weapon is powerful enough to obliterate a planet and permanently kill Daemons, it could also kill Perpetuals for good)

 

-Same with the Founders of the Inquisition and some Knight-Errants

 

 

-The Chaos Gods would simply teleport the Traitor Primarchs and other important people from Terra right before it explodes

 

-Magnus could easily teleport the Thousand Sons and some other Chaos Astartes off the planet as well

 

-Same with Fulgrim and Kairos as well as the Dark Mechanicum

 

 

-A Warp Rift (Remember the Webway Breach?) might appear and screw up the Solar System even more

 

 

-Without the Astronomican, the Loyalists would be picked off piece by piece

 

(Don't forget that the Ruinstorm is still occuring)

 

-Both Traitors and Loyalists will be rebuilding their forces but Horus now has the Logistics and Speed advantage

 

 

-The Void Dragon might awaken!

 

 

After Warmaster Horus conquers the Imperium he would attack the Eldar Craftworlds and Trazyn's Tomb World

 

 

-Post-Molech Horus was so powerful that not even Eldrad and the Phoenix Lords could beat him together!

 

 

Given that this title has been out for some time now I'm going to forego the use of spoilers, so anyone who hasn't read this yet turn back now!

 

So I'm wondering if anyone else noticed something very specific happen during Vulkan's battle with the Nurgle Daemon in the closing chapters of this book? Vulkan is basically getting his ass handed to him at the hands of the daemon and is eventually eaten whole... using the power of the 7 hammered Talisman that Vulkan created under The Emperor's guidance he is able to defeat the Daemon in a way I've not seen or heard of before. It was described as real death, as in really real. Not just bullet to the head and douch bag daemon of the week is back in the Warp for a few years ready to manifest once again. Really, really, really dead.

 

I found this fascinating as i thought it was impossible to truly kill daemons in the 40k universe. In reality this concept of a daemon being killed is something i secretly hoped to witness in Master of Mankind but that book played out very differently to how i imagined it would.

 

So how did everyone else find this scene, has this concept been covered before? Am I just massively late to the party and this is a thing that everyone knows about but doesn't really mention?

 

It makes me wonder what would happen if the Talisman were to detonate The Golden Throne should The Emperor remove himself or be removed from it. I'd like to think it's manifest power, held in for these past 10k years, would resonate outward through the Warp and literally destroy everything it touched, push back the great rift and maybe even one of the big four. We'll probably never know but it's always nice to speculate

Only five Daemons in Warhammer history have received a True Death

[Tymell]

 

I believe it was a doomsday device intended to do a “scorched earth” to deny Terra ending up in the hands of Chaos.

 

Winning by denying them the homeworld. But obviously just an act of spite really as it wouldn’t help Humanity in the rest of the Galaxy.

 

Wouldn't the destruction of Terra basically doomed the Imperium?

 

 

I think that's the point: doom it to stop it falling into Horus' hands.

[Mellow]

Indeed. Hence why Malcador was seen not looking happy with the decision to plug it in. Can’t remember the scene exactly and his words were muted so no one could hear him.

[Calas Typhon]

 

Wouldn't the destruction of Terra basically doomed the Imperium?

 

The Imperium would destroy itself, rather than being used as a form of slavery for the forces of Chaos, which would not be an ideal endgame for the Emperor and humanity if that was what he was going for. 

 

Basically it is a quick burnout button like setting fire to a piece of paper, rather than the imperium just eroding like it is in 40K.

[drooling blood]

Yes its stupid, but so is the BL leadership. The High lords? The lords of drivel.

Theyve spent so long fething around, so they could insert Guilliman and his unnecessary empire. Its been to the detriment to the damn story. Now its rush rush rush.

A magical maguffin that the emp, force made some other dude to mystery make. Now hes :cussed it. they f'ed around to much selling Guillimans bit part.

Screw these guys

[Fire Golem]

Yes its stupid, but so is the BL leadership. The High lords? The lords of drivel.

Theyve spent so long fething around, so they could insert Guilliman and his unnecessary empire. Its been to the detriment to the damn story. Now its rush rush rush.

A magical maguffin that the emp, force made some other dude to mystery make. Now hes :cuss it. they f'ed around to much selling Guillimans bit part.

Screw these guys

There’s like 4 imperium secundus books out of nearly 50 books.

[Tymell]

 

Yes its stupid, but so is the BL leadership. The High lords? The lords of drivel.

Theyve spent so long fething around, so they could insert Guilliman and his unnecessary empire. Its been to the detriment to the damn story. Now its rush rush rush.

A magical maguffin that the emp, force made some other dude to mystery make. Now hes it. they f'ed around to much selling Guillimans bit part.

Screw these guys

There’s lie 4 imperium secundus books out of nearly 50 books.

 

 

Indeed, not even that, the only real Imperium Secundus books are Unremembered Empire, Pharos and half of Angels of Caliban.

 

Drooling blood might not put it very tactfully, but I know he's not alone in feeling that IS got quite a bit of attention. I think maybe part of the reason for that is not so much the number of books focused on it, but rather when they came out. The Secundus arc pretty much ran from late 2013 through to mid-2016, which is right when the full novels became rarer, short stories and limited edition novellas took centre-stage, etc. The "real world" Age of Darkness for the series, in a way :p Maybe it being the focus at that time exacerbated the problem.

[GAZ_AV_NZ]

I enjoyed the book

As a dark eldar player loved the web link from nocturne to aldenrach

At the bottom of Commorah

 

Who was the other Hero Eldrad saw in his vision fighting and losing against the Daemons

Vulkan and ?? The Khan?

His vision is after Manus death so was someone else perhaps

 

Was wondering if at the end of the Heresy perhaps they go wandering in the webway?

 

I'm thinking Eldrad seals the portal after Horus death

When he does that perhaps vulkan goes wandering after talking to him? Maybe the Khan joins him or goes looking for him

Will be interesting to see

Eldrad check the portal in beast arises

 

Terminus decree was confirmed

As being that medallion he made in the Golden Throne as noted

Wasn't clear what it kills

All life? All buildings?

Vukans vision was a bit general

[Mellow]

It destroys Holy Terra in psychic fire.

 

Not one for doing things by halves The Emperor

[Rob P]

This book left me so frustrated.

Firstly, the book is used to tie up some loose ends. It ties up 2 major strands of the Horus Heresy, but neither of them justified there own novel and they didn't really come across well in this book at all. It was a bit like in the last season of Game of Thrones where they have to move events along rapidly (usually killing a bunch of characters off) to get the story on track. Also, like The Phantom Menace, albeit the conclusion rather than the start of a trilogy, this book simply does not work on it's own. None of the plots half any element of independence; compare with Path of Heaven which is a continuation and a self-contained story.

Secondly, the A-plot is actually the B-plot. The B-plot (which really should be the A-plot) ends too early and is dealt with in a way that is completely dissatisfying (not necessarily the event, but the way it is written). The B-plot also have awful characters. It has two distinct characters which are developed so unevenly it hurts and it has an extended cast of characters that are entirely interchangeable and forgettable.
The A-plot lacks meat - very little happens until then end of the book. The C-plot just feels tacked on and is just a cleaning up exercise.

Thirdly, the writing is frustrating. As I said earlier, I actually really enjoyed the last few chapters, but prior to that I felt that there was little drama or suspense. The chapters didn't whet my appetite for the next chapter. There was too much bolter porn which was entirely pedestrian. The characters were boring and uneven. The author used 'occlude' too much in the first half.

Under the surface there was a hint at some really cool things that just didn't materialise properly e.g. betrayal; repeating the sins of the father; foreshadowing of 40k; the epic conclusion of an arc with non-primarch characters; and the hint at a new sub-plot.

The last couple of chapters were really good in terms of character, plot and intrigue. The writing was not half bad either. I wanted to keep reading.

[Fedor]

It seems that after the large faction of the Iron Hands betrayed Meduson left the battlefield that they were essentially committing an act of secession with the imperium. That they are going back to Medusa to wait things out rather than continue with the loyalist war effort.

 

I'm surprised i've not seen more discussion about this on the net, it's almost as if the Iron Hands have been given a chunk of the old Dark Angels "wait to see who was going to win" thing that Thorpe really stoked in Angels of Darkness. Should have purged the lot of them in the Scouring.

[Manchu warlord]

I am most interested to know more about Narek's plan to assassinate Lorgar.  I hope he doesn't fail...

[Indefragable]

It seems that after the large faction of the Iron Hands betrayed Meduson left the battlefield that they were essentially committing an act of secession with the imperium. That they are going back to Medusa to wait things out rather than continue with the loyalist war effort.

 

I'm surprised i've not seen more discussion about this on the net, it's almost as if the Iron Hands have been given a chunk of the old Dark Angels "wait to see who was going to win" thing that Thorpe really stoked in Angels of Darkness. Should have purged the lot of them in the Scouring.

 

Yea that seems really strange. Between that and Ferrus' less-than-impressive showing in his own :cuss -ing Primarchs novel it's like BL decided they need a Loyalist d-bag fall guy. Enter Ferrus + the Iron Hands who still don't have a character model into 8th edition.

[bluntblade]

It seems that after the large faction of the Iron Hands betrayed Meduson left the battlefield that they were essentially committing an act of secession with the imperium. That they are going back to Medusa to wait things out rather than continue with the loyalist war effort.

 

I'm surprised i've not seen more discussion about this on the net, it's almost as if the Iron Hands have been given a chunk of the old Dark Angels "wait to see who was going to win" thing that Thorpe really stoked in Angels of Darkness. Should have purged the lot of them in the Scouring.

From Hand Elect they were indeed. Wraight did make that an interesting prospect, but I feel the potential was squandered.