Overwatch in 8th?

[01RTB01]

Hi folks,

 

By my understanding, in 8th ed overwatch happens when a charge is declared.

 

Let's say unit A is 9" away from unit B that purely has 8" range weaponry. Would I be right that the charged unit wouldn't be able to fire unless the charging unit was 8" away or closer to start with?

 

Thanks in advance! (Seems a very simple question but man flu requires confirmation!)

[Ciler]

This should really go in the rule section, but otherwise yes : if unit A declares a charge against B, unit A is 9" away and unit B's weapons have a range of 8" they cannot fire overwatch.

 

Overwatch is resolved like a normal
shooting attack (albeit one resolved in the enemy’s Charge
phase) and uses all the normal rules except that a 6 is
always required for a successful hit roll, irrespective of the
firing model’s Ballistic Skill or any modifiers.

Range is one of the "normal rules", so there you go.

[Mileposter]

It really turns players who've assumed Overwatch works like 7th (all weapons can fire equally in Overwatch), and who've loaded units up with flamers, on their head when you point this out to them.

 

Before the game, of course.

[the jeske]

A test stuff before you model it. B try to get the rules before time so you can read them, before you start building/rebuilding your models. C flamers were almost never a good weapon, and the good ones never actualy worked like real flamers. D if not 100% sure, and I think no one ever is, talk to other people before changing arment on models, if you talk to enough people with insight there is a good chance that you will get a good idea what weapons/units/armies are ok, bad, good etc.

[sockwithaticket]

 

But the unit gets closer as it charges, not further away!

So, because unit A starts out of range, unit B just collectively shrug their shoulders and don't shoot once it comes into range?

If so that is highly counter-intuitive.

[Ciler]

 

 

But the unit gets closer as it charges, not further away!

 

So, because unit A starts out of range, unit B just collectively shrug their shoulders and don't shoot once it comes into range?

 

If so that is highly counter-intuitive.

Yep. But it helps keeping the rules simple and honestly it's better to have rules that are simple than rules that are physically accurate or "realistic" (if you can't have both).

 

By the same token, you can charge a unit that you can't see but they can't overwatch back because they have no line of sight.

[sockwithaticket]

 

 

 

But the unit gets closer as it charges, not further away!

 

So, because unit A starts out of range, unit B just collectively shrug their shoulders and don't shoot once it comes into range?

 

If so that is highly counter-intuitive.

Yep. But it helps keeping the rules simple and honestly it's better to have rules that are simple than rules that are physically accurate or "realistic" (if you can't have both).

 

By the same token, you can charge a unit that you can't see but they can't overwatch back because they have no line of sight.

 

Surely a simpler and less daft way to do it would be: if a unit finishes it's charge within range of the target unit's weapons, then it is subject to Overwatch from the target unit.

 

Charging stuff you can't see is very stupid for most units but would be a cool, fluffy ability for others.

[Ciler]

Except that a charge ALWAYS finishes in range, since it finishes within 1"... if it succeeds. And that's the point, if a unit fails a charge roll, it doesn't move. So it's the initial position that has to be accounted for, not the final one.

Edited August 18, 2017 by Ciler

[Ashe Darke]

Another important point is that you need to see to overwatch as well. So if you are trying charge through LOS blocking ruins then you can't be overwatched.

[sockwithaticket]

I don't see the problem?

A successful charge which brings them into range sees them get shot at.

A failed* charge where they don't move and thus never go into range means they don't get shot at.  *I don't feel great about saying something failed when it never happened, unless we're expected to imagine that they start charging, but return to their original position rather then never moving at all.

If those are the mechanics, then they are what they are, clearly it's best that I stick to just painting.

[Eddie Orlock]

Just want to remind the participants in this thread that the OR isn't a place to develop tactics or wish-list on what we feel the rules should be. We have a tactica and a homegrown section for those respectively.

[sockwithaticket]

Sorry, mod. It started off in Amicus and I didn't notice the sub-forum switch.