Drop Pods. Worth it?

[Stemplar]

Apologies if this has already been raised elsewhere.

 

I used to love drop pods but with the points they cost and what they offer I just don't know if they're worth it.

 

Coming in at the end of the movement phase means whatever is in there has to disembark and be shot at before they can do anything. As opposed to any vehicle where they can get out, then move, shoot and charge.

 

I'm new at this, though, and not real smart. So, am I missing something? Or are drop pods off the list now?

[Aegir_Einarsson]

They cannot move but can shoot And charge

[Honda]

Consider these differences now:

 

1. Coming in at the end of the movement turn means the occupants are unable to move. Not so good.

2. However, now you can charge after landing AND heavy weapons can contribute to your shooting. Great!

3. Costs points/PL to do this: Not so big a deal. Last edition, unless you were taking a Gladius formation, pods still cost you.

4. Cheaper than SR's when moving the same number of bodies and faster than ground transport. Good

5. Can't carry dreads anymore unless you take the FW version. REALLY BAD

 

So, depending on what you want to do, pods can effect your plan positively or negatively.

[Ciler]

I like a shooty unit in a pod to punish deploying a character with bubble wrap only in the front and as a diversion or to contest an objective.

[Brother Talarian]

As Clier said, I'll be using pods mostly for shooty units to deploy on flanks to take down targets, as well as take an objective. You can also take some CC units or a mix and mash if you really want. They might not have a place in a competitive list, but for a fun and fluffy... yes.

[Marshal_Roujakis]

I think the biggest difference with Pods now in comparison w/ the older version is that they cannot carry Dreadnoughts, and that you can't have more than 50% of your army embarked in them in matched play...

 

I don't understand why they restricted the 1st part... especially since it has been done since 4th edition BT...  but the 2nd part is probably due to cheese spam lists of Pods with Plasma and Melta... the massive 70 pts. price increase is nothing to scoff at as well, this makes Drop Pods less appealing than cheaper more potent alternatives... (Rhinos with 2 Storm Bolters might be slower, but they dish out anti-infantry damage if not bogged down...) and since Dreads aren't allowed in Pods anymore, then your infantry will be left very vulnerable and a much more viable squishy target for enemy guns unless you can drive up or drop in something much more terrifying or important for him to shoot...

 

Drop Pods lessened their flare for me tactic-wise, their one-two punch with Dreadnoughts and Crusaders/Veterans was hit hard w/ 8th, mainly because Dreads can no longer be embarked on them, and Dreads provided a target magnet for the enemy when they arrive... the removal of scatter will help your infantry when they disembark and shoot/charge, but the lack of a Dreeadnought means that if they can't get into melee during their turn of arrival, then they will be literally be a one-trick pony...

[Acebaur]

I think they are worth it, especially because you can stuff multiple units in them now, which is great because something like a devastator squad can ride with something more choppy to back it up, plus characters etc. Furthermore there is no scatter anymore, so something that you need to get in MM range or charge range is doable now. 

 

Also, the FW dread isn't that much more expensive points wise and I seriously doubt anyone would care if you don't have the model.

[Timur]

The loss of taking my Ironclad in a pod has made me unable to see droppods as a unit entry through my own tears.=(

 

I think they still work for sticking shooty units in random places on the battlefield if that's your bag.  In fact good luck using a melta/MM without deepstrike.

Acebaur has a good point on stuffing 2 different units in there. Going shooty/shooty, shooty/choppy, shooty/troops seems reasonable.

 

I also suspect the change to deepstike, such as JP units being able to "drop" accurately, has made us view pods differently.

 

How bout Black Templars?  You all could drop crusader squads all over ppl. with a good chance to get into CC that turn.  I haven't faced it yet, but It seems a way to do a drop heavy army now.

[Quixus]

5. Can't carry dreads anymore unless you take the FW version. REALLY BAD

What's so bad about the Lucius pattern drop pod? Sure you can't hide in it anymore, but why woudl you want to? You can shoot and charge right away.

 

I think the biggest difference with Pods now in comparison w/ the older version is that they cannot carry Dreadnoughts, and that you can't have more than 50% of your army embarked in them in matched play...

Not quite. You cannot have more than half of your units in reserve in matched play. A drop pod, an infantry unit and a character is three units already.

Edited August 26, 2017 by Quixus

[Ciler]

You can also put two 5 man devastator squads. 8 grav canons are nothing to scoff at.

[SydonianDragoon404]

You could also opt for the close range option and go for multi meltas, you'll be able to get them into melta range from a drop pod. Expensive and hits on 4s, but is it worth it? 

[Stemplar]

I think they are worth it, especially because you can stuff multiple units in them now, which is great because something like a devastator squad can ride with something more choppy to back it up, plus characters etc. Furthermore there is no scatter anymore, so something that you need to get in MM range or charge range is doable now.

 

Also, the FW dread isn't that much more expensive points wise and I seriously doubt anyone would care if you don't have the model.

I like the idea of dropping one standard pod in with a squad (or 2 5 man squads) and one FW pod with a dread. Both hitting at the same time. Split the attention of the enemy, increase chances of at least 1 unit making the charge. Nice.

[Ebon Hand]

Double deep strikes are the way to go. With our chapter tactics and command reroll, the chances of making the charge are around the 50% area, so if you need a target locked down, bringing two units makes it much more reliable. If one of them fails the charge, you have a counter charge in position in case they counter charged you.

 

It's even better if your deepstrikers come down in positions to screen your vehicles or provide no drop zones on your flanks as you advance.

 

This applies to any drops, but in the case of drop pods, be aware that they can physically impede enemy line of sight but also provide an assault target for the enemy to get up the field.

 

Something I've been wondering... does anyone have experience using the Deathstorm drop pods?

Edited August 28, 2017 by Ebon Hand

[Quixus]

This applies to any drops, but in the case of drop pods, be aware that they can physically impede enemy line of sight but also provide an assault target for the enemy to get up the field.

Has there been any clarification how the doors are supposed to be handled in this edition?

[Ebon Hand]

I think it's safe to assume it's the common sense way (ignore the doors, measure from hull), but it hasn't been addressed. Let's hope that silliness stays buried as a footnote in the history of 7th.

[Ciler]

The designer FaQ has a relevant entry :

 

Q: When a model does not have a base, as is the
case with many vehicles, what exactly is the ‘hull’ of
the model?
A: The hull of these models refers to the main body of
the model. It does not include things such as turrets,
sponsons, aerials, banners, spikes etc. If there is
still doubt, we recommend both players agree about
what constitutes the hull of such models before the
battle begins.

I think the petals of the pod are clearly not to be considered part of the hull.

 

As for the issue of LoS, basic rules apply, so if someone has a fully closed pod, it does block LoS, i guess.

[Quixus]

The designer FaQ has a relevant entry :

Q: When a model does not have a base, as is the

case with many vehicles, what exactly is the ‘hull’ of

the model?

A: The hull of these models refers to the main body of

the model. It does not include things such as turrets,

sponsons, aerials, banners, spikes etc. If there is

still doubt, we recommend both players agree about

what constitutes the hull of such models before the

battle begins.

I think the petals of the pod are clearly not to be considered part of the hull.

 

I don't read it that way. It definitely is not clear. Without the "petals" there wouldn't really be a hull just 5 struts a bottom and a top.

 

As for the issue of LoS, basic rules apply, so if someone has a fully closed pod, it does block LoS, i guess.

So what happens if you model your rhinos or stormravens with open side doors or front and back hatches? Can you (or your enemy ) shoot through it?

[Ebon Hand]

 

The designer FaQ has a relevant entry :

Q: When a model does not have a base, as is the

case with many vehicles, what exactly is the ‘hull’ of

the model?

A: The hull of these models refers to the main body of

the model. It does not include things such as turrets,

sponsons, aerials, banners, spikes etc. If there is

still doubt, we recommend both players agree about

what constitutes the hull of such models before the

battle begins.

I think the petals of the pod are clearly not to be considered part of the hull.

I don't read it that way. It definitely is not clear. Without the "petals" there wouldn't really be a hull just 5 struts a bottom and a top.

As for the issue of LoS, basic rules apply, so if someone has a fully closed pod, it does block LoS, i guess.

So what happens if you model your rhinos or stormravens with open side doors or front and back hatches? Can you (or your enemy ) shoot through it?

It's for you and your opponent to decide before the match. The FAQ is crystal clear on that. If you want to play with drop pods have a gigantic footprint including the doors, be prepared to have no place to put it as every door would need to be 9 inches away from the enemy. It's only an issue if you make it one.

[Honda]

Ciler, on 28 Aug 2017 - 1:27 PM, said:http://bolterandchainsword.com//public/style_images/carbon_red/snapback.png

The designer FaQ has a relevant entry :

Quote

Q: When a model does not have a base, as is the

case with many vehicles, what exactly is the ‘hull’ of

the model?

A: The hull of these models refers to the main body of

the model. It does not include things such as turrets,

sponsons, aerials, banners, spikes etc. If there is

still doubt, we recommend both players agree about

what constitutes the hull of such models before the

battle begins.

I think the petals of the pod are clearly not to be considered part of the hull.

 

I don't read it that way. It definitely is not clear. Without the "petals" there wouldn't really be a hull just 5 struts a bottom and a top.

 

Ciler, on 28 Aug 2017 - 1:27 PM, said:http://bolterandchainsword.com//public/style_images/carbon_red/snapback.png

As for the issue of LoS, basic rules apply, so if someone has a fully closed pod, it does block LoS, i guess.

So what happens if you model your rhinos or stormravens with open side doors or front and back hatches? Can you (or your enemy ) shoot through it?

 

 

MOD  VOICE: Do not  look for ways to be argumentative. That isn't engaging in a discussion and isn't appreciated by anyone.

[Marshal_Roujakis]

In regards to FW Drop Pods, what is their size in comparison to the standard GW Drop Pod? I've got a decent split of 8 Standard Pods w/ harnesses and 4 without for Dreadnoughts for 7th ed... I'll be somewhat annoyed if I can't even proxy those pods for FW Dreadnougth Pods, as it means I have to purchase further number of FW Drop Pods... or I can just put Missile Launchers/Assault Cannons in them and pretend they were Deathwind...

[Ciler]

So what happens if you model your rhinos or stormravens with open side doors or front and back hatches? Can you (or your enemy ) shoot through it?

I would say so yes.

[Stemplar]

In regards to FW Drop Pods, what is their size in comparison to the standard GW Drop Pod? I've got a decent split of 8 Standard Pods w/ harnesses and 4 without for Dreadnoughts for 7th ed... I'll be somewhat annoyed if I can't even proxy those pods for FW Dreadnougth Pods, as it means I have to purchase further number of FW Drop Pods... or I can just put Missile Launchers/Assault Cannons in them and pretend they were Deathwind...

Wondering the same thing. I'm planning to drop into the local GW tomorrow to ask some questions.

[Ciler]

They're not that much bigger, actually.

 

Funny enough though I do not seem to be able to find the dread pod on the FW site.

[Brother Christopher]

In regards to FW Drop Pods, what is their size in comparison to the standard GW Drop Pod?

 

I've been wondering about this some time ago myself. Maybe this or this will answer your question.

 

A real shame GW decided to remove the option to transport other units than regular Marines. With the increased point cost, I really can't justify the give or take 100 points for a deep strike ability, especially that there are other relatively cheap units who get it for free, or the Raven Guard get it for 1 CP and not 100 points. There is also no unit worth 100 point tax, too.

 

The most apparent options are Devatators with shorter-range weapons, like grav or melta (who suffer a -1 to hit modifier on the vital turn they arrive and are probably later left exposed to enemy fire) or Sternguard vets. Pods need either a cost reduction or a special rule of some sort.

Edited August 29, 2017 by Brother Cristopher

[Aegir_Einarsson]

Pure BT asaide... you can take tempestus command squad for less points cost And Also 4 meltas in allied imperium detachement. Also suicidal squad but cheaper. Edited August 29, 2017 by Aegir_Einarsson