Salamanders successors question

[nusphigor]

Hi all.

 

I am trying to create a chapter of my own and sallies as a parent chapter sounds nice.

So, i wanted to ask you if there is any do and don'ts for vulkans offspring lorewise. Or if you have any tips on general strong attitudes of the sons of vulkan's heirs.

 

Thank you

[Carlson793]

The biggest don't, I think, is 'Don't name them after anything that directly and obviously connects them to the Salamanders'. The XVIIIth post-Isstvan had such low numbers, and the missions they undertake have kept them on the fine line of maintaining those numbers, that they have never produced a known successor chapter. The two 'successors' are only suspected because of certain shared qualities, and their names tie them to those qualities rather than the Salamanders (Black Dragons: use of flamers; Storm Giants: larger physique). 

So avoid names like Sons of Vulkan, Nocturne's Flame, and the like.

Also, don't give them obvious physical characteristics that are unique to the Salamanders. No glowing eyes. No onyx skin.

 

The key thing to a Salamanders successor is that there's a mystery to their origin.

"You know, Frank, those new Astartes remind me of the Salamanders."
"What're you talking about? They look nothing like the Salamanders."

"I know, but look at how that one's using that flamer. Salamanders are known for using flamers."
"So are the Fire Hawks, you twit! Now shut up and get back to shooting Orks!"

[nusphigor]

so the best wayto portray the sons of vulkan is to not be direct or obvious?
that is strange...

thanks mate

[The_son_of_Dorn]

To a degree. Something like "the red anvils" with the 1st company sporting dragonesque parent chapter master crafted (salamander standard) weaponry.

 

A subtle appproach.

[Ogun]

Creating a more obvious Salamanders successor is actually a little easier than it was a few months back. GW have confirmed that every one of the loyal First Founding have at least one new Ultima founding successor. A lot of the Primaris were actually taken not that long after the Heresy, so at least a good proportion of Salamander Primaris are Nocturne born and bred. You can now create a successor that cleaves far more closely to the original Salamanders if you so desire. Only restriction is that it will need to be a Primaris only force (unless GW go and reveal they can recruit standard marines as well). 

 

You could paint some ebon skin and glowing red eyes for a non-Ultima successor if you wanted, but it is probably best to keep it limited. It is a melanchromic organ malfunction that reacts with high radiation. As far as we know any marine with Vulkan's geneseed will gain those traits if exposed to enough radiation. It would perhaps be a little odd if the entire chapter had it though. 

 

There are probably other pre-Ultima Salamander successors out there. Chapters are usually founded from the geneseed stocks on Terra, as a result other successors are less likely to exhibit cultural traits associated with the Promethean cult, i.e. the whole pyromania thing. In fact there is a good chance that some are convinced that they successors to a different chapter.

A Salamander successor would probably exhibit a higher degree of affinity for technology, so Terminators, dreads and thunderfires are good. They also have a preference for boots on the ground. 

Other than that the world is your oyster!

[nusphigor]

thank you guys!
i went with ultras successor in the end, but i really appreciate your thoughts on the matter as they were very helpful for me to take that decision. I didn't like some of the traits the sons of vulkan exhibit in their nature, to be honest :/

[Brother Captain Firelupus]

My Chapter the Flame wolves are a 4th founding chapter using Salamander geneseed, but share no ties with the chapter. There would have been chapters founded with Vulcans genes, but they do not act like a legion. Unlike the other gene lines  such as the Fists and Blood/Dark Angels.

 

Hope this helps.

[Saxxon the Dragoon]

My chapter, The Dragoons (Gothic sector, well and away from Nocturne) is a Salamanders successor chapter of unknown founding, oldest records go back to M36. Red eyes (but not black skin, since the black skin comes from the planet nocturne's radiation). Lots of flame and dragon iconography, but also angelic symbols and such for HQ and upper echelon elements in the chapter. Main symbol for the chapter is a Dragon's head with feathered wings, and a heavy penchant for the use of plasma weapons. I plan on reposting my chapter's lore in the future so that might give you an idea (though lore nerds might get a little miffed at the idea of there being salamanders successors). But if you are going for a full Primaris army, you can easily make the claim of the army being of the ultima founding.

 

But yeah, the Salamanders chapter tends to have few, if any successor chapters when large successor foundings are created because of the combat doctrine of the salamanders. They actively go out of their way to avoid imperial casualties and will fight to protect imperial positions when other chapters would either leave them behind or destroy them if it means the objective is secured. Salamanders are the most 'Human' (or more to say they hold onto their humanity compared to other chapters) of space marine chapters, and because of their mercy and empathy to protect humanity instead of causing collateral damage to secure an objective.

 

Salamanders also are one of the few (if not the only chapter) of Astartes that works in and around its civilian populace. Most other chapters keep as far away from civilization, and humans as possible, only interacting with them when its time to recruit or deal with an invasion. Salamanders on the other hand live next to their tribes and while they dont have families, they still keep in touch with their tribal families. Its common to see Salamanders (unarmored) walking around with the civilian populace on nocturne.

 

But because of their high casualty rate, as well as smaller than standard chapter size (Salamander's chapter only has 7 companies as compared to the standard 10 companies of other astartes chapters) usually means that the chapter is usually under less than full strength the majority of the time and often cant spare the geneseed or the marines to take part in the massive foundings. So you might want to work something similar into the chapter doctrine for your own chapter, like fewer companies but the companies are much larger than normal Codex Astartes doctrine.

 

Also making changes and changing interpretations of the Promethium Cult is another way you can help set your chapter apart from Salamanders without directly referencing them.

 

I also recommend reading any and all Salamanders related books, so you can get a better understanding of the Salamanders as a chapter before you commit entirely to them being your parent chapter (though it would be nice to see more salamanders successor chapters, ultrasmurfs and the emo and tampon angels cant get all the love). Its not entirely uncommon for chapters to spring up out of nowhere.

 

Anyways, I hope this gives you some ideas and help in building the lore and character of your chapter.

[Knight of the Raven]

Well, since this was brought back from the dead...

 

I'd say a simple thing to remember is that what makes the Salamanders Salamanders, such as their smithing tendancies, pyromania and willingness to help the helpless of the Imperium, isn't caused by their geneseed, but by Vulkan's teachings and their relationship with Nocturne's population. So a successor chapter without something similar in their background isn't required to be defenders of mankind the way Salamanders are. They can even be so ruthless the Marines Malevolent cover their lockers with posters of them if they have an adequate reason.

 

I suspect looking at the pre-Vulkan Salamanders, 'the Fearless,' is a good way to find the more natural (as opposed to nurtural) traits of the XVIII Legion.

 

Oh, and according to Angels of Death, they do have pre-Ultima Founding successor chapters, though none are named.

 

The Salamanders are also peculiar for having very few documented successor Chapters, unlike most of the First Founding Space Marines.

~ page 39, Warriors of Nocturne