Grimaldus in 8th

[CrystalSeer]

The man, the myth, the legend,

 

he's honestly one of my favorite characters in 40k fluff, but at 50 pts over a regular chaplain and no changes to the statline, I find him hard to justify on the field. Especially since being a character keeps him from using the crusaders helm.

 

Is there something I'm missing? Does additional attacks on 6's count for much more than I give it credit for? What are the other knight's of Dorn experiences with him in this new era?

[SydonianDragoon404]

He's kind of inferior to Helbrecht in my opinion. Helbrecht re-rolls everything, and I would say the +1 strength in many cases evens out against the additional attacks seeing as how you can't use the ability with Thunder Hammers or Power Fists. Though once I have my Grimaldus painted up he'll always be in the army against an Ork player. 

[Marshal_Roujakis]

He's kind of inferior to Helbrecht in my opinion. Helbrecht re-rolls everything, and I would say the +1 strength in many cases evens out against the additional attacks seeing as how you can't use the ability with Thunder Hammers or Power Fists. Though once I have my Grimaldus painted up he'll always be in the army against an Ork player. 

 

He's my go to guy if I'm running more than a few Crusader Squads for melee... I guess with Primaris armies, he's not so good, and same as well if you're running more than a few Power Weapon melee squads... he's more than decent with the buff to melee dedicated Crusader Squads since they don't really have that much value in terms of quality of attacks... giving them +1 Str means little especially since regardless of what you're hitting in melee will get armor saves if you're only hitting with Chainswords and Combat Knives, I usually give these squads a Power Axe or Power Sword since the additional 6 gives them an extra quality attack... sure it doesn't buff Thunder Hammers or Power Fists, but if the only thing you can attack heavy targets are Crusader Squads, then you might want to add more Elite killers in your list... Grimaldus acts as the Bread-winner for my Crusaders... usually adding an additional Dreadnought or an ancient to really force in the weight of dice... if necessary add in additional Crusader Squads for more attacks since that 6" buff is for models in the unit, unlike Helbrecht which only applies to models within that 6"...

 

Helbrecht is better with Honour Guard, Vanguard Veterans or Terminators to sync with... giving them +1 Str boosts their Power Swords (which everyone in the squad has...) and even Lightning Claws for Sword Brother (if I feel like running a Veteran Squad) and they are also the ones that benefit most out of Apothecaries... since they are usually smaller more powerful squads that gains a lot from getting wounds/models back...

 

If the points allow, I usually have them both... Grim w/ Crusaders, Helbrecht w/ Veterans... 1-2 punch combo hitting from both flanks and heavy shooters in the middle... if the points are limited, then Grim first, since Crusaders hold objectives better especially if they don't run away...

[Medjugorje]

in fluffgames I play him with Helbrecht and a Emperors Champion.

 

In ohter cases I dont play him.

[Gerhard]

When it comes to your question: Grimaldus versus a Chaplain and whether he's worth the points: I would say in general no. The assumption there is that you're playing a point game in which you intend to field a Chaplain for the rerolls, and as such position said Chaplain with a squad that can benefit from that most, the extra attack is just a 'nice to have' in that case. 

 

50 points in a points game is quite substantial and can be the difference between a Twin Auto Cannon on a vehicle or not or some other special weapon. I would always pick such a weapon over getting a potential extra attack on a 6 as the difference is 12 dices versus a 1 in 6 chance for an extra attack in the example I gave. 

 

There is a little personal preference and army-setup involved here as well though. In my case for example I run a 10 man Vanguard Veteran squad with Jump packs, Chainswords & Plasma Pistols and I use it as an alpha strike unit so they have to hit. Therefore I run them with a Chaplain with Jump pack which immediately rules out Grimaldus because he has no jump-pack. However, I'd likely always field a normal Chaplain over Grimaldus in points game as well due to the customization options and cost of heavy weapons. 

 

Power Level is a completely different story. There Grimaldus really shines as the difference in PL with a normal Chaplain is only one, and I've not had a PL game where I didn't have 1 PL to spare. In that case the extra attack on a 6 is quite a nice extra bonus for only 1 PL. 

[Honda]

If Grimaldus isn't where the action is, then that's a pretty expensive plasma pistol you just bought.

 

However, he is a force multiplier and as such, he needs to be around where he can do his thing, multiply your force.

 

I always take him and his sidekick, the Emperor's Champion. The EC gets even deadlier when he's close to Grimaldus.

 

So short answer, if you're building tournament lists, he may not fit in your plans. That being said, if you field Grimaldus, there is no doubt that you are bringing the Black Templars.

[Ciler]

Actually, what benefits does the EC get from being near Grimaldus ? All I can see is the extra attack (sure, that's nothing to be sniffed at), because he already rerolls everything with his own rules.

[Honda]

Maybe I was playing him (EC) incorrectly. I thought  the EC got to re-roll wounds and Big G let him re-roll hits on a charge?

 

I might also be experiencing trans-editional eidetic memories.

[SydonianDragoon404]

Against Characters and Monsters, the Emp's Champion re-rolls both failed hits and wounds.

[Ciler]

Ah yes, I wasn't very accurate.

 

The EC gets :

• by his own abilities : +1S and +1A against characters
• by his own abilities : re-roll to hit against characters
• by the Black Sword : re-roll to wound against characters and monsters

in hindsight, the EC does benefit from being near Grimaldus more than I thought, if he's fighting non-character units (but I think he shouldn't be).

Edited September 3, 2017 by Ciler

[Blender]

In my experience, Helbrecht gives the EC a fighting chance against the big baddies  because of an addition +1S on top of the +1 S against monstrous creatures/characters. So I use him to hunt monsters (mainly swarmlords). When I use Grimaldus, that is when I footslog 20 man squads using Grimaldus bubble to buff as many grunts as possible. 

Edited September 2, 2017 by Blender

[Honda]

Ok, understood regarding the ECs abilities. In my games, characters suddenly have the urge for a cup of tea and that leaves me wading through meat shields to get to the extra bonuses.

 

So, "Yes", if he is facing characters or monsters, he becomes a monster. So far for me, it's been the case of someone pointing at my EC and telling the opponent, "That guy right there, stay away from him. Seriously.". :)

[Rustican]

Ah yes, I wasn't very accurate.

 

The EC gets :

• by his own abilities : +1S and +1A against characters
• by his own abilities : re-roll to hit against characters
• by the Black Sword : re-roll to hit against characters and monsters

in hindsight, the EC does benefit from being near Grimaldus more than I thought, if he's fighting non-character units (but I think he shouldn't be).

Black sword let's your re-roll to wound against characters and monsters.