Second Founding speculation

[bluntblade]

Obviously we know about plenty of captains and praetors who'll get their own Chapter in the Second Founding, but are there any others who people think might be lined up for a Chapter?

 

I suspect Shiban Khan is on his way to leading the Destroyers or Storm Lords, assuming he makes it through the Siege.

 

Guess Corswain will be the first Chapter Master of the Dark Angels.

[1ncarnadine]

Seeing as Guilliman names a Tetrarch from the Genesis Chapter in Dark Imperium, I wouldn't be surprised at all to learn his 30k Tetrarchs all became Second Founding Chapter Masters.

 

I imagine we may learn more about who from or what part of the Blood Angels founds the Flesh Eaters and the Blood Drinkers whenever Angelus drops, too. Their icons are both formation symbols on the Blood Angels transfer sheet.

[DogWelder]

For the Ultramarines we have:

 

Lucretius Corvo who becomes Chapter Master of the Novamarines

 

Iasus who becomes Chapter Master of the Nemesis Chapter 

 

Aurora Chapter is formed from the Ultramarines 4th Chapter. Founder unnamed so far

 

Arrias Cordos who becomes Chapter Master of the Black Consuls 

 

Tulian who becomes Chapter Master of the Doom Eagles

 

For the Blood Angels:

 

Nasser Amit obviously becomes Chapter Master of the Flesh Tearers

 

Azkaellon is probably going to be the first Chapter Master of the Blood Angels

[Calas Typhon]

 

Azkaellon is probably going to be the first Chapter Master of the Blood Angels

Raldoron gets this, Az is more than likely going to form another chapter, or become a high chaplain from what I see and the information present.

Edited September 24, 2017 by Warsmith Kroeger

[Sete]

Sigismund and Pollux deserve one.

[DogWelder]

Sigismund and Pollux deserve one.

 

Isn't it confirmed that Pollux founded the Crimson Fists and Sigismund the BT?

[1ncarnadine]

^Yup. That's what they do. There are a ton we are either certain of or very reasonably assured of, like Fafnir Rann -> Executioners or Autek Mor -> Red Talons. 

 

But the topic is about speculating on which ones we don't already know for sure. Such as, does Shadrak Meduson end up as Chapter Master of the Iron Hands or does he found the Brazen Claws or what (or maybe Meduson and Tybalt Marr just mutually kill each other), etc

 

Although it still might be helpful to list the ones we do know so we can be more confident with the ones we don't?

Edited September 24, 2017 by LetsYouDown

[Calas Typhon]

^Yup. That's what they do. There are a ton we are either certain of or very reasonably assured of, like Fafnir Rann -> Executioners or Autek Mor -> Red Talons. 

 

But the topic is about speculating on which ones we don't already know for sure. Such as, does Shadrak Meduson end up as Chapter Master of the Iron Hands or does he found the Brazen Claws or what (or maybe Meduson and Tybalt Marr just mutually kill each other), etc

 

Although it still might be helpful to list the ones we do know so we can be more confident with the ones we don't?

 

Iron Hands wont have a chapter master. Its highly likely shadrak is out of service by the time the scouring happens. 

 

I have a feeling we wont get to know many chapters origins outside of the big named characters we have. A lot about the 40K period with SM Chapters is the shrouded/forgotten information of their lineage. And the majority of the big characters we know the chapters they go on to lead. 

 

It will be interesting to know if chapters could even possibly be lead by those loyal from the traitor legions. Because they would not use their geneseed for obvious reasons, and I don't see any Primarch handing over a batch to a 'tainted' geneseed.

[bluntblade]

^Yup. That's what they do. There are a ton we are either certain of or very reasonably assured of, like Fafnir Rann -> Executioners or Autek Mor -> Red Talons. 

 

But the topic is about speculating on which ones we don't already know for sure. Such as, does Shadrak Meduson end up as Chapter Master of the Iron Hands or does he found the Brazen Claws or what (or maybe Meduson and Tybalt Marr just mutually kill each other), etc

 

Although it still might be helpful to list the ones we do know so we can be more confident with the ones we don't?

Good point.

[Sete]

 

 

Sigismund and Pollux deserve one.

Isn't it confirmed that Pollux founded the Crimson Fists and Sigismund the BT?

It's a joke since they are well known chapters. ;)

[Laughingman]

Demetrus katalfaque supposedly went on to found the the excoriators during the second founding, no idea who went on to found the soul drinkers though. I kind of assumed it was made up of the surviving boarding specialist since they went on to be a fleet based chapter.

[deathspectersgt7]

Tulian WHO ? and since when According to what I've read (10 yrs ago) a Ultra Captain named Aqulia was the Doom Eagles first .

[Soldier of Dorn]

Tulian WHO ? and since when According to what I've read (10 yrs ago) a Ultra Captain named Aqulia was the Doom Eagles first .

 

Same dude. Tulian Aquila.

 

Ultras and Fists are the ones we really know the most about. It is interesting to note that there are a couple Third Founding chapters that have known Heresy era roots and a founder: Fafnir Rahn and his Executioners in the case of the VII Legion, and Oberdeii and the Scythes of the Emperor in the case of the Ultramarines. We do know why Oberdeii's chapter is a Third Founding chapter, but we don't know all that much about the Executioners.

[Kelborn]

Saur Damocles will most likely be a founding membet of the Iron Snakes.

 

Then we got the Scythes of the Emperor and possibly the Silver Skulls being the last loyal IW under Dantioch.

 

Other candidates could be Shiban, Sev Branne (correct name?) and Arkhas Fal.

[Calas Typhon]

Saur Damocles will most likely be a founding membet of the Iron Snakes.

 

Then we got the Scythes of the Emperor and possibly the Silver Skulls being the last loyal IW under Dantioch.

 

Other candidates could be Shiban, Sev Branne (correct name?) and Arkhas Fal.

 

Dantioch is dead, if there is any Iron Warrior it would be Kyr Vhalen, I am not sure how they will progress that story line but I have a feeling the silver skulls will either not be related other than in emblem.

[Kelborn]

Yeah, I meant the very last members of his battailon,if there are any at all. ;)

[Kizzdougs]

There is a loyalist Millennial of Emperor's Children (the 34th) known as the Death Eagles. It's possible that they became the loyalist Chapter that goes by the same name. Of course a post Heresy loyalist Chapter having the same name as a pre-Heresy Millennial is probably just a coincidence.

[Sandlemad]

There is a loyalist Millennial of Emperor's Children (the 34th) known as the Death Eagles. It's possible that they became the loyalist Chapter that goes by the same name. Of course a post Heresy loyalist Chapter having the same name as a pre-Heresy Millennial is probably just a coincidence.

 

Unless said loyalist chapter started out with prominent eagle-based iconography and pink/purple heraldry.

 

We don't know their founding but I think it's plausible in the chaos of the age of rebirth. It wouldn't happen after 10k of imperial bitterness but at the time pragmatic minds like Guilliman probably wouldn't turn down a veteran force of loyal astartes. Just cover up their history and watch them closely for as long as you remember. What was done to the Imperial Fists was a bigger endeavor and that was hushed up. A few hundred marines, probably less after all the fighting? Even easier.

 

A similar case would be the Dark Brotherhood, though we don't know their founding either. Conquest said we hadn't seen the last of them and reorganising them into a codex chapter strips them of their fleets and forces them to rely on the other organs of the imperium. Practically speaking, it's the same kind of process that every other second founding chapter underwent.

 

On firmer ground, Arkhas Fal, former legion master of the Raven Guard, is an almost guaranteed founder. The specifics of the genetic makeup and the exact details of the Carcharodons' founding is complicated but given that his title of 'Shade Lord' is also one of the titles of their unnamed progenitor, it seems like a slam dunk. Maybe a spiritual founder rather than literally the first commander after reorganising into a chapter rather than a pseudo-exiled long-range branch of the XIX legion, but he's significant.

Edited September 25, 2017 by Sandlemad

[deathspectersgt7]

 

Tulian WHO ? and since when According to what I've read (10 yrs ago) a Ultra Captain named Aqulia was the Doom Eagles first .

 

Same dude. Tulian Aquila.

 

Ultras and Fists are the ones we really know the most about. It is interesting to note that there are a couple Third Founding chapters that have known Heresy era roots and a founder: Fafnir Rahn and his Executioners in the case of the VII Legion, and Oberdeii and the Scythes of the Emperor in the case of the Ultramarines. We do know why Oberdeii's chapter is a Third Founding chapter, but we don't know all that much about the Executioners.

 

Thank you 

[Kizzdougs]

 

There is a loyalist Millennial of Emperor's Children (the 34th) known as the Death Eagles. It's possible that they became the loyalist Chapter that goes by the same name. Of course a post Heresy loyalist Chapter having the same name as a pre-Heresy Millennial is probably just a coincidence.

 

Unless said loyalist chapter started out with prominent eagle-based iconography and pink/purple heraldry.

 

We don't know their founding but I think it's plausible in the chaos of the age of rebirth. It wouldn't happen after 10k of imperial bitterness but at the time pragmatic minds like Guilliman probably wouldn't turn down a veteran force of loyal astartes. Just cover up their history and watch them closely for as long as you remember. What was done to the Imperial Fists was a bigger endeavor and that was hushed up. A few hundred marines, probably less after all the fighting? Even easier.

 

Yeah, their first recorded action is in M32, so not too long after the Heresy/Scouring...

 

And like you said, their early colour scheme is a little suspicious...

http://www.solegends.com/citrt2/rt4106smseatheagles/Wd112p07DeathEagleSpaceMarinesxx-01.jpg

[Reyner]

Autek fething Morr hopefully gets his Red Talons Chapter once the Second Founding takes place.

 

Remus Ventanus is currently the 4th Chapter Captain so he would hopefully go on to create the Aurora Chapter.

Aeonid Thiel might go on to lead the Genesis Chapter with his Red Marked. 

Edited September 27, 2017 by Reyner

[Brother Tholath]

Thiel is said to be Captain of the 2nd Company in the Dark Millennium book when Gulliman assaults Fulgrim's flagship. Which makes sense with a lot of Thiel's tactics and ideas being the basis for the Codex

[Grim Dog Studios]

Autek fething Morr hopefully gets his Red Talons Chapter once the Second Founding takes place.

 

Remus Ventanus is currently the 4th Chapter Captain so he would hopefully go on to create the Aurora Chapter.

Aeonid Thiel might go on to lead the Genesis Chapter with his Red Marked. 

 

Ventanus is captain of the 4th Company in the first chapter AFAIK not 4th Chapter Master.

[bluntblade]

Autek fething Morr hopefully gets his Red Talons Chapter once the Second Founding takes place.

 

Remus Ventanus is currently the 4th Chapter Captain so he would hopefully go on to create the Aurora Chapter.

Aeonid Thiel might go on to lead the Genesis Chapter with his Red Marked.

 

Retribution pretty much states he will.

[1ncarnadine]

 

Retribution pretty much states he will.

 

 

Possible, although there's a potential confliction in that the Genesis Chapter was supposed to be the first of the Primogenitor Chapters, but Thiel was still 2nd Captain of the Ultramarines when Guilliman was taken out by Fulgrim. Maybe his red-marked formed the Chapter, but Thiel himself stayed with the Ultramarines?