Death Watch and allies

[Polak]

So I know most of us like to play our Death Watch armies as pure as possible. But even in 7th we have considered to add allies to our lists, be it extra bodies with IG lackies, be it Xenos inquisitors with their lackies or even take Celestine for some divine retribution on the xenos scum.

 

Now my interest for allies has been spurred again with the release of the Astra Militarum codex (it's quite a fun and very good codex!). Normally my thematic choice for allies would be the Tempestus Scions as Inquistorial stormtroopers to assist us in the xenos purges. But with the (re)introduction of regimental doctrines that work of tanks! I've been been thinking of maybe some armoured assistance.

 

Now another question while on the subject of allies: Assassins. How would we take effectively 1-2 assassins in a detachment without breaking chapter tactics/regiments, and without taking the auxiliary detachment at -1 cp.

 

But in general also interested in thoughts of my Death Watch brethern on taking allies for the purge. 

[MyD4rkPassenger]

If you wanted 1 or 2 assassins the best way I have found is to take an inquisitor, one acolyte, and the assassins of choice in a vanguard detachment. 

 

I've always thought an ordo xenos inquisitor was a fluffy choice for deathwatch, and a savvy Inquisitor would most certainly call on an armored force as a supplement.  The force from Eisenhorn: Xenos was made up of deathwatch, guard, stormtoopers and the like, so anything with the guard is pretty cool in my opinion to add.

[Polak]

I'm looking currently at a baneblade to add, though which one (or two? three would be hardly allies anymore). I'm exploring the idea of a classic baneblade, hellhammer or a shadowsword. Probably the shadowsword for some added anti tank punch, seeing how we kind of lack that, we're better at dealing with infantry. And then question is, Catachan for the extra offensive punch or Valhallan for even a better bullet magnet.

[Mobius0288]

Allies for DW is a great topic! I still take purely DW with an ally or two, assassins primarily. Because of the way the rules are written for faction DW.... you can take an "imperium" detachment with deathwatch units and still use your SIA and auras. They still belong to DW and retain their "chapter tactics." You just wouldn't be able to use detachment specific rules from our codex which isn't even out. Your assassins would just count as elite choices, so use this advantage!

 

Tempestus really are some of the better supplement choices - they're cheap enough and have great firepower options.

 

My mentality with DW is bringing in things to keep the pressure off of my kill teams while they go do work. For that reason, I could see things like hellhounds maybe being good choices. Tanks sitting in the back wouldn't take too much pressure off my frontlines unless they're intentionally guarding an objective. The more expensive the units, the less options I'll have for my kill teams. Know that, here's what I've been looking at for my army:

 

- Sisters of Silence (fantastic, cheap bodies, anti-psycher... especially since I don't use psychers much)

- Inquisition (cheap HQ choices, psycher option, rides in any transport, warrior acolytes are great bodies but shooting is meh)

- Assassins (pretty much feels like an automatic for me... they aren't super clutch but they our powerful when used right)

- Tempestus Scions (deep strike-able, great special weapon options, fits DW thematically)

- Imperial Knights (good if you just want to add super heavies to your army but probably not as valuable as adding a decked out kill team and razorback/blackstar)

- Astra Militarum (LET THE BODIES HIT THE FLOOR... even a patrol detachment with 2-3 troops and chimeras could be beneficial for objective games)

- Admech (rangers and anti-air onagers seem to offer something different the other allies don't, otherwise I would go elsewhere)

[Polak]

I didn't realise that we would keep SIA if we just went IMPERIUM detachment. That does make it easier for us to include assassins, inquisitors and celestine. Though with guard I'd need to devote a separate detachment in order to keep their regiment bonuses etc.

 

How do faction specific strategems and allies work? If I have guard with my DW, does that mean I can use the guard specific strategems for guards units while I use the generic ones for DW. Or would I only have access to the AM strategems if I go pure AM?

[Mobius0288]

If you bring guard with the intent on using the regiment bonuses, they need need to be a battleforge detachment. So adding a patrol detachment of AM [REGIMENT] would allow you to use those rules and stratagems. It would only affect that specific detachment.

 

I don't want to say for sure about the stratagems because I just dont know. I don't own the AM codex. Remembering back to C:SM, those stratagems and relics are specific to the chapter you chose. I don't recall any "army only" rule, only detachment specific.

 

Technically you should be able to load up on patrol and vanguard detachments to use multiple stratagem options.

 

 

Taking this a little further (because now I'm spit balling ideas):

+ Battleforged army (+3) - probably close to 2000 pts

 

+ Battalion [imperium or inquisition] (+3)

- 2 Inq (HQ)

- 3 warrior acolyte (troop)

- 3 chimeras (or rhinos? or razorbacks?)

 

+ Vanguard [imperium] (+1)

- 1 Inq/DW Capt/Jump pack Captain/Librarian (Celestine?)

- 2 sisters of silence

- 1 assassin

- 1 rhino

 

+ Patrol [deathwatch] (+0)

- 1 watchmaster

- 3 kill teams

- 1 blackstar

- X razorbacks

 

I'm just throwing stuff together but hopefully you get the idea with the AM stuff. That DW detachment has potential to use any applicable detachment bonuses, stratagems and relics (if our codex was out) without impacting the other detachments in the army. Same with the inquisition detachment. Or you could even turn the patrol detachment into an outrider and just use 3 bike units, giving you another CP.

[xenomortis]

I plan on running a seperate detachment of tempestus scions alongside my Deathwatch. That way they will still receive their regimental doctrine. They will be used to deep strike and take out key targets using a mixture of plasma and melta accompanied by a tempestor prime. I also regularly run an Ordo Xenos inquisitor alongside my Deathwatch as a cheap, psychic HQ with some good success. Infact I have just bought the start collecting militarum tempestus box and plan on using the Taurox Prime as my inquisitors dedicated transport.

 

 

An assassin could be used as an Elite choice as part of a standard detachment (patrol, battalion etc.) because of the 'IMPERIUM' keyword. They do not however have the 'DEATHWATCH' keyword so would not benefit from aura abilities etc. from DW units. 

 

 

I would love to run pure DW but in my gaming group I have come to the realisation that I need more bodies. I face a lot of high model count armies and I'm getting focus fired off the board. I'm hoping the introduction of  some deep striking, powerful suicide units should give me more time to move my DW into a position to do something! 

 

 

I went for scions and an inquisitor to try and keep it fluffy, with that elite feel to the force

 

[Prot]

 

 

 

I would love to run pure DW but in my gaming group I have come to the realisation that I need more bodies. I face a lot of high model count armies and I'm getting focus fired off the board. I'm hoping the introduction of  some deep striking, powerful suicide units should give me more time to move my DW into a position to do something! 

 

 

I went for scions and an inquisitor to try and keep it fluffy, with that elite feel to the force

 

 

I agree. I am only interested in units in the Codex/index list but I will dabble with units that make sense... stuff like assassins, inquisition, etc. Unfortunately that plays into the issue of army size. This is also th way of 8th.... I guess it's going to be an uphill battle, unless you're willing to bite the bullet and start using stuff like Astra (I personally can't do it. lol)

 

But the Scions are a good choice. I've had some games against their specialty units and they're no joke. :)

[Xisor]

Astra Militarum will do the trick in a pinch - it's what I'm looking at. Specifically: ad-hoc. My Militarum stuff is patchwork city fight from different regiments/companies, so using them as 'in the field already' forces, who happen to be bolstered/co-opted by the Inquisitiorial Task Force (some acolytes, some assassins, some Deathwatch) as needs must fits the bill.

 

Not to mention: needs must to get some more bodies on the field!

 

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Gotta say, I'm intrigued by a wee armoured AM force -Tank Commander, Second, maybe some Hellhound-ys.

 

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Which reminds me, I'm *also* keen to look at an 'armoured' Deathwatch force, e.g. a Spearhead from Codex: Space Marines, but literally as <Chapter>=Deathwatch,

- Techmarine

- Predator

- Predator

- Vindicator

- one of the flyers

 

This would allow Blood Angels/Space Wolf/Dark Angel toys to come into play too, if needed, as well as other flyers and things.

 

Also: apothecaries. (I've not checked the exact wording there, but might be a way.)

[Toomanyprojects]

I've got a 500 point game at Warhammer world coming up and I'm taking Greyfax and a Vindicare assassin as allies. Greyfax can help out with leadership and the assassin will snipe her genestealer cult characters at long range.

 

My Sole kill team will be able to dish out the hurt at moderate to short range but will need backup with leadership in the form of Greyfax and with reaching across the board in the form of the Vindicare

Edited November 4, 2017 by Toomanyprojects

[Stargate_wars]

Just remember that only the warlord's faction can have any relics or equivalent.

[Mobius0288]

Which reminds me, I'm *also* keen to look at an 'armoured' Deathwatch force, e.g. a Spearhead from Codex: Space Marines, but literally as <Chapter>=Deathwatch,

- Techmarine

- Predator

- Predator

- Vindicator

- one of the flyers

 

This would allow Blood Angels/Space Wolf/Dark Angel toys to come into play too, if needed, as well as other flyers and things.

 

Also: apothecaries. (I've not checked the exact wording there, but might be a way.)

 

Like DW colors and maybe SM chapter tactics (Salamander maybe?). Sounds pretty cool fluff wise. I still think our flyer is cooler :-P

 

You could take a Primaris Apothecary as actual DW. I'll be experimenting with one this weekend actually.

[Aothaine]

I am in favor of using Faction: Imperium. I don't have the new militarum codex so I'm still going off of index points for this. I'll be updating it when I get the new codex in about a month.

 

But this is what I'm aiming to run: 

 

Brigade - 1983

 

HQ - 450

Inquisitor (Ordo Malleus) - Needle Pistol & Force Sword - 69

Watch Master - 130

Lord Commisar - 54

Tank Commander - 197

 

ELITE - 75

Daemonhost x3 - 75

 

TROOP - 810

Deathwatch Kill Team - 95

Watch Sergeant & 4 Veterans(Boltgun & Chainsword)

Razorback(Twin-Lascannon) - 115

 

Deathwatch Kill Team - 95

Watch Sergeant & 4 Veterans(Boltgun & Chainsword)

Razorback(Twin-Lascannon) - 115

 

Deathwatch Kill Team - 95

Watch Sergeant & 4 Veterans(Boltgun & Chainsword)

Razorback(Twin-Lascannon) - 115

 

Conscripts (20 man) - 60

Conscripts (20 man) - 60

Conscripts (20 man) - 60

 

FAST ATTACK - 165

Scout Sentinel - Lascannon - 55

Scout Sentinel - Lascannon - 55

Scout Sentinel - Lascannon - 55

 

HEAVY SUPPORT - 486

Leman Russ Battle Tank - Battle Cannon & Heavy Bolter - 162

Leman Russ Battle Tank - Battle Cannon & Heavy Bolter - 162

Leman Russ Battle Tank - Battle Cannon & Heavy Bolter - 162

 

I have a few points left and I'm thinking of tossing some hunter-killer missiles on two of the razorbacks. Anyway, I know this is lacking a good assault unit but I am not too sure how to include one in. I really want more Daemonhosts they are really really good. They remind me of the old night goblin dudes with the giant cannon balls attached to chains that would just rush out of the night goblin units and chew through the opponent's ranks. I know they can be shot at and with my list I would have them just walking up the board but with 3 wounds and a 5+ invlun they will need to shoot a good number of shots at them to take them out. 

 

I know there is a lot of other stuff with just some Deathwatch sprinkled in. But They are going to be real strong. My Deathwatch only list uses the same Deathwatch unit comps but uses six of them with two Watch Masters and Three Dreadnoughts. 

 

I really hope that when the Inquisition codex comes out that the Inquisitors can be added to any list and not break the rule stating they can use their faction rules.

 

I am also thinking about dropping the Deathwatch to free up a few more points but I think three is what I really need here.

Edited October 15, 2017 by Aothaine

[Moostick]

Wouldn't it make more sense to split your detachments? With how you have it now, all your Guard units don't benefit from their regimental standard, which seems like a huge waste.

[Aothaine]

Wouldn't it make more sense to split your detachments? With how you have it now, all your Guard units don't benefit from their regimental standard, which seems like a huge waste.

 

 

Lose out on command points then. Might be worth it though... I'll have to wait and see when I get the dex.

Edited October 15, 2017 by Aothaine