Grey Knight special weapons

[Ichar]

How would you improve the GK special weapons?

 

I was thinking about something like Psilencers convert wound rolls of 6 to Mortal Wounds and Psycannons become AP -3 or -4 on 6s. If that is too strong, how about those additions for Psychic Onslaught and Psybolt Ammunition?

[Danarc]

We suffer a lack of anti tank and we need at least one HW for this role.

Psycannon is the best candidate. Even if it has always been S7 it should be now heavy2 S8 and AP-3 with the appropriate cost.

Psylencer could be ok but on 6s it should inflict an additional mortal wound.

I have no idea about incenerator. Maybe it only need a drastic points drop.

 

From a more realistic point of view I will be very happy if psycannon inflicts 2 damage for every unsaved wound

[Corvus Fortis]

AP -2 on Psycannon to compensate rending (Assault cannon got 2 more shots for loosing rending and cost only 1 point more). Psilencer is already multi-damage weapon and it will probably become useless if psycannon gets 2 damage. Psilencer is ok. Incinerator is ok but too expensive. Heavy incinerator is way overcosted. It has to be 20 or less.   

[Waking Dreamer]

Most realistically, probably a points reduction all round.
 
Ideally, in addition to a points reduction:

- Psycannons Dmg2 AP-4 (on a To Wound roll of 6) - at the moment there is no incentive to choose them over psilencers even for anti-armour. Psilencers would still have more shots and be cheaper to compete.
- Heavy Psycannons AP-4 (on a To Wound roll of 6)

- Incinerator 2d3 shots

- Heavy Incinerator 2d3 shots

- Psychic onslaught / Psybolt ammo = 1CP (honestly would have preferred them as wargear options to begin with)

 

Just slight tweaks but with the excellence of newer codex releases, it would be amazing for our very fluffy GK special weapons to provide us the ranged punch to keep are armies on par, rather than start leeching off other Imperium allies to become better.

[Plasmablasts]

It’s quite interesting considering the train of changes from 7th to 8th that has led to the current situation.

 

1. Let rapid fire weapons move, shoot and charge. So, where does that leave assault weapons?

 

2. Ok, let assault weapons advance and shoot. Great! But now terminators are effectively faster than tactical marines...

 

3. Right, so let’s switch stormbolters to Rapid Fire 2.

 

Which gives us a basic weapon with great firepower, but with the altered “to wound” chart and the changes handling of vehicles leaves us with a psycannon which most of the time trades +1 to wound for -1 to hit compared to the stormbolter.

 

The changed wound chart makes the niche the psycannon had (dealing with tough targets and vehicles) much smaller, with the stormbolter and psilencer both encroaching on it. As things stand, giving the psycannon D:d3 or similar would then just lead to the psycannon encroaching into the psilencer’s niche. I think the psycannon probably needs redesigning more radically to give it a more distinct role as the anti-tank/anti-big monster gun for the GKs. I’d suggest S8 AP -2 D3 (or maybe AP -3; D3 makes it the ranged equivalent of the daemonhammer) but reducing the shots to Heavy 2 to compensate. The heavy psycannon would then be Heavy 4.

 

Psilencer and incinerator are probably fine, with maybe some points adjustments.

[Gentlemanloser]

The Psycannon was always an Assault Cannon with +1S (and funky dual firing modes).

 

It should remain as that. Same shots as an AC. +1S.

 

You could give it some special rule to represent the dual fire modes of you really wanted.

 

Like wise the Incinerator was just a Flamer with +1S.

 

It's the point costs that need to be adjusted.

 

(And both the AC and Psycannon need rending back).

 

The Psilencer is harder. It compete with the humble Stormbolter, and costs a nemesis force weapon to do so. It's not good enough.

 

Maybe it just needs its shots increased. 8 might be good.

[Waking Dreamer]

The Psycannon was always an Assault Cannon with +1S (and funky dual firing modes).

 

It should remain as that. Same shots as an AC. +1S.

 

You could give it some special rule to represent the dual fire modes of you really wanted.

 

The Psilencer is harder. It compete with the humble Stormbolter, and costs a nemesis force weapon to do so. It's not good enough.

 

Maybe it just needs its shots increased. 8 might be good.

 

If psycannons were to have 6 shots how many shots would heavy psycannons get? Would both still require a points reduction?

 

Would the Gatling Psilencer get an increase in shots as well?

[Capt. Mytre]

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Edited October 29, 2017 by Capt. Mytre

[Gentlemanloser]

Heavy Psycannons used to have blast as a firing mode. They should have two options one a ransom number to represent blast.

 

All require point reductions.

 

Yup Gattling Psy would have increased shots as well.

[Helycon]

The Psycannon was always an Assault Cannon with +1S (and funky dual firing modes).

 

It should remain as that. Same shots as an AC. +1S.

 

You could give it some special rule to represent the dual fire modes of you really wanted.

 

Like wise the Incinerator was just a Flamer with +1S.

 

It's the point costs that need to be adjusted.

 

(And both the AC and Psycannon need rending back).

 

The Psilencer is harder. It compete with the humble Stormbolter, and costs a nemesis force weapon to do so. It's not good enough.

 

Maybe it just needs its shots increased. 8 might be good.

There already is an assault cannon with +1S, it's the Kheres pattern we don't have access to.

 

I feel it could be higher strength and ap. Maybe just up the AP on vehicles? The Psilencers could be specialized against infantry and monsters, maybe add some fun there.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Psilencers are fine, I have no issues with their on table performance. They're deliberately kept in the 'anti-infantry' role so they don't invalidate other options entirely. D3 damage is a big deal, it means you can drop Primaris and Terminators if they fail saves. Also they are 6 shots always at 24", which means the storm bolter is superior only at 12" (in terms of being default on everything and easier to spam). I'm happy with how those two sit, storm bolter being our anti-chaff and psilencer designed to tackle multi-wound infantry by forcing saves. 

 

Heavy psycannon is okay, mainly because its Damage 2. Without changing any points costs or other rules, I'd simply change the infantry version to Damage 2 as well. Psilencer still beats it on shot output (which given the -1 to hit on the move does matter), but S7 means you wound more reliably and the damage is reliably 2 every time. Purgators would still remain the only viable option for it, because they bring both in bulk (thus making maximum use of 'Psychic Onslaught'). You never see the heavy psycannon on anything except GMDK's and Doomglaives anyway (both of which hit on 2's at range by default, so 3's on the move). Would still be perfectly fine on those platforms, the infantry version on Purgators would offer more shots with the downside of a fragile platform that is less accurate on the move.

 

By simply changing to D2, you'd also avoid unfavourable comparisons with Helblasters and other plasma Marines. They'd still be better at denying armour saves (and in the case of overcharge wounding both Marines and T7+), but like the psilencer, psycannon would work by forcing saves with more shots. Purgators with psycannon are also comparable in cost too. The current problem is Helblasters outdamage them even without overcharging.