Chapter approved point changes to razorbacks and stormraven

[Time of madness]

I know most people generally field at least a couple storm ravens and razorbacks in grey knight armies. Do you think that will change if the points go up on those units?

 

Will it be worth investing in other units?

[Zombs]

I mean, if you want to play pure gk you are pretty much forced to play those... the codex has so few competitive choises imo, it's pretty sad.

[Rurik the blessed]

Nevermind... even 20 points on GK will not reflect in our army composition... usually y have 40 or 50 points left that i can't fill. (because units are so expensive)

[LuisMars]

If they want to see changes in our lists they better lower the price of psycannons and incinerators.

[Capt. Mytre]

If they want to see changes in our lists they better lower the price of psycannons and incinerators.

 

Just make the weapons as good as their current cost. Make one anti-vehicle/monster, make another anti-MEQ/TEQ.

[Prot]

If it’s a couple of points it doesn’t matter really. Personally I think GW would be better off helping the GK a bit by making Psilencers and Psycannons a valid alternative so people don’t auto gravitate towards those units.

 

Really though all we are hearing from this rumour is GW took the winning list at heat 1 of the Grand Tournament and added points to the entire back bone of the army. Extensive playtesting? Or letting tournaments dictate your changes? It really doesn’t matter, but the upside of this is, if I’m right, the fact GK (a codex army) only had one appearance and didn’t do too well may bode well for GK in chapter approved!

[Danarc]

It is difficult that in the CA we will have (bu it is the same for other armies) new rules. Probably there will be only points adjustments.

[Prot]

It is difficult that in the CA we will have (bu it is the same for other armies) new rules. Probably there will be only points adjustments.

 

Yes, that's mostly how GW seem to operate... point adjustments. The Psycannon and Psilencer need something... I don't think they should be heavy, unless they are the Heavy Variant for starts.

 

The army is super elite, so exceptionally difficult to get Command Points with. I find I am largely unable to use most Strategems just because I need one of my 6-7 for that big lascannon save on a character... etc.  (Most people I play are leveraging the Brigade, Xenos do it very easily, so does Astra.)

 

This isn't complaining, it's something that is starting to look uneven as codexes come out. (just for comparison 'free orders' for Astra could be comparable to a power Grey Knights should get for their heavy weapons - just for example).

 

Armies getting more access to multi damage weaponry is another example. Termies started out fun... never 'amazing' but fun, and usable. Every army that could use them was really okay I think in the Index only days... but now it's too easy to adjust (through a roll, or rule) your Damage to 2 or even more.  Keep in mind that a Heavy Bolter in 7th , or an Assault cannon, or heavy flamer, etc, etc, etc, could not affect a Termie save. Now there's many ways to adjust a Termie save.

 

So these are two examples of things that have a cumulative effect that has increased since the index released. 

What's the fix? The "All is dust rule" for termies across the board? Too much work, too many words. A points decrease is all I could see. Would it make a difference if your termies became 4 points cheaper each? I dunno....

 

Just like making Assault Cannons 4-6 points more aren't going to change too much imho. They will still be a go to because of rules.

 

But this is all just speculation. I play a lot of armies and almost every one of them needs something of a similar magnitude to keep up with the new Xenos. Even AdMech is fading and 'competitively' viewed as a two unit codex. (So it's not just GK!.... I think GW knew full well what they were doing putting the codexes out in this order: IE: Admech, then Astra. GK then Eldar, etc)

 

As wordy as this is, I guess what I'm trying to say is I think Chaos, GK, AdMech (especially some units), even Marines, need adjustments already. BUT this time GW have a mechanism in place to make sure we don't see codex creep kill us off! As they announced on pre launch, 'This is the most balanced version of 40K yet." I don't say this to be glib, I say it because we can hope they hold true to this. (And I hope you guys are going to Facebook on this sort of stuff.)

[Danarc]

Make termy like in 2nd edition. This will make them scary as they should be.

[Zamtro]

Personally I'd love to see an actual change to the weapons rather than the points... Like Prot said - Change them from Heavy (Except the heavy variants) and they will regain a lot of strength! a few could possibly even see a slight drop in points too but that might not happen. Either way I kind of don't want to have to remove all the special weapons i have on my squads and change them around, so even without a change i'll just be running inefficient weapons, because they look cool too :P

[Adeptus]

The entire point of having a separate points value, on a separate document, is so that they can tweak that variable without impacting the actual rules. The datasheet published with the models never needs to be changed, only the points values need to be adjusted from time to time.

 

And that's fine. There's nothing wrong with either the psilencer or the psycannon. They're both strictly better than the standard stormbolter, so the only question is how much they should cost in terms of points.

[Prot]

The entire point of having a separate points value, on a separate document, is so that they can tweak that variable without impacting the actual rules. The datasheet published with the models never needs to be changed, only the points values need to be adjusted from time to time.

 

And that's fine. There's nothing wrong with either the psilencer or the psycannon. They're both strictly better than the standard stormbolter, so the only question is how much they should cost in terms of points.

 

See I would say they are so close to other weapons, they could benefit from something... anything that makes them a bit different from an Autocannon or whatever.

 

Something that's cool about AdMech stuff is often on a '6' something could happen. I often viewed GK weapons as having more than a physical link to the warrior holding it... more of a... psychic link. Kind of an extreme example of this would be what happens to the sword of fire when Guilliman holds the hilt...

 

But yea, I realize this is a bit of a pipe dream on my part. As you say they have made it clear that the rules seem pretty static and changes to points are far easier.

 

I think I mentioned this earlier but the only rules change I cant think of in an FAQ as far as personal unit rules, is the Oblits? No... maybe not. I think they wen from 2 shots to 4 shots when the index was replaced by a codex.

 

So yea, I think at most we can hope for points changes.

[Gentlemanloser]

A few things have been changed stat wise going from index to codex.

 

Toughness of eldar wraiths. Some nid stats.

 

I doubt we'll see anything other than point changes in ca though.

[Adeptus]

I'd love to see some actual rules changes, but the best I think we can hope for is points adjustments. My dream is for them to adjust the CP cost of psybolts and psychic onslaught down to 1 each. They're both great stratagems, but 2 CP is a high price in a cp-starved elite army.

[Prot]

Yea. This may sound crazy but most times I use one, maybe two GK strats a game.

[Gentlemanloser]

I usually only use them for rerolls or only in death.

[Plasmablasts]

A few things have been changed stat wise going from index to codex.

 

Toughness of eldar wraiths. Some nid stats.

 

I doubt we'll see anything other than point changes in ca though.

I think the melta-cannon on the Astra Militarum Devil Dog changed from Heavy to Assault when the Codex was released.