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[Xerxus]

It is telling that the special rules for the Baal Predator and Dante were said to be basically unchanged from the index. Given that those units seemed like prime targets for more interesting rules than they currently have I'm worried that all of the balance changes for specific units will be in the form of points changes. I am still hoping to see units like the terminator ancient changed, given that it is currently just a carbon copy of a terminator chaplain in too many respects.

[JamesI]

 

 

I think this may be the most disappointed I've ever been with GW

Seriously? Man, you guys need to relax. Yeah, the Baal, DC, and Dante aren't great options. Everything else is pretty solid. The army will play differently than any other marine army. We'll be fine. I'm still super pumped.

Thank you.

 

We play different than we have and we have a better combat focus than codex marines.

 

Dante is a bit disappointing. But Astorath or Sanguinor are good choices I think. Mephiston is still nasty.

[Brother Crimson]

I think there is a lot of positive stuff:

 

DC pregame movement is big, in most deployment options you can deploy 24” away from the opponent deployment and sometimes closer. Double move means you get within it on turn one and possibly get a easy charge. Either that or the opponent deploys way back and you can hold centre easily.

 

Dreads recost is good

 

Killshot with baal pred is good if baal pred cost is done right

 

Inferno pistol finally have a cost that makes sense

 

The chapter tactic dictates a bit the play style but is pretty good

 

The negative I see is how successor are handled.

[Damon Nightman]

You relax! ;)

 

But seriously I'm sorry that I find it deeply upsetting how they handled Dante. I'm not a competitive player, so this hurts me more than any actual rules not being great or whatever could!

 

I still think there are plenty of reasons to be pumped about the dex! It's still probably going to be our best one in many years!

 

Again I apologize if my negatively or disapointment is bringing others down!

[Panzer]

Id be happier about primaris if they'd gotten access to power swords but apparently they don't because BA usually fight hordes... clearly that's the reason. He suggested that the chainsword is better vs hordes which also isn't true except maybe vs 6+ saves.

Lol what a load of rubbish Please tell me the sword relics are at least useable on primaris characters

Edited December 1, 2017 by Jolemai
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[Ishagu]

Of course they are :-D

[Xenith]

Im excited for the assault lieutenant option. A fast moving source of rerolls is tasty, although combined with a priest and red thirst might be overkill.

 

The first time a death co unit carves open a land raider will be golden. Wound on 5+ with priest, 4+ with thirst, reroll 1's with lieutenant, -4ap from power swords.

[Blindhamster]

Does mean that primaris remain better played as codex marines, which is fine I guess. But I've fallen out or love with most regular marine kits as the proportions feel really wrong to me now, bah I hate feeling disappointed.

No grail on the apothecary seems very odd too, not even like that can be chalked down to lack of model as there's one on our standard upgrade sprue.

[Orpheus Black Blood]

 

 

 

 

No changes for Mephiston unless his points got reduced.

 

Killshot stratagem is in the codex and can be used with baal predators.

 

 

Sounds like Dante is unchanged - worst chapter master still.

If his points went down I think he's perfectly fine. He just costs too much right now.

 

There's also a warlord trait that gives a 6" heroic intervention range.

If he still has a basic inferno pistol instead of the proper perdition pistol, doesnt have any extra rules and didnt get a significant price drop, I dont see much point to using him - which sucks as he was my favourite character forever.

We don't know if his points went down or not as far as I know. I don't think his amount of special rules makes him good or bad. He is faster than any other chapter master, has an additional attack and his axe is awesome, especially with red thirst now.

 

There's a stratagem that lets blood angels get an extra attack on a hit roll of a 6+ in melee against chaos marines. It's on a 4+ against Black Legion.

 

Angelus Boltguns are 3 points. 130 points for a librarian dreadnought. 80 for a furioso. 1 for a hand flamer.

Dante's axe is not awesome, compare it to marneus calgar fists, 2 less strength, and 50% average damage less. Dante's 1d3 vs Marneus's straight 3 damage.

[Damon Nightman]

Does mean that primaris remain better played as codex marines, which is fine I guess. But I've fallen out or love with most regular marine kits as the proportions feel really wrong to me now, bah I hate feeling disappointed.

No grail on the apothecary seems very odd too, not even like that can be chalked down to lack of model as there's one on our standard upgrade sprue.

Dude after what they said about Dante, I wouldn't try to theorize on why or how they decide these things...

[DemonGSides]

If GW doesn't plan on a new Dante kit, I feel pretty upset about their handling of him, especially after reading Devastation of Baal.

[Ishagu]

Calgar is d3 damage. Also Dante gets +1 to wound so it's actually the same.

[JamesI]

Calgar is d3 damage. Also Dante gets +1 to wound so it's actually the same.

I feel Dante loses out compared to other characters in the BA codex. Not worried about comparison to Calgar

[Cronhour]

I was pumped for the codex and as an opening tease, the community article looked like a great start. After watching the twitch stream it seems like they front loaded all the best changes in that post.

 

It was really telling of the designer's lack of interest in the faction that the guy who came on to present it didn't really know what he was talking about. He thought that the sanguinary and terminator ancient were new datasheets, they're both in the index!

We've got some new stuff I'm going to try but it feels like a rush job rather than a proper look at the codex. It just feels like index plus some stratagems and relics, when we needed a proper rebalance for CC in an overwhelmingly shooting positive meta.

Edited December 1, 2017 by Jolemai
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[durdle-durdle]

Calgar is d3 damage. Also Dante gets +1 to wound so it's actually the same.

wouldn't that make him better against toughness 5, 6, and 9+ (if that exists?) enemies?  also, i'd expect he probably got a points reduction, at least a little due to the pistol, but probably more (which wasn't asked in the question, just his abilities).  it is a shame they seem to believe him as a "not one of the greats" commanders (despite giving him command at armageddon), as i would have liked to see the return of 2 warlord trait dante or some command points, but for a good price, he can be just fine as a fast beat stick that gives rerolls around him.

 

baal preds with killshot <3.  i'm disappointed in the lucifer/overcharged engines.  I can't see any reason i'd ever want to advance my baal.  It looks like i'll be taking them in a group of 3 or not at all.  If they're the same points cost, likely not at all.  

 

the angelus bolter, inferno pistol prices are good.  I still don't know if i would buy hand flamers, even for a point though.  I can't decide if i like having one s4 shot at 12" or d3 s 3 shots at 6".  the numbers seem very underwhelming.  maybe on a sgt or a whole dual weilding vanguard squad going inside a rhino/razor, but i'm still not sold.  I can absolutely see taking the inferno pistol now though.  throwing a couple on some sgts or death co squads to give them some flexibility seems pretty good.  I'd probably even throw 2 on a tactical sgt if he's riding in a razor/rhino, since it's double the shots of a combi and about the same price.  

 

librarian dread, i would've liked to see an option to do more attacks similar to the gorkanaut et al, but it seems good, with wings now.  

 

my special weapon vet squads are super excited for a regular lieutenant option too now.

 

intercessors become much more interesting with +1 to wound too.  If they could fit in a rhino, i'd be excited about them, but alas, i don't see me buying a bunch of repulsors for them.  

 

i'm not disappointed at all, but what news came out today isn't as exciting as monday was.  

[Emissary]

Calgar is d3 damage. Also Dante gets +1 to wound so it's actually the same.

 

Plus Dante's axe gets the character reroll.  Against characters he's practically 6 guaranteed wounding hits on characters (with a sanguinary priest nearby he's hitting on 2+, wounding on 2+, rerolling both against even Guilliman and Swarmlords).  He also gets the kit of warlord traits like always striking first, +1 damage, 6" heroic interventions etc.  Plus you can use the d3 extra attacks trait on him when he charges.   If his cost is correct, he is an extremely brutal melee machine.  I'm fine with him being different than other more static chapter masters.  I just feel he costs too much compared to the Sanguinor who is very similar.

 

No grail on the apothecary seems very odd too, not even like that can be chalked down to lack of model as there's one on our standard upgrade sprue.

 

They mentioned that fluffwise the primaris aren't trusted enough yet in the Blood Angels to be inducted into the higher levels of the sanguinary priesthood.  Similar to what the Dark Angels primaris are facing.

 

Does mean that primaris remain better played as codex marines, which is fine I guess. But I've fallen out or love with most regular marine kits as the proportions feel really wrong to me now, bah I hate feeling disappointed.

 

I played my full primaris force with the red thirst 2 days ago and enjoyed it.  +1 to wound is no joke on regular marines with 2 attacks base.  It actually made my opponent balk at trying to tie up my hellblasters at one point.  Plus what was nice was that when I charged his first unit with my primaris I got +1 to wound, then when he walked a chaos sorcerer over and charged in to help the survivors of turn 1, my primaris got the +1 to wound again, even against the chaos marines they charged the turn before.  

 

I'm waiting to see the full relic list, but having relic swords is good for the captains, and the standard for the ancient is pretty good (I haven't decided if it's better then the normal marine standard relic.)  Side note, used the command point relic and it got me exactly 1 command point back out of 6 tries...   One thing that really helps is the Sanguinary psychic discipline.  My opponents loathe me putting on the shield on my repulsor.  Absolutely awesome on the tank.  The +1 attack spell on a unit that's getting +1 to wound and already has 2 attacks very good in melee.  Plus the Aggressors getting an extra attack and wounding most tanks on a 2+ is great.   Just have to see the stratagems.  We know we get 2 of the more important ones for primaris from the space marine codex, Auspex scan and the combat squadding one.  Being able to advance a repulsor an extra 6" and fire 4 frag launchers freely and the rest with a -1 could be a good way to clear out a screening unit when needed.

 

Overall, I've enjoyed using my primaris even before we had the buffs and the one game I got the buffs showed that they helped.  I'm waiting for the full book, but I do think that the Blood Angels are one of the better chapters for full primaris right now.

 

Edited December 1, 2017 by Emissary

[Emissary]

 

librarian dread, i would've liked to see an option to do more attacks similar to the gorkanaut et al, but it seems good, with wings now.   

 

 

There is.   .  They mentioned a stratagem that gives a character +d3 attacks when they charge.

[ChapelXIII]

I am super pumped about the changes I am hearing. With the price drops I think I might be able to fit a whole other unit into my list.  I do feel bad about the way Dante is being treated, but his stats are still really good, and hopefully they will decrease his points as well. He is way over-costed for his utility. 

[Closet Skeleton]

 

 

Is that not Gravis? it looks it looks like a BA-ified version of the Dark Imperium Gravis captain. On the top half at least.

 

Other than the air support and DC marine no evidence of the regulars

It is gravis armor.

 

They have also clarified that Blood Angels do not get Centurions.

 

They also heavily hinted at a large angelic being around chrismas. IE, hint towards a primarch.

Tell me about this Angelic being. Exactly what was said?

 

 

Nothing, they were teasing the dark angels book and people in the chat got the wrong idea.

 

It is getting very tiring every time they move to a new section of the book revealing stuff already revealed in the warhammer community articles.

The guy being interviewed wrote the warhammer community article. His favorite stuff hasn't changed.

[Are Verlo]

Is the Lucifer engine stratagem advance 6“ or is it advance an extra 6“ on top of the normal d6 for advancing?

 

If it is an extra 6“ it will be fun to fill up with Scouts, a dc unit or two for that pre game move and spend some CP on rushing a transport ahead and use wings of fire. Combined with JPA and wings you can have most of your army at their doorstep turn 1. I’ll give it a try or ten.

 

Isolated it might not seem like gamechanging, but combined it looks pretty powerful imo

[JamesI]

Is the Lucifer engine stratagem advance 6“ or is it advance an extra 6“ on top of the normal d6 for advancing?

 

If it is an extra 6“ it will be fun to fill up with Scouts, a dc unit or two for that pre game move and spend some CP on rushing a transport ahead and use wings of fire. Combined with JPA and wings you can have most of your army at their doorstep turn 1. I’ll give it a try or ten.

 

Isolated it might not seem like gamechanging, but combined it looks pretty powerful imo

all it is is if you advance, don't roll, just ho an extra 6, unless you are a baal go 6 and roll.

[Irbis]

 

 

Who is the guy with fruit platter next to Gravis captain?

[Panda_Saurus_Rex]

 

 

 

Who is the guy with fruit platter next to Gravis captain?

 

 

 

On the stream they just mentioned it being Chapter Serfs. There is another one next to the Reiver.

[Are Verlo]

 

Is the Lucifer engine stratagem advance 6“ or is it advance an extra 6“ on top of the normal d6 for advancing?

 

If it is an extra 6“ it will be fun to fill up with Scouts, a dc unit or two for that pre game move and spend some CP on rushing a transport ahead and use wings of fire. Combined with JPA and wings you can have most of your army at their doorstep turn 1. I’ll give it a try or ten.

 

Isolated it might not seem like gamechanging, but combined it looks pretty powerful imo

all it is is if you advance, don't roll, just ho an extra 6, unless you are a baal go 6 and roll.

Well, anyway 18” and pop smoke with a rhino, DC «free move», on wings of fire, wings of sang, Scouts for troops and some units arriving from JPA still is decent.

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

Is the DC free move a pre-game thing only? That could be kind of pointless if you don't get turn 1...