Blood Angel Shoulder Pads

[Aothaine]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/11/27/chapter-focus-blood-angels/

 

 

So I'm a little confused here. The art work has the shoulder pads with black trim but the models have red trim. Was this just an oversight? Are they supposed to be trimmed in red or black?

 

Edit: It also might be a leather strap that is pinned to the trim as well.

Edited November 29, 2017 by Aothaine

[Xenith]

Same as shoulder pads for BA forever. Your choice.

 

Art and models are different.

[tkni]

Both are valid, tbh.

 

BA have always been shown with either red or black trim, though iirc in the early days black trim was more 'formal' and so regularly left off for combat:

 

 

We've bounced between the two since - think 2nd ed cover art or 3rd ed codex (black) or 5th ed codex (red) - but the current vogue seems to be all red trim. For those who (correctly) think black trim looks better though, it's entirely fine to use.

 

Either way, inverting for the sergeant (black pad, red trim, yellow/gold icon) remains the same.

 

[Aothaine]

Interesting that photo also seems to separate 1st, 2nd & 4th company from 3rd company.

 

Ohhh good to know about the sergeants. I'm pretty sure I'm laying down my Flesh Tearers for now. 

 

I wonder how people would react if I mixed the chapters up a bit. Built my assault troops as Flesh Tearers, Mixed the ranged guys up as Blood Angels, Angels Sanguine etc.. and ran them in units like Death watch. Hell eve the assault troops could be mixed.

 

You think people might throw a hissy-fit over that?

Edited November 29, 2017 by Aothaine

[m0nolith]

Art oversight.

They give a really good description of the way BA are "meant" to be painted lorewise, in the Sons of Sanguinius book that came out with the codex last edition.

They go down as far as individual squad markings.

 

Basically, 40k, red trimming, 30k, black trimming.

[Jolemai]

Trims be damned.

[Aothaine]

Thanks a bunch for the info! ^_^ Red trimming it is.

[BluejayJunior]

I go with the black trim. I like how it looks.

And it is different enough that I can say it a successor chapter. 

[Son of Carnelian]

Art oversight.

They give a really good description of the way BA are "meant" to be painted lorewise, in the Sons of Sanguinius book that came out with the codex last edition.

They go down as far as individual squad markings.

 

Basically, 40k, red trimming, 30k, black trimming.

 

I also recommend grabbing Sons of Sanguinius if you can find it. Goes into wonderful detail about the colors and organization of the Blood Angels. I've used it as a guide for all of mine.

[Pendent]

I ended up getting bored with the traditional scheme and am doing black pauldrons with gold trim on all of my Primaris marines. It really helps to break up the gigantic block of red.

[Crimson Ghost IX]

Interesting that photo also seems to separate 1st, 2nd & 4th company from 3rd company.

 

Ohhh good to know about the sergeants. I'm pretty sure I'm laying down my Flesh Tearers for now. 

 

I wonder how people would react if I mixed the chapters up a bit. Built my assault troops as Flesh Tearers, Mixed the ranged guys up as Blood Angels, Angels Sanguine etc.. and ran them in units like Death watch. Hell eve the assault troops could be mixed.

 

You think people might throw a hissy-fit over that?

 

I think they are your models and so paint them how you wish.

Most all players in my experience are cool with you spending time on your models, whatever you did to them.

The backstory right now has everybody coming together and defending Baal. There is a good reason for mixing chapters right there.

 

That being said IF Flesh Tearers get special rules and you want a detachment of them to use said rules you might regret having mixed them into your squads as it were.

 

Give it 10 days and decide then prolly =)

Edited November 29, 2017 by Crimson Ghost IX

[Panzer]

 

 

I wonder how people would react if I mixed the chapters up a bit. Built my assault troops as Flesh Tearers, Mixed the ranged guys up as Blood Angels, Angels Sanguine etc.. and ran them in units like Death watch. Hell eve the assault troops could be mixed.

 

You think people might throw a hissy-fit over that?

There shouldn't be a problem with it as long as you don't mix BA and Flesh Tearer specific things in your army (Dante and Seth for example).

 

However I'd advise against it even without considering the rules. It would make your units look incredibly busy.

 

EDIT: typing is hard!

Edited November 30, 2017 by sfPanzer

[Lord_Caerolion]

They use the same rules, it just depends on how the Codex utilizes the key words. I wouldn't have an issue with you using a combined-Chapter squad, it'll just lead to headaches if you have Dante with the Blood Angel keyword, Seth with Flesh Tearers, and have units split between the two key words.

 

Keep it consistent, and everything should be fine.

[Thoridon]

I have mostly BA units and a small selection of Flesh Tearers to go with Seth.

 

Some earlier games of 8th I ran 1-2 of my Flesh Tearers squads as part of an overall Blood Angels army (ie. all counting as Blood Angels) but that was just as I needed an extra 2 troop squads at the time and Seth wasn't being used, all my characters were either generic or BA-specific (Mephiston). 2 different sets of paintwork on the troops but they all used the main Blood Angels keyword that game.

 

If I had chosen to use Seth for that game instead of Mephiston I could've just said all units have the Flesh Tearers keyword, as again despite two sets of paint on the squads there would only be 1 special character tied to something specific.

 

If I used Seth and a BA special character (eg. Dante, Corbulo etc.) in the same game then I would use the paintwork to distinguish between the two chapter keywords.

 

By the rules I see no issue at all if you want to represent a bunch of successors in a BA army as long as all the characters are either generic (Captain, Librarian etc.) or only from 1 chapter. The only time it would be confusing is if you do want to run conflicting named characters, or if something in the Codex gives a specific bonus/strategem to different successors that you'd want to use.

 

As for the main topic, back in the 90s I was painting each squad with a different trim. I did remember seeing a lot of artwork with black trims back then, but after returning to the game the last couple of years I noticed all-red seemed to be the thing these days so when it came to repainting old models I just gave them red trims. I am half tempted to go and give them a black trim back as standard but we'll see. I'll be seeing what the new Codex has to say first.

[Spagunk]

My personal head-canon is that black trim is reserve companies, red trim is battle companies. So when I paint up non-sixth company marines, I do red on red. Only really have one devastator squad and two tactical squads to officially finish my 6th company though so most everything that isn't those are getting red on red.

[Aothaine]

Fair enough. Good points all around. So mixing the units with different chapter marines should be fine as long as I'm clearly stating that the units are all using the Blood Angels or Flesh Tearers or Angels Sanguine rules. I wonder if I can make this clear by my HQ choices. So I field Seth which means all of my marines are following Flesh Tearer rules. If I run Dante as my HQ then they are all following Blood Angel rules.

 

 

 

However I'd advise against it even without considering the rules. It would make your units look incredibly busy.

 

This is something that does concern me a little bit. Kind of reminds me of the old Britonnia line. They were hard to look at and did not look very neat on parade with all the clashing colors.

 

Do the chapters fight together in mixed squads in the book The Devastation of Baal?  If not, maybe this type of idea is not supported.

[Panzer]

Fair enough. Good points all around. So mixing the units with different chapter marines should be fine as long as I'm clearly stating that the units are all using the Blood Angels or Flesh Tearers or Angels Sanguine rules. I wonder if I can make this clear by my HQ choices. So I field Seth which means all of my marines are following Flesh Tearer rules. If I run Dante as my HQ then they are all following Blood Angel rules.

Yeah, but the problem is if you play two different subfaction detachments since the auras etc. wouldn't apply to all your units. Without having read our Codex we can't say how likely such a situation is tho.

So far only Seth would be a reason to do something like that but there might be a relic or warlord trait for Flesh Tearers as well which would make it much more likely to want to play a Flesh Tearers detachment together with a Blood Angels detachment.

 

 

However I'd advise against it even without considering the rules. It would make your units look incredibly busy.

 

This is something that does concern me a little bit. Kind of reminds me of the old Britonnia line. They were hard to look at and did not look very neat on parade with all the clashing colors.

 

Do the chapters fight together in mixed squads in the book The Devastation of Baal?  If not, maybe this type of idea is not supported.

 

Normally they'd fight together without mixing squads if it's not necessary. I haven't read Devastation of Baal yet tho but I imagine it's one of those situations were the need to mix squads could arise quickly. ^^

[BluejayJunior]

Fair enough. Good points all around. So mixing the units with different chapter marines should be fine as long as I'm clearly stating that the units are all using the Blood Angels or Flesh Tearers or Angels Sanguine rules. I wonder if I can make this clear by my HQ choices. So I field Seth which means all of my marines are following Flesh Tearer rules. If I run Dante as my HQ then they are all following Blood Angel rules.

 

 

 

However I'd advise against it even without considering the rules. It would make your units look incredibly busy.

 

This is something that does concern me a little bit. Kind of reminds me of the old Britonnia line. They were hard to look at and did not look very neat on parade with all the clashing colors.

 

Do the chapters fight together in mixed squads in the book The Devastation of Baal?  If not, maybe this type of idea is not supported.

The squads tend to be from the same chapter. Most chapters were assigned to specific areas of defense. Towards the end of the battle, when the defenses were crumbling and there were no longer clear battle lines, the chapters were much more mixed together. The book never states whether or not squads were intermingled from multiple chapters, but it wouldn't too far fetched. Everyone was so depleted at the time that it was more just one big mass of Space Marines anyway. 

[Thoridon]

Fair enough. Good points all around. So mixing the units with different chapter marines should be fine as long as I'm clearly stating that the units are all using the Blood Angels or Flesh Tearers or Angels Sanguine rules. I wonder if I can make this clear by my HQ choices. So I field Seth which means all of my marines are following Flesh Tearer rules. If I run Dante as my HQ then they are all following Blood Angel rules.

That'd seem fine to me - paint scheme is irrelevant when you only have 1 'chapter' keyword, it just makes an easy identifier when mixing chapters which is (currently) only necessary when using named characters that have their chapter keyword set. As far as I'm aware Seth is currently the only model with a set non-Blood Angels keyword.

 

As for looking busy, I suppose it depends what you want personally. You can always have one squad in BA colours, another in Flesh Tearers, another in Angels Sanguine etc. if it works for you and all could be used just fine in a Blood Angels army.

 

One other factor would be if the Codex introduces successor-specific rules (stratagems etc.) in which case you'd need different designated detachments if you want to run more than one chapter, but if everything you need can be covered by a single chapter keyword then it's entirely down to how you want your models to look.

Edited November 30, 2017 by Thoridon

[Aothaine]

Thank you everyone! Love the feedback here! 

 

Picking up the book "The Devastation of Baal" this weekend hopefully. I'm so eager to read it. The blended chapters sounds like it might be really cool to do. I'll just have to make sure I apply correct squad markings to them. 

 

For the terrain on that battle would I use that Mars terrain paint? The red desert looking paint? I wasn't able to find to much regarding what the planet looks/looked like.

 

Also, yeah I can see how some confusion would come across if I decided to run two separate detachments with different chapters or successors. I'll have to give this more thought... but I'm leaning toward the cool factor and just limiting myself to one chapter key word at a time. I like to be competitive but not WAAC. Though some of my ideas for lists might come across as WAAC in appearance. I play the battles out like movies in my head. Their my little army men! lol!

 

Now I just need to decide if I want to use Primaris bodies to create my entire force or if I should use the old sculpts. I have only primaris Devastator with heavy flamer made already but I can just shelf that dude if needed. If I do end up wanting to create a Primaris company and it would be cool if they were bigger than the old sculpts. Also, the old sculpts are pretty amazing. Decisions...decisions.

[Panzer]

Dunno about Baal but the moon dante comes from is covered in either huge salt deserts (so mostly white-ish) or stony regions.

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

I'm thinking about using the BA chapter pad on the right shoulder alongside the successor chapter shoulder pad on the left to recognize that we're more or less operating like a legion again under Dante...I think it'd be helpful in regards to running named characters with an army not necessarily painted BA red.

[Panzer]

An interesting idea. I might do something similar.

[Aothaine]

I'm thinking about using the BA chapter pad on the right shoulder alongside the successor chapter shoulder pad on the left to recognize that we're more or less operating like a legion again under Dante...I think it'd be helpful in regards to running named characters with an army not necessarily painted BA red.

 

Ohhhhh!!!! I like it! Hope you don't mind if I use it too!

 

So we would just use Blood Angel squad/company markings at that point then?

Edited November 30, 2017 by Aothaine

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

Go for it! :) 

 

 

I'm thinking about using the BA chapter pad on the right shoulder alongside the successor chapter shoulder pad on the left to recognize that we're more or less operating like a legion again under Dante...I think it'd be helpful in regards to running named characters with an army not necessarily painted BA red.

 

Ohhhhh!!!! I like it! Hope you don't mind if I use it too!

 

So we would just use Blood Angel squad/company markings at that point then?

 

Not at all :)

 

I imagine company and squad markings would still be based on the chapter's own traditions, but obviously that's up to the player- that's how I plan on going, anyway.