Competitive BA list discussion *Post-Codex*

[Pendent]

 

 

Any opinions on Sternguard? I liked them in vanilla marines at least. Great dakka.

I'm thinking I'll take a squad of 10 in a drop pod for my first list. I really like that strategem that gives them +1 to wound.

 

 

Not to shill too much for our lovable chapter master, but consider taking the old man for those hit rerolls! 

 

 

That's definitely got some potential but I don't intend to be deploying them near other stuff so I don't think they would be able to adequately protect Dante. If I use him he'll be deploying near other jump infantry.

[Jolemai]

 

 

Any love for the new units (re: hunter, Stalker, guntalon, inceptor).

 

Been contemplating fitting some in with my "mechnoughts". The hunter looks sick but have anyone used it?

Whilst I'm glad we have some AA and some cheaper Flyers, I have no idea what I think about them for the moment or how I'd use them...

Stormhawk looks great in red.

 

 

Photoshop, or it didn't happen

 

Oh, and #ce0018 please! Not #ff0000!

[tychobi]

We have work to do folks. 

 

Lets get out there and roll dice until we find the hidden glory at the bottom of this dark red drink that is our new Christmas reading.  Good luck to us all.  All in all its pretty good.  Not over the top op but got some punch.  I think we will see play at the top tables in some sort of imperial cheeze fest as we have some very nice stratagems.  Pure Blood Angel armies will have the power to compete mid tier and provide some very fun fiesty in your face close combat heavy 40k games.  I am stoked!

 

For Sanguinius!!!

[TheHarrower]

Man, I have been sitting here trying to come up with something I like for almost 2 hours. This isn't easy. :( Double Battalion is really hard to fit it in. I think I'll be running 1 Battalion and 1 Vanguard. Still mulling this over. I'll post when I have more.

[Charlo]

Really mulling over the Stormraven full of a few Jump DC, Lemartes & a DC Dread...

 

Would work quite nicely as a second wave for sure - is the Magna Grapple still 2" off the charge distance against a vehicle? If so you get a very mobile and competent threat range that can demolish a weaker flank easily. A Dakka Raven could even remove a lot of bubblewrap.

[BloodTzar]

No matter how hard I try to go for something original ;I do end up with either re-worked "old-DoA" list (ASM spam, some Vangs, buffer HQ, shooty backfield) or BA parking lot (razors, preds, buff HQ and some DeepStriking elements to distract back field) it feels like 5th ed has come back

Edited December 4, 2017 by BloodTzar

[hhhdan]

I think a lot of people overlook a very good combo of the jump librarian with wings of sanguinius and unleash fury + angel's wing. Deep strike him in with either a sanguinary guard blob or death company blob, use the power to jump closer to the enemy, tie as many of them as possible with him denying overwatch, then proceed to kill them with the buffed blob. 

 

Also a sanguinary guard, while doing less damage on a charge, is really good defensively, especially if there is an ancient with the standard of sacrifice that deep struck with them.

 

Only problem is having enough command points in the army imo. Which is why i'll be allying in a brigade of guard as a CP factory to give to the rest of the list to do their shenanigans

[Indefragable]

I’m REALLY liking the idea of SG buffed up with our new book. I think the trick is that you need a critical mass of bodies...6+ at least I think to have enough wounds to safely weather a round of shooting and give the Sang Priest a chance to get out the bandaids. The thing to remember about SG is that they have decent dakka as well. I have mostly plasma because of the Index, but even Angelus Boltguns are not bad at all.

 

Trick with SG is that they are a bit of a horseshoe, IMO: either 4 man bully units that go off and harass or a giant bomb unit buffed up. I think if you go in between you just get throttled.

[Remtek]

Giving this a go tomorrow, it's a bit tight fitting everything in a brigade, 10th company rejoice! No ranged anti tank, but plan is to remove screens and chaff units with whirlwinds and scouts/scout bikers turn 1 and support them with either DC or vanguard  then keep SG and one more unit in reserve once. 

 

Captain w Jump Pack TH/Stormshield

Mephiston

Libby Dread

5 Scouts, close combat

5 Scouts, close combat

5 Scouts, close combat

5 Scouts, close combat

5 Scouts, close combat

5 Scouts, close combat

Scout bike Squad, powersword

Scout bike Squad, powersword

Scout bike Squad, powersword

14 Death Company, JP, 3 Thunderhammers, 3 swords, all with bolters

5 Sanguinary Guard, swords/fist

10 Vanguard Vets 3 stormshield,1 powersword, jump packs, rest double chainsword

Whirlind Castellan Launcher

Whirlind Castellan Launcher

Whirlind Castellan Launcher

[Blindhamster]

I feel like that is going to struggle to deal with armoured opponents and also struggle with shooty armies that stick back, a bit too CC orientated IMO.

[Chaplain Gunzhard]

Still doing the character conga-line for buffs though, and that blows. I wish at least the ancient was part of the unit. Edited December 4, 2017 by Chaplain Gunzhard

[TheHarrower]

Here's what I think I'm going to try first.

 

Battalion

Libby, sword, jump pack

Priest, sword, jump pack

5 scouts, snipers

5 scouts, close combat

5 Tac

5 Devs, 2 LC, 1 HB, Cherub

5 Devs 2 LC, 1 HB, Cherub

 

Vanguard

Mephiston

10 Vanguard Vets, jump pack, relic blade, 2 power swords, 3 storm shields, 7 dual chainswords

12 Death Company, jump pack, 2 hammers

DC Dread, blood talons, storm bolter, meltagun

Stormraven, asscans, melta, hurricane bolters

10 Assault, jump pack, thunder hammer, 2 infernus pistols

 

I really like the strat for hellfire shells. D3 mortal wounds if you hit. Use a signum to hit on a 2+. Relics I think jump pack, and veritas vitae. Thoughts?

[Morticon]

Here's what I think I'm going to try first.

 

Battalion

Libby, sword, jump pack

Priest, sword, jump pack

5 scouts, snipers

5 scouts, close combat

5 Tac

5 Devs, 2 LC, 1 HB, Cherub

5 Devs 2 LC, 1 HB, Cherub

 

Vanguard

Mephiston

10 Vanguard Vets, jump pack, relic blade, 2 power swords, 3 storm shields, 7 dual chainswords

12 Death Company, jump pack, 2 hammers

DC Dread, blood talons, storm bolter, meltagun

Stormraven, asscans, melta, hurricane bolters

10 Assault, jump pack, thunder hammer, 2 infernus pistols

 

I really like the strat for hellfire shells. D3 mortal wounds if you hit. Use a signum to hit on a 2+. Relics I think jump pack, and veritas vitae. Thoughts?

Id find points for meltaguns over IPs 

Go one hammer, 2 axes in DC. 

 

Also, no Banner? Tacs have gear? Switch a las out from devs, to Tac? 

[SM1981]

One thing I find interesting is the number of attacks a DC unit can now churn out..I don't know if this is true, but the Mini War Gaming review of the book stated that there is an option to take DC with 2 chainswords, which churn out up to 7 atacks a model... This also ties with what the community page said about a DC unit of 15 being able to churn out over 200 attacks if played right (15×7=105 ×2 for strategem = 210). That weight of dice kills most things. Especially if you pair them with some sort of re-roll.

 

Does that make the army competitive by itself? No, but it certainly will be fun.

[TheHarrower]

 

Here's what I think I'm going to try first.

 

Battalion

Libby, sword, jump pack

Priest, sword, jump pack

5 scouts, snipers

5 scouts, close combat

5 Tac

5 Devs, 2 LC, 1 HB, Cherub

5 Devs 2 LC, 1 HB, Cherub

 

Vanguard

Mephiston

10 Vanguard Vets, jump pack, relic blade, 2 power swords, 3 storm shields, 7 dual chainswords

12 Death Company, jump pack, 2 hammers

DC Dread, blood talons, storm bolter, meltagun

Stormraven, asscans, melta, hurricane bolters

10 Assault, jump pack, thunder hammer, 2 infernus pistols

 

I really like the strat for hellfire shells. D3 mortal wounds if you hit. Use a signum to hit on a 2+. Relics I think jump pack, and veritas vitae. Thoughts?

Id find points for meltaguns over IPs 

Go one hammer, 2 axes in DC. 

 

Also, no Banner? Tacs have gear? Switch a las out from devs, to Tac? 

 

 

Wanted the banner bad, but couldn't fit it in. I've never had such a hard time doing a list. Having fun trying to figure it out though. Moving a las to tac makes sense as does the hammer and 2 axes in DC. I really like Meph, but putting him in there pretty much says you need to pay a libby tax since you aren't taking unleash rage or shield on meph. I'll try and squeeze in meltaguns. I was thinking of combat squading the assault. 5 in the raven with meph and the 5 with anti vehicle weaponry for dealing with tanks.

[TheHarrower]

One thing I find interesting is the number of attacks a DC unit can now churn out..I don't know if this is true, but the Mini War Gaming review of the book stated that there is an option to take DC with 2 chainswords, which churn out up to 7 atacks a model... This also ties with what the community page said about a DC unit of 15 being able to churn out over 200 attacks if played right (15×7=105 ×2 for strategem = 210). That weight of dice kills most things. Especially if you pair them with some sort of re-roll.

 

Does that make the army competitive by itself? No, but it certainly will be fun.

It's rubbish. You can't double chainsword DC.

Edited December 4, 2017 by Jolemai
Swear filter dodge

[9x19 Parabellum]

....

For Heavy Support, either Devs or Predators for that delicious dakka or go auxiliary-Tacticals by running 65pf Dev squads naked. You lose OBSEC but their role is to hide on backfield Obj and die as slow as possible. SM are still great at that with 2+ save in cover. Heck, even a single heavy weapon on them is great due to the Sgt’s Signum.

 

This is a great idea, Indefrag, and bloody brilliant for filling out a Spearhead on the cheap.  Another thought I had, but don't have my C:SM book with me, so maybe someone else could answer for me.

 

Could you take a Devastator squad, put 1 heavy bolter in it, + armorium cherub, and in combination with the Signum, would  you be able to, by using the armorium cherub, effectively be able to doulbe-tap the Hellfire Shells stratagem in a single turn?  (not by paying for the stratagem twice in a turn, which I know is illegal), but rather by deviously 'triggering' the stratagem twice in the turn because of how the wording is affected between the ArmCher and the Stratagem.

[9x19 Parabellum]

 

Any love for the new units (re: hunter, Stalker, guntalon, inceptor).

 

Been contemplating fitting some in with my "mechnoughts". The hunter looks sick but have anyone used it?

I'm on the look out for a discount Hawk/Talon if I find one, but I've got other stuff to paint before they'd become something I'd buy at even webstore prices.

 

The Hunter/Stalker I'm torn on as the Hunter looks better, but the stalker seems more effective, so I wouldn't be happy building either.

 

 

I've been using a Hunter in my Raven Guard lists.  You get a super reliable and tough-as-hell lascannon for 90 points.  At T8, it's a moveable wall for your infantry to hide behind.  It's served me well in my RG, but it might even be better for BA as a screen for infantry or jump infantry to hide behind.  It's fairly low price for filling out a HS slot for a spearhead too.

[Morticon]

One thing I find interesting is the number of attacks a DC unit can now churn out..I don't know if this is true, but the Mini War Gaming review of the book stated that there is an option to take DC with 2 chainswords, which churn out up to 7 atacks a model... This also ties with what the community page said about a DC unit of 15 being able to churn out over 200 attacks if played right (15×7=105 ×2 for strategem = 210)

 

I could be misunderstanding, but seems you're working off of faulty info. 

 

There's no x2 (or attacking twice) DC. 

Also, no dual chainswords. 

 

You can get 6 attacks if you're lucky though (with DC or with double-sword Vanvets). 

 

DC 2 base +1 for charge +1 for chainsword + 1 for Rage (libby power) + 1 For Sanguinor 

 

or

 

Vanvet 2 base +2 for chainswords + 1 for Rage (libby power) + 1 For Sanguino

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

So right now I'm looking at something along the lines of

 

Battalion 1-

HQ:

Death Company Captain - thunder hammer/SS/Angel's Wing - give him the +1D warlord trait

Lemartes

 

Troops:

3x5 Intercessors

 

Elites:

3x7 DC - JP, fist, sword, all bolt pistols/chainswords (I am not going back and hacking everyone's hands off to give them bolters...)

 

Battalion 2-

HQ:

Some kind of librarian...?

Sanguinary priest with JP (?)

 

Troops: 3x5 Intercessors

 

Fast Attack: 3x3 Inceptors - all plasma

 

Intercessor gunline with Death Company and Inceptor alpha strike is the general concept- I am a bit worried by the lack of dedicated anti-tank and am scratching my head as to which HQs I should be running apart from the top 2 (might give the libby angel's wing instead of the captain, but I'm thinking with the right strategems the captain could be the more dangerous option).

 

I am aware that I could potentially add another 2CP to this list if I were to scrounge up the points for 2 more HQs- don't really see that happening unfortunately.

[Morticon]

 

 

Any love for the new units (re: hunter, Stalker, guntalon, inceptor).

 

Been contemplating fitting some in with my "mechnoughts". The hunter looks sick but have anyone used it?

I'm on the look out for a discount Hawk/Talon if I find one, but I've got other stuff to paint before they'd become something I'd buy at even webstore prices.

 

The Hunter/Stalker I'm torn on as the Hunter looks better, but the stalker seems more effective, so I wouldn't be happy building either.

 

 

I've been using a Hunter in my Raven Guard lists.  You get a super reliable and tough-as-hell lascannon for 90 points.  At T8, it's a moveable wall for your infantry to hide behind.  It's served me well in my RG, but it might even be better for BA as a screen for infantry or jump infantry to hide behind.  It's fairly low price for filling out a HS slot for a spearhead too.

 

Solid advice there, thanks.  

[Blindhamster]

 

One thing I find interesting is the number of attacks a DC unit can now churn out..I don't know if this is true, but the Mini War Gaming review of the book stated that there is an option to take DC with 2 chainswords, which churn out up to 7 atacks a model... This also ties with what the community page said about a DC unit of 15 being able to churn out over 200 attacks if played right (15×7=105 ×2 for strategem = 210)

 

I could be misunderstanding, but seems you're working off of faulty info. 

 

There's no x2 (or attacking twice) DC. 

Also, no dual chainswords. 

 

You can get 6 attacks if you're lucky though (with DC or with double-sword Vanvets). 

 

DC 2 base +1 for charge +1 for chainsword + 1 for Rage (libby power) + 1 For Sanguinor 

 

or

 

Vanvet 2 base +2 for chainswords + 1 for Rage (libby power) + 1 For Sanguino

 

 

 

not entirely true, we do have the 3CP fight twice strategem that codex marines have.

[Charlo]

 

 

 

Any love for the new units (re: hunter, Stalker, guntalon, inceptor).

 

Been contemplating fitting some in with my "mechnoughts". The hunter looks sick but have anyone used it?

I'm on the look out for a discount Hawk/Talon if I find one, but I've got other stuff to paint before they'd become something I'd buy at even webstore prices.

 

The Hunter/Stalker I'm torn on as the Hunter looks better, but the stalker seems more effective, so I wouldn't be happy building either.

 

 

I've been using a Hunter in my Raven Guard lists.  You get a super reliable and tough-as-hell lascannon for 90 points.  At T8, it's a moveable wall for your infantry to hide behind.  It's served me well in my RG, but it might even be better for BA as a screen for infantry or jump infantry to hide behind.  It's fairly low price for filling out a HS slot for a spearhead too.

 

Solid advice there, thanks.  

 

I thought it would have the negative against ground target but it doesn't.

 

So you get BS 3+ re-rollable (4+ re-roll on the move) Lascannon that can be a pain in the butt for your opponent too!

[9x19 Parabellum]

 

 

 

 

Any love for the new units (re: hunter, Stalker, guntalon, inceptor).

 

Been contemplating fitting some in with my "mechnoughts". The hunter looks sick but have anyone used it?

I'm on the look out for a discount Hawk/Talon if I find one, but I've got other stuff to paint before they'd become something I'd buy at even webstore prices.

 

The Hunter/Stalker I'm torn on as the Hunter looks better, but the stalker seems more effective, so I wouldn't be happy building either.

 

 

I've been using a Hunter in my Raven Guard lists.  You get a super reliable and tough-as-hell lascannon for 90 points.  At T8, it's a moveable wall for your infantry to hide behind.  It's served me well in my RG, but it might even be better for BA as a screen for infantry or jump infantry to hide behind.  It's fairly low price for filling out a HS slot for a spearhead too.

 

Solid advice there, thanks.  

 

I thought it would have the negative against ground target but it doesn't.

 

So you get BS 3+ re-rollable (4+ re-roll on the move) Lascannon that can be a pain in the butt for your opponent too!

 

 

Correct.  And if you consider a devastator squad, minimum with 1 lascannon and a signum is 90 pts, it's basically the same offensive output (minus the bolters).  For the same price you get:

 

faster movement

higher toughness

much more wounds

moveable cover

 

but you lose:

chapter tactic

ability to benefit from cover,and thus, armor save

less dakka (boltguns)

 

it's been the sneaky ace in several of my lists, and almost always makes up it's points.  The fact that it has it's own rerolls means I can put it outside the captain bubble and it's still reliable, which is useful for scoring objectives, etc.

[Charlo]

I think it starts to fall over a touch when you compare to a Predator...

 

Four Lascannons for just over 200 Points, compared to one reliable one for 24 Melta Bombs...

 

Strangely though, the Hunter is T8 while the Pred is only T7, quite a big difference in the scheme of things!