Disappointed

[Helycon]

Deathwing assault could be quiet a useful staragem for clearing screening units as from the look of it its done when the models are set up from deepstrike.

 

So deepstrike terminators plus belial if you want rerolls. Use staragem to fire remove the screening unit. Then you (hopefully) can set up your knights even closer to the enemies valuable units for the charge.

 

Or did I hear it wrong?

 

Seen a lot of people all ready moaning about the codex, while I don't fully disagree with what they are saying, I'm instead trying to find out fun little synigies we can try to use to get the most out of what we have been given.

 

Captain

I'm looking forward to the codex too. It doesn't look too powerful and we received a lot of flexibility.

 

The new psychic powers seem decent and combo well of certain things.

 

Most of the strategems seem to costly for what they do though. While I like your tactic there, I do feel using two CP's is going to be too expensive.

[Chaplain Lucifer]

Gotta say guys

Deathwing still sucks. They got nothing. No deathwing specific rule except auto pass morale (useless most of he time with rerolls anyway and 5 man squads) and bonus against Fallen. Whoppdeedooo. Sorry deathwing players. Your models still suck. Double shoot on strike is good but 2CP? Not worth it. Have fun killing guardsmen or cultists that regenerate.

Deathwing was never for the faint hearted and I played them when they had much worse rules. You should try them and see how they can be surprising even without not having the best rules. They're just fun and challenging to play!

[RayJ]

I like splashing a RW Apothecary into an otherwise pure DW force. For 20 points more than the DW one, he's a LOT more useful. Azrael was great for them to keep Land Raiders and Dreads alive and kicking, but we won't be able to use that in a week :(

[Helycon]

Ravenwing Apothecaries are amazing, even better with improved Jink. It basically means every unit in 20" has the opportunity to be healed or reinforced if needed, whilst he can still shoot with a great weapon and will be hard to kill.

 

Azrael is still going to be a great HQ, he won't be as mandatory though, which is good for variation and makes you feel like you're not gimping yourself when you don't use him. Besides, just grab a Deredeo dread with an Automatic Pavise instead. It's not a bad model to have, since people complain about autocannon dread all the time, and this model has better ones, whilst also having some heavy bolters to boot. Works well with Grim Resolve too!

 

After watching the Striking Scorpion Review and Winters SEO review, I feel like we're getting a solid codex, with nothing that stands out as broken. The relics are OK, but nothing amazing, the Psychic powers are mostly usable and sometimes great. The Warlord traits are underwhelming though, with the CP returning one as an auto take really. The whole immune to morale is nice, but they went overboard with it, making some abilities, who on there own would be lovely, feel useless.

 

I feel we're in a good sweet spot of powerful, but not bonkers. It's where all codices SHOULD be really.

 

Now to wait for the physical copy to arrive, together with some Stormravens, another Darkshroud, some preds to killshot stuff, a 10-man Hellblaster unit and the new lieutenant, because he looks great.

[dtse]

Dropping a leviathan in a pod with two storm cannon arrays and giving it deathwing keyword and using double shoot. That will wreck some stuff but is a 4-5 CP 400 point combo.

 

10 black knights with a master advancing and shooting with +1 plasma damage will take almost anything out in one turn.

 

Stack plasma cannon devs next to a master and lieutenant and banner.

 

Anything involving darkshroud and 3 fire raptors

 

Deathwing knights and..... sorry guys got nothing there. Not even a deepstrike strategem or homing beacons or anything

[Loar]

Yeah I can't believe teleport beacons didn't make it in as at least a stratagem.  It's such an obvious one and already exists with Tau.  The fluff in both the index and codex still talks about it directly that it is just odd to see it excluded.

[Berzul]

Deathwing assault could be quiet a useful staragem for clearing screening units as from the look of it its done when the models are set up from deepstrike.

 

So deepstrike terminators plus belial if you want rerolls. Use staragem to fire remove the screening unit. Then you (hopefully) can set up your knights even closer to the enemies valuable units for the charge.

 

Or did I hear it wrong?

 

Seen a lot of people all ready moaning about the codex, while I don't fully disagree with what they are saying, I'm instead trying to find out fun little synigies we can try to use to get the most out of what we have been given.

 

Captain

If this is how Deathwing Assault works, I can totally understand the cp cost. Being able to clear screens as you drop, to allow an ever deeper deepstrike, sounds pretty good.

[Irbis]

Not sure why everyone is surprised, it’s DA. It’s traditional for them to be the worst Marine codex.

 

Yeah, because Deathwatch totally doesn't exist, eh?

 

How about the "Fury of the Ancients" strat that is copy-paste from the SM codex.  1 cp to give a reroll hits of 1 bubble to a dreadnaught for a turn, usually employed so a Dread can sit babysitting in the backfield and buff other firebase units, despite the fact that Grim Resolve as our main chapter trait basically does this already??  I know they playtested this but it sure doesn't feel like it.

 

You can advance your whole gunline forward, drop FotA, and retain bonus. I fail to see how it is useless in any shape or way. Most stratagems are situational, they are not supposed to be straight upgrades.

 

I like how DA got two traits from IG book people cried about for months as being OP, in even better versions (namely, Cadian trait and Commissar rules), massive buffs to best Imperial special weapons, best SM fire support vehicle in game (that also buffs your own units and cannot be shot at), on top of it also SM flyers and termies (despite the fact they were the only thing making SM book distinct and DA already had their special snowflake variants of both, better ones at that, making addition completely unnecessary on top of being not fluffy as it was added to DA portion that was supposed to be least Codex compliant one, making it ironically more compliant) and people still say it's somehow terrible. DW and 6 out of 9 SM chapters called, we would gladly swap for such 'bad' rules

[Lord_Ikka]

Its not the codex I hoped for, but I can work with it. It feels like GW is trying to force DA players to use RW, DW, and greenwing all together, rather than as individual armies. Don't really know if that was their intent, but it definitely feels like they want you to have a couple units of greenwing gunline, a Ravenwing biker/Black Knight unit, and a Deathwing teleport strike unit in an army.

 

Converting my 30k DA to 8th ed is now possible, as my Cataphracts can now be used, so that is nice.

[Orkinstein]

Wait, someone mentioned that if DW stratagem allows them to shoot in moving phase...then they can target enemy characters!

[Helycon]

Wait, someone mentioned that if DW stratagem allows them to shoot in moving phase...then they can target enemy characters!

That sounds like something an FAQ would fix, pretty sure this was never intended. Cyclone missile launchers would be SO OP at that point :D .

 

The more I think of it, the bigger the chance of Russ returning is. Since Primarch are now a thing, and I reckon they'll try to keep it balanced between the two, he makes the most sense. Their codex is still coming, he's still angry at Magnus and the rift in the warp just free to catastrophic levels, making it easier to pop out.

 

I for one look forward to seeing him, since he's a great and colourful character as well.

[Elios Harg]

Wait, someone mentioned that if DW stratagem allows them to shoot in moving phase...then they can target enemy characters!

It says as if it were the shooting phase. So no loophole.

[Loar]

 

I like how DA got two traits from IG book people cried about for months as being OP, in even better versions (namely, Cadian trait and Commissar rules)

 

 

It's not the rule itself.  Its how those rules interact with extremely cheap and expendable bodies and the mechanics of how 8th works that made it abusable and overpowered.  You saw it dominating most tournaments (which IG still do well at) and GW stamped down on it largely, so they agreed with the players that it was broken.

 

On DA those rules are much less problematic.  More expensive units with already overlapping morale abilities in a codex full of reroll 1's (or better) bubble HQs already means its has a negligible impact overall.

[Loar]

Dropping a leviathan in a pod with two storm cannon arrays and giving it deathwing keyword and using double shoot. That will wreck some stuff but is a 4-5 CP 400 point combo.

 

 

 

That's a really cool idea, expensive but cool.  I wen't and checked the stratagem and It says you have to use the teleport strike ability to activate it, so don't think it will work unfortunately.  Bummer :(

[Brother-Captain Sharp]

Loar's got it. That was my first though as well, but Leviathans wouldn't arrive as a teleport strike. Best we could do would be take a 10 man squad to try ans get as much chaff clearing as possible.

 

Throw in some Sanguinary Guard in a BA patrol to hit after the DW and fharge with 3d6, and you might have a stew brewing.

[Interrogator Stobz]

I am not the least bit disappointed, it's situation normal, all GeeDubbed up.

 

I'll be trying stuff like:

Stormraven with Asscannon, HvyBolter, two Hurribolters and missiles carrying a twin Stormcannon Leviathan Dread, Five DWKnights and Belial, all supported by a couple of RW Lt Speeders with Sammael and a couple of Darktalon and protected by a DarkShroud. Mix in a few BlackKnights for big stuff damage too.

 

Hell depending on cost I might fit in a couple of troops ;) Mix and match as desired, I guess it all comes down to how everything washes out next week.

Seeing as how many of our incoming strats do stuff we already do, I plan to battle without them. (They will still be used, just used as the situation requires).

 

Be flexible, be like the Lion.

 

:D

Stobz

[Ishagu]

Aren't Dark Angels better just by virtue of getting sruff like the Storm Raven?

Now units like Deathwing Knights and Dreadnoughts have a faster form of transportation.

 

I think this codex might be more subtle in it's combinations than the BA book. They were very much geared towards reliable, early turn assaults and effective combat.

 

DA have a mixture of abilities and special units that can create a more effective and hard to hit shooting army that has access to some nice melee and speed based units on top.

[Interrogator Stobz]

We will be better off, in many ways and yes some of them will be subtle.

Maybe some of those ways will not be as some of us would like, that is the game we play.

 

I Like It.

[Charlo]

Entire army getting to re-roll 1s shooting and taking minimum casualties from morale is nice for a gun line.

 

DW seem fun and flexible as ever.

 

RW are speedy as hell.

 

Seems quite good to me!

[Ishagu]

Entire army getting to re-roll 1s shooting and taking minimum casualties from morale is nice for a gun line.

 

DW seem fun and flexible as ever.

 

RW are speedy as hell.

 

Seems quite good to me!

It's a more dispersed set of bonuses, which can be more difficult to work with. On the other hand it could be superior as you can build armies with different play styles.

 

I think BA are being revealed to be stronger than initially assumed which is great, and as I mentioned before they are an easier chapter to which you can build a list from that sticks to theme and bonuses.

[dtse]

My point was that yea. If I wanted to play three storm ravens and stuff like that I’d be better off taking guilliman gunline and call it a day. I was hoping the codex would really emphasize the synergy that deathwing and ravenwing have and allow us to compete with those two. Unfortunately it just doesn’t pan out I don’t think. I’m gonna try it obviously. But I can already see how any elite ravenwing or deathwing list loses miserably to my guard list.

 

So yea. It’s better than index but tbh that’s a low bar. I was thinking that GW might put more effort into one of its more popular legions but I guess not. Copy paste codex ftl

[FarFromSam]

Not happy, but this grim resolve beats the over watch nonsense of prior editions... and at least our storm shields aren't 4++. Could be way way worse.

 

I'm concerned more about the collector's edition.

It Screams,

"Throw a different cover on it, give em a ribbon and shiny edges, and they'll pay twice as much."

 

"Then we can sell them primaris, and storm ravens to boot."

 

Could be much worse... could be better. In the end, if the dex is no fun... they're still marine models, and heresy or not I've run them as emerald marines, or green blooded angels, or chaos.

 

Looking forward to having the book in hand. Thankful they're churning out new books so quick, hopeful this wasn't rushed.

Edited December 10, 2017 by farfromsam

[Frater Cornelius]

@ Loar - Giving the DW keyword to a Raider or Dread allows them to benefit from Belials full re-roll. It is quite alright.

[Stoic Raptor]

All I've ever asked for with Dark Angels is the ability to play them the way they are written in the fiction - Ravenwing speed to the objectives and Deathwing teleports down to their location, guns blazing.

At least we have a stratagem for Deathwing Assault, but it's been a while since we've really been able to play the intended synergy between Ravenwing and Deathwing.

[Trunkello]

As i watch the leaks over and over again i have more trust in this codex. Deepstriking 10 dw termies with belial and a librarian? Reroll hits with belial, 80 bolter shots 24 ac shots with strategem then using the librarians warlord trait to reroll charge and a psyhic ability to reroll all wound rolls. Also one of the relics is pretty powerful if i understood it correctly : if an enemy character is within 3 inch of the bearer, the enemy can only fight last wether he charged or not. What?! Mortarion charging into the deepstriking termies or deathwing knight blobs while this relic is nearby? Good bye morty. I am not a tournament player so propably the meta will only change from azrael with razorbacks to azrael with hellblasters but some of this stuff im really exited about to use. Also we can try to use these psyhic stuff with overlapping ld bubbles. Like the relic i mentioned gives -1 ld. An interrogator chaplain also. Some psyhic stuff also giving better chance to cast those. Also if the Sacred Standard rule of the chapter ancient is what i think it is(models getting killed then up on a 4+ can fire on bs and ws 2+), then it just make our hellblasters more devastiting (overcharging the plasma one last time with azraels reroll for more hilarity). Edited December 10, 2017 by Trunkello