New Codex fluff - Blood Angels still making normal Marines

[Blindhamster]

It's true, we always had dreadnoughts from the heresy. The one in the nightlords trilogy is pretty cool *sniffle*

[vahouth]

Does it say how many Primaris are in each Company? I'm almost 70% of building mine and I would like to know how many primaris there are in which squads.

[Blindhamster]

nope, no indication

[sockwithaticket]

i actually suspect that the change may be related to the push back against primaris in general.

 

They wont abandon the concept because they've clearly put a lot of money into it, however I could easily see them scaling back how far primaris goes compared to what they might have originally planned.

 

I feel like for every person that likes them, there are about 5 that dislike them, and probably only a fraction of the people that like them actually love them, whereas a larger % of people that dislike them hate them. Just a gut feel from the reactions I see online about them and from chatting to people at gaming clubs.

It's interesting you feel that way because my perusing of the internet leads me to feel the inverse on their reception!

 

I wouldn't say I hate them, but I'm definitely not a fan. A lot of that is the fear they're being primed to make my lovingly collected regular marines redundant, then you throw on other stuff like GWs bizarre new wargear restriction policy and, yes, the fluff...

 

The most elegant solution would be to have them co-exist and that fluff snippet would seem to indicate this is happening beyond simply allowing the power armoured remnants to fight and be replaced as they fall. Perhaps because they're not the panacea to the flaw that they were hoped to be.

 

 

[sockwithaticket]

2. Why haven’t we been able to use Contemptors until now, then? Oh that’s right, b/c now they’ve finally decided to let us use them and turn a profit <eye roll>.

 

Carry on.

Do not ascribe to malice what can be explained through incompetence. Contemptors (and the Terminator patterns) only became available to codex marines more than halfway through 7th. They should have been available to everyone from the start (including DA and Wolves who were also left out), but I think they either misguidedly wanted to do yet another thing to distinquish vanilla from the divergent chapters or quite simply didn't appreciate how daft fluffwise it was for these chapters not to have access. Its definitelt something people raised and now they've fixed it. This is not a bad thing.

[Petitioner's City]

 

- They have successfully maintained a number of contemptor dreadnoughts up to the current day.  The oldest of these  contain ancient brothers who fought at the battle of terra at the side of Sangunius!

Interesting, so Björn isn't special anymore.

 

 

One of those kinds of ancient dreadnoughts was in the Night Lords trilogy (in a piece of small world syndrome) - i have always thought there were more than Bjorn. (Although in my head the chapters consist of 10000 marines, just to give them a better sense of scale   )

 

 

 

2. Why haven’t we been able to use Contemptors until now, then? Oh that’s right, b/c now they’ve finally decided to let us use them and turn a profit <eye roll>.

 

Carry on.

Do not ascribe to malice what can be explained through incompetence. Contemptors (and the Terminator patterns) only became available to codex marines more than halfway through 7th. They should have been available to everyone from the start (including DA and Wolves who were also left out), but I think they either misguidedly wanted to do yet another thing to distinquish vanilla from the divergent chapters or quite simply didn't appreciate how daft fluffwise it was for these chapters not to have access. Its definitelt something people raised and now they've fixed it. This is not a bad thing.

 

 

 

And those options were always avaialble via FW, at least with the dreads. 

 

As for the armour, I find it rediculous GW restricts their weapons - when those options are available via FW. 

Edited December 10, 2017 by Petitioner's City

[vahouth]

Ehmmm...

 

[Xenith]

I'm just unsure why they seem to think rending traitors limb from limb is extreme. Seems an appropriate reaction to me. 

[Blindhamster]

With bare hands (intercessors don't carry melee weapons) so literally tearing enemies apart is extreme even for BA.

[Panzer]

Yeah. :D

They are Space Marines who aren't exactly subtle in approach but tearing enemies from limb to limb barehanded is a bit extreme if a Bolter round to the head would've been enough. :D

[Xenith]

With bare hands (intercessors don't carry melee weapons) so literally tearing enemies apart is extreme even for BA.

 

Tycho's been doing it for years - and the 4th ed Death Co rules gave them rending to reflect this. 

 

I'm sure Calgar tears people's arms off all the time.

 

As long as they weren't already dead, and the Primary Marines didn't eat the bits afterwards, it's nothing out of the ordinary.

EDIT:

 

Ok, maybe it's not out of the ordinary for the death company.

 

The Primaris seemed ok when with Guilliman away from the BA. Maybe it's some Gene curse that hangs around the chapter, or the mad radiation from Baal actually turns people into crazy cannibals by it's very nature?

 

That makes a lot of sense, actually. The BA stemmed from "The Tribe of Pure Blood", who raised themselves above the scavengers and cannibal mutants - demi humans who ate the flesh of the living.

 

How ironic that the BA, in taking their recruits from the pure blooded, turn them into those very madmen they feared when they were mortal.

 

#bestchapter 

Edited December 10, 2017 by Xenith

[Aothaine]

 

With bare hands (intercessors don't carry melee weapons) so literally tearing enemies apart is extreme even for BA.

 

Tycho's been doing it for years - and the 4th ed Death Co rules gave them rending to reflect this. 

 

I'm sure Calgar tears people's arms off all the time.

 

As long as they weren't already dead, and the Primary Marines didn't eat the bits afterwards, it's nothing out of the ordinary.

EDIT:

 

Ok, maybe it's not out of the ordinary for the death company.

 

The Primaris seemed ok when with Guilliman away from the BA. Maybe it's some Gene curse that hangs around the chapter, or the mad radiation from Baal actually turns people into crazy cannibals by it's very nature?

 

That makes a lot of sense, actually. The BA stemmed from "The Tribe of Pure Blood", who raised themselves above the scavengers and cannibal mutants - demi humans who ate the flesh of the living.

 

How ironic that the BA, in taking their recruits from the pure blooded, turn them into those very madmen they feared when they were mortal.

 

#bestchapter 

 

 

Perhaps. They were primaris marines that were not born of and trained in the history of Baal though. Could also be that they were having a laugh while Big Brother Corbs watched over their shoulder. Would be nice to get some humor into the mix.

Edited December 10, 2017 by Aothaine

[Panzer]

 

The Primaris seemed ok when with Guilliman away from the BA. Maybe it's some Gene curse that hangs around the chapter, or the mad radiation from Baal actually turns people into crazy cannibals by it's very nature?

 

That makes a lot of sense, actually. The BA stemmed from "The Tribe of Pure Blood", who raised themselves above the scavengers and cannibal mutants - demi humans who ate the flesh of the living.

 

How ironic that the BA, in taking their recruits from the pure blooded, turn them into those very madmen they feared when they were mortal.

 

#bestchapter 

 

It's nothing new that the Red Thirst gets triggered by others suffering from it being nearby. ^^

[pandion40]

I seem to recall ADB saying he killed off the Heresy era BA Dreadnought in the night lords trilogy specifically so he didn’t impact Bjorn, but it was a long time ago so I don’t remember for sure.

 

Another thing I heard was the carcharodons have a 3000 year old librarian, a guy on a podcast said this so it’s second hand info and I don’t know where he got it, though I think it’s from a novel. If it’s true I’m not happy with whoever created him as he takes away from Dante.

 

I think we’ll eventually see a Primaris Death Company but I think there’s a good chance it won’t just be Primaris in black armour, I just hope they don’t go to far, I can live with them adding wings or something like that to the unit but please god don’t let GW go all wolfen on them. That really doesn’t fit us.

[Panzer]

We also don't know how sane the HH era Dreadnoughts of the BA, no? Could be that they are little more than machines now while Björn has still most of his personality.

 

I'd bet money that the Carcharodons don't have a 3k year old Librarian. At least not outside of a Dreadnought or whatever. GW keeps repeating that Dante is the oldest Space Marine alive.

[pandion40]

We also don't know how sane the HH era Dreadnoughts of the BA, no? Could be that they are little more than machines now while Björn has still most of his personality.

 

I'd bet money that the Carcharodons don't have a 3k year old Librarian. At least not outside of a Dreadnought or whatever. GW keeps repeating that Dante is the oldest Space Marine alive.

Hope so i was not happy when i heard it, but it was on a podcast and they've gotten things wrong in the past. I'm hoping someone here disproves it.

[Blindhamster]

everything has Dante as the eldest marine not interred in a dread.

[Bonzi]

BA are making Primaris & Scouts both. Your chapter has been decimated and handed the job to protect and resecure the far side of the galactic rift. You have one factory than can produce X amount of superior marines per year. You have a second factory that can produce X amount of good marines per year. The answer is obvious, demand is high and you put both factories into production. Edited December 10, 2017 by Bonzi

[vahouth]

everything has Dante as the eldest marine not interred in a dread.

Also being that old is explicitly mentioned as a "side effect" of the flaw.

[Knight of the Raven]

*The stripped-down power armor worn by Reivers is called MK X Phobos armor. I think in the Space Marine Codex it was called "MK X Reiver", but I'll accept this minor retcon if it gives us a more creative name.

That makes sense, since phobos means fear in Ancient Greek.

 

*Despite their usefulness, many Blood Angels see the stealth and terror tactics of the Reivers as dishonorable.

This is in line with the old Index Astartes articles, where there are tensions between Blood Angels and Raven Guard for this very reason.

 

Re: the differences between Devastation of Baal and the Codex. They're not surprising once you realize Games Workshop only told Guy Haley to include Primaris, not what to actually do with them.

 

Q – So did you pitch The Devastation of Baal, or did you get commissioned to do it?

A – I was commissioned to write Dark Imperium and The Devastation of Baal at the same time. But I was given free choice as to what they would be about. They both had to feature Primaris Space Marines in some capacity – that was the only stipulation.

Source: Devastating Baal, with Guy Haley

[Lord_Caerolion]

Plus, in regards to Bjorn, we know that the Blood Angels Contemptors have some Marines that took part in the Siege of Terra, but Bjorn was already a Captain/Wolf Lord when the Heresy fully broke out, and had personal interactions with his Primarch. Our eldest Dreadnoughts could have just been recent recruits who fought on the walls, and saw Sanguinius in passing a few times, and maybe saw him fight in the distance on Terra. Bjorn's specialness isn't just from his age, it's from how close he was to the figures of legend. He literally interacted with Russ, and spoke with him. We know he's the oldest, but not by how much. It's just been kinda assumed that noone else even came close to his age, rather than actually established in fact.

[Panzer]

Nah fresh recruits wouldn't have been put into Dreadnoughts unless they did something especially heroic.

[The Unseen]

Nah fresh recruits wouldn't have been put into Dreadnoughts unless they did something especially heroic.

Everyone started out as a fresh recruit.

Being recently inducted on Terra doesn't mean they didn't go on to become Heroes worthy of internment later on.

[Lord_Caerolion]

They helped defend the Imperial Palace, and were one of the survivors of the conflict that brought the Blood Angels from the full-size Legion of roughly 80/90,000, or whatever Forge World lists it as, down to around 4,000 or so, given how few successor Chapters the Blood Angels formed. I'd say any injured in that conflict to the point of being interred into a dreadnought had earned that right.

 

I'd say it's sufficiently heroic to be "Brother Bob, who despite his youth, held the Atrium of the Emperors Might against the savagery of the World Eaters single-handed, only succumbing to his injuries once the Adeptus Custodes were able to reinforce his position, preventing a breakthrough of Traitor forces into the Inner Palace".

[Panzer]

Fair enough. I assumed you meant actual fresh recruits who got turned into dreadnoughts.