Effective troop slot

[BloodTzar]

Hello brothers,

 

while going trough our new codex, I have realized - as most of you; that our codex is CP-greedy thus we need to build our lists around. TO be able to fill in 3xTroops slot, I wonder what is the most effective option?

 

5xTac + Las = 90

5xScouts Camo Sniper = 90

5xINTERCESSORS=90 

5xScouts = 55 (bolters vs. shot guns)

 

 

I mean what in vacuum is the most optimal choice for our CC oriented army? In order to get into borderline of 9CPs what would be your troop choice?

Thank you i advance

~BT

[Pendent]

I would say that there's really no "in a vacuum" answer to that question- all three have strengths and weaknesses right now.

Intercessors are extremely tough and synergize well with the Red Thirst due to their 2 base attacks. They lose the special weapon shooting but 30" ap-1 bolters are nothing to sneeze at. I'll personally be running these.

Tactical marines let you take the special weapons and so can help shore up other weaknesses in your list. A few lascannons can come in really handy, obviously. They're also the least effective at screening of the three- half the wounds of Intercessors but without the board control of a scout.
 

Scouts are cheap and can be really useful for board control due to their special rule. With knives they're even decent in assault, again due to the Red Thirst. I suppose sniper scouts are also an option but they're just too expensive for me- I'd definitely go blades these days.  They're also fragile compared to our other options so running out of bodies is a very real concern.


I am actually toying with the idea of a dual battalion, one with Intercessors and one with Scouts. That extra CP would be nice, we have good HQs, scouts are cheap and would help to mitigate alpha strikes.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Pendent

[Panzer]

I'd say 3xScouts either with Bolter or CCW are the best choice. Cheap, quick at the enemy lines to deal with chaff units and pack a decent punch.

 

3xIntercessors are not bad either but a bit more defensive.

3xTacs with a Lascannon each is a very good choice as well if you are in need of some more anti-tank stuff.

[9x19 Parabellum]

My standard troop loadout for small-mid size game will probably be something like:

 

2x5 scouts with combat blades and bolt pistols

1x5 tacs with heavy bolter (for hellfire shells stratagem)

 

I don't have any intercessors yet, but they are also solid for us.

 

I would also avoid the sniper scouts as I think they are too pricey for what they do.

[Panzer]

The hellfire Stratagem is really cool as well, yeah.

[Xenith]

Take one of each.

 

Don't forget camo cloaks for the cc scouts. Intercessors also have as many attacks as the cc scouts and double the wounds and shots.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Xenith

[Charlo]

Take one of each.

Aye this seems a good, balanced approach.

 

Scouts forward

Primaris Mid

Tacs Back

[tychobi]

All good choices with differing roles. Msu scouts are my go to.

 

I like 5 cc with a plasma pistol sarge. Also 4 sniper rifles and a missile no cloak s. 4 shotguns and a thunder hammer sarge charging out of my raven was fun. For their points scouts put huge pressure on opponents from the get.

 

Only drawback is aggressive use winds them up dead a lot. Still fun aggressive effective and economical are all great qualities to have in a Blood Angel troop slot.

[Actionmike]

agree with the above posts. CC scouts for board control and pressure. Incessors for fire line and back field objectives, MSU tacs in razors for mobility and special weapons.

 

Ill be running 10 cc scouts, 2x MSU Plas, combiplas, Power sword tacts in ass assault cannon razorbacks. for my battalion.

I have a 5 man sniper scout squad but its only for fun, they never kill much.

[Subsided]

This is going to sound awful..

 

I've used sniper scouts in multiple games in the past and they've let me down everytime.

 

I am currently popping off arms and changing x5 to CC/Bolt pistol and x5 to Boltguns. (I have shotguns as well if this is a better option)

 

Can anyone tell me how to effectively use these in your experience with the new load outs? Do you put them 9" from their deployment? Or just far enough they can walk up and do their thing?

 

Any tactical tips will help a ton. 

 

 

[Withershadow]

A pair of scout battalions.

 

Regarding camo sniper scouts, the rifles are pretty lame, but it gives that unit something to do while it sits in cover on an objective all game.  They may do some damage with the missile launcher, and if you get lucky with the sniper rifles great; if not, you didn't pay that much for them anyway.

[9x19 Parabellum]

This is going to sound awful..

 

I've used sniper scouts in multiple games in the past and they've let me down everytime.

 

I am currently popping off arms and changing x5 to CC/Bolt pistol and x5 to Boltguns. (I have shotguns as well if this is a better option)

 

Can anyone tell me how to effectively use these in your experience with the new load outs? Do you put them 9" from their deployment? Or just far enough they can walk up and do their thing?

 

Any tactical tips will help a ton. 

 

Many have said, and I tend to agree, that Sniper Scouts are just not worth it. I think maybe if you spammed a whole army of 6x10 with a captain and lt. to rerolls your hits and wounds, they coudl probably do quite a bit of work and the mortal wounds they'd kick out would be funsies, but I just can't justify their big points to hope for some random mortal wounds here and there.  The other problem with Sniper scouts is that they effectively forfeit their scout deployment ability, because why the hell would you put them that close to the enemy when they can shoot from 36" away?

 

As for how to use CC scouts or shotgun scouts, I think the situation will determine where they go. If you need to bubblewrap because your opponent has a strong alpha strike, then you put them on your own flanks and spread them out to gobble up real estate and deny enemy deepstrike locations.  If not, scout deploy them 9" away in cover (and preferably behind some LOS blocking terrain) and get a 1st turn charge on a tank (to make it fall back) or something similiar, or send them in after chaff, hitting on 3's and wounding on 2's/3's.  The beauty of them is they're versatile and cheap.

A pair of scout battalions.

 

Regarding camo sniper scouts, the rifles are pretty lame, but it gives that unit something to do while it sits in cover on an objective all game.  They may do some damage with the missile launcher, and if you get lucky with the sniper rifles great; if not, you didn't pay that much for them anyway.

 

Meh. I'd rather take a tac squad with a lascannon to get some work done (same pts) or a heavy bolter (fewer pts), and I don't lose any armor save if I have to move them out of cover.

Edited December 11, 2017 by 9x19 Parabellum

[Xenith]

This is going to sound awful..

 

I've used sniper scouts in multiple games in the past and they've let me down everytime.

 

I am currently popping off arms and changing x5 to CC/Bolt pistol and x5 to Boltguns. (I have shotguns as well if this is a better option)

 

Can anyone tell me how to effectively use these in your experience with the new load outs? Do you put them 9" from their deployment? Or just far enough they can walk up and do their thing?

 

Any tactical tips will help a ton.

What are you trying to do with them other than hold an objective?

 

How many are you using?

 

I primarily take snipers to put them on an objective that my opponent then has to try and remove them from. Any damage they do is bonus.

Their presence may cause your opponent to be cautious with their character deployment.

[Subsided]

 

This is going to sound awful..

 

I've used sniper scouts in multiple games in the past and they've let me down everytime.

 

I am currently popping off arms and changing x5 to CC/Bolt pistol and x5 to Boltguns. (I have shotguns as well if this is a better option)

 

Can anyone tell me how to effectively use these in your experience with the new load outs? Do you put them 9" from their deployment? Or just far enough they can walk up and do their thing?

 

Any tactical tips will help a ton. 

 

Many have said, and I tend to agree, that Sniper Scouts are just not worth it. I think maybe if you spammed a whole army of 6x10 with a captain and lt. to rerolls your hits and wounds, they coudl probably do quite a bit of work and the mortal wounds they'd kick out would be funsies, but I just can't justify their big points to hope for some random mortal wounds here and there.  The other problem with Sniper scouts is that they effectively forfeit their scout deployment ability, because why the hell would you put them that close to the enemy when they can shoot from 36" away?

 

As for how to use CC scouts or shotgun scouts, I think the situation will determine where they go. If you need to bubblewrap because your opponent has a strong alpha strike, then you put them on your own flanks and spread them out to gobble up real estate and deny enemy deepstrike locations.  If not, scout deploy them 9" away in cover (and preferably behind some LOS blocking terrain) and get a 1st turn charge on a tank (to make it fall back) or something similiar, or send them in after chaff, hitting on 2's and wounding on 3's.  The beauty of them is they're versatile and cheap.

A pair of scout battalions.

 

Regarding camo sniper scouts, the rifles are pretty lame, but it gives that unit something to do while it sits in cover on an objective all game.  They may do some damage with the missile launcher, and if you get lucky with the sniper rifles great; if not, you didn't pay that much for them anyway.

 

Meh. I'd rather take a tac squad with a lascannon to get some work done (same pts) or a heavy bolter (fewer pts), and I don't lose any armor save if I have to move them out of cover

 

 

Oh? What makes them hit on 2's or is that a typo? Anyone have any pref is shotgun vs Boltgun or is that really just a looks thing if you abuse their 9" deploy?

 

We play mostly matched play missions. I can see snipers being better is Tac Obj cards tho. So sometimes (the relic) they arent useful at all. Speaking of "The Relic" can a scout deploy on it and pick it up?

 

 I have 10 scout models. I've proxy tested 15-30 snipers before.

 

Oh? What makes them hit on 2's or is that a typo? Anyone have any pref is shotgun vs Boltgun or is that really just a looks thing if you abuse their 9" deploy?

Edited December 11, 2017 by Subsided

[9x19 Parabellum]

Sorry, subsided, that was a typo. Fixed it.

[Subsided]

Sorry, subsided, that was a typo. Fixed it.

No worries just making sure! I got super excited for a second and had to check the codex (having never used melee scouts it could have been true!)

 

My usually Brigade is x6 5 man tac squads for wrap/front line. It's neat but it's not being as effective as I had hoped. (granted the last two matches I've played had Celestine flying up 24" away BEFORE the charge and murdering marines.. :() 

[9x19 Parabellum]

 

Sorry, subsided, that was a typo. Fixed it.

No worries just making sure! I got super excited for a second and had to check the codex (having never used melee scouts it could have been true!)

 

My usually Brigade is x6 5 man tac squads for wrap/front line. It's neat but it's not being as effective as I had hoped. (granted the last two matches I've played had Celestine flying up 24" away BEFORE the charge and murdering marines.. ) 

 

 

What size game are you playing that you're fielding a brigade?

[Subsided]

We play 2k games. A brigade is a test run for CP. Not the most optimized for sure. It does allow me to test more units at once (x2 melta Assaults, Dev squads vs preds for instance)

 

But I'll likely do some weird Battalion x2/x x1 something for 10 CP.

[Emissary]

I'm running 2 battalions in 2k games right now.  First one has 3x5 intercessors.  2 with bolt rifles and a AGL and the 3rd has auto bolt rifles and an AGL.  My 2nd battalion has 3x5 scouts with bolters.  Basically to do the onion thing for my contemptor mortises devastators in the middle.

[Kaughnor]

I think tac squads with a melta gun and chain sword melta bomb serg really work well with the red thirst. It's a cost effective chaff unit that is really flexible.

[Aothaine]

Does that auto hit ability that whirlwinds have work with land speeder storms? If so, that could be a really good way to fill up troops. 

 

Scout Squad (Bolter x3(4 if the sergeant can have one) then a heavy bolter in a land speeder storm with heavy bolter giving auto hits to Whirl winds. I'd use that in a heartbeat.

 

Edit: Ahhh it is a stratagem. Still... If you're a fan of whirlwinds.... does a land speeder storm work? If it does that is pretty darn good imho.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Aothaine

[The Unseen]

If your running a double battalion, why not run a brigade?

Tarantulas are cheap and good, and min dev squads or rapiers are also good.

Your taking HQS and Elites anyway.

[brother_b]

I've been playing scout snipers. They need to be fielded in a 10 man group, with or without missiles. I've found with that many I consistently deal out mortal wounds. I place them in elevation in the rear backfield. A five man sniper squad is not worth it. I also love shotgun scouts.

[ThatOneMarshal]

I’ve been really eyeing primaris marines, how are intercessors for camping an objective?

[Brother Crimson]

Had good experiences with intercessor. You pay for additional wound and attack but gladly that extra attack has some use with red thirst.