Specialist Games making a return

[Saxxon the Dragoon]

For all the 'sperging over the primaris and the lore, you cannot deny that the changes to the game have been an incredible boon to both GW bottom line but also for the hobby in general. With fresh new blood getting into the hobby thanks to all the new models, news and talk in the hobby (and giving us long time vets of the game new models to play with, regardless of how crotchety some of you are about them) but it also means something else. The return of specialist games in the 40k universe.

 

Considering most specialist games died out after the last big boom and bust that happened after 4th edition (which we had BFG, Epic, Inquisitor and a few other things) and the massive influx of capital and interest for the hobby again, what specialist games are you looking out for or want to make a return?

 

We already know Battlefleet Gothic is making a comeback (which my SM fleet is going to love) and with help from the BFG Armada computer game (its excellent, seriously check it out) it looks like GW and possibly FW is going to take it seriously as an addition to the hobby.

 

I dont see Epic making a comeback anytime soon though, unless GW is willing to retcon or start chugging out models for things that arent around anymore or havent had rules in forever (looking at you slaanesh subjugator).

 

We have also seen GW dabble with the idea of PnP RPG's like Inquisitor, Dark Heresy and the like, and considering the resurgence of DnD, as well as narrative campaigns and rules in 8th edition and chapter approved, its not too difficult to see more PnP stuff in the near future.

 

Not to mention the smaller skirmish games GW has been pushing out that you can use models in with the same tabletop models.

 

 

It is said that the health of GW is the health of the hobby industry. When times are good, things are really good. When times are rough, a lot of smaller hobby companies disappear off the map and GW closes stores all over the place and secondary shops have to hold the line for our hobby.

 

So whats your thoughts on specialist games making a comeback and which would you like to see make a return or what new specialist game would you like to see GW put out in the 40k realm?

[Bryan Blaire]

Well, Adeptus Titanicus is going to be coming out at some point, and Necromunda is already out.

 

Here's a good list of games: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/341855-list-of-wh40k-setting-other-games/

[Lord Marshal]

I was excited for Battlefleet Gothic until it the talk of being a Heresy-era game started, because what Games-Workshop needed was more Space Marines vs Space Marines when the original game had such a diverse range of models and rules. 

 

Blood Bowl has been solid thus far. I'm glad to see it thriving and the support continue.

 

What I've read about the new PnP (Wrath and Glory?) does not sound promising to me personally (dice pools? meeting lore figures? fighting primarchs?) but at least we still have the stellar Fantasy Flight Game... games.

Edited December 29, 2017 by Brother Tyler

[Seahawk]

I sincerely hope Battlefleet Gothic comes back as the 40k game it is, and not set in the crappy 30k era (Worst. Era. Ever.). That'd totally ruin the game.

 

GW's annoucement was two years ago, and we've gotten two SG so far. So far we've already had a preview of Titanicus and nothing for BFG, so more likely than not we'll see that sooner.

[Toxichobbit]

 

I sincerely hope Battlefleet Gothic comes back as the 40k game it is, and not set in the crappy 30k era (Worst. Era. Ever.). That'd totally ruin the game.

 

I couldn't agree more. I don't begrudge people who enjoy the 30k era, but the constant demand that every game orbiting the main 40k system (like BFG) be set in 30k is tiresome. I've even seen posts that Necromunda and Inquisitor should be resurrected as 30k games (one of those is firmly set in 40k, at least).  It's really not a very interesting setting, unless you love Marines so much that you want Marines with your Marines so you can Marine while you Marine. The almost complete lack of army variety* (in aesthetics, not play style) is one of the reasons I'm unlikely to touch 30k, despite about 75% of my 40k collection being Marines. So while I'd like to see BFG make a return, I'd rather it stayed dead than came back as BFHH. I'm sad about Titanicus being 30k, but while I miss an Epic equivalent set in the 41st Millenium, Titanicus (and later Space Marine) started life as the original HH game so I fully understand and support that decision. In fact, I may even pick up the new Titanicus despite it being 30k, because Titan vs Titan is a much more intersting concept to me than Marine vs Marine.

 

*with the exception of the excellent Mechanicum range and the under-developed Solar Auxilia range, everything feels Marine, Marine and more Marine.

[Brother Tyler]

Let's not turn this into a bashing of the Horus Heresy setting.

 

Also, despite several very fine Specialist Games in other settings, the discussion here should focus on those set in the Warhammer 40,000/Horus Heresy settings.

 

Battlefleet Gothic is my first pick for a game that I'd like to see brought back, and it should (in my opinion) remain firmly rooted in the current WH40K time period (so pushing it forward to the Dark Imperium - lots of room for the older BFG line as well as "new" vessels like the Terminus Est). I'd love to see a Horus Heresy expansion later.

 

GorkaMorka would also be great fun. This game would also provide a good impetus to create some very interesting Orky creations that might find their way into WH40K.

 

Truth is, I'd love to see the full range of Specialist Games brought back, with Aeronautica Imperialis added into that range.

 

More importantly, I'd love to see continued support for all of the Specialist Games (now grouped under the moniker of "Boxed Games").

[Saxxon the Dragoon]

Let's not turn this into a bashing of the Horus Heresy setting.

 

Battlefleet Gothic is my first pick for a game that I'd like to see brought back, and it should (in my opinion) remain firmly rooted in the current WH40K time period (so pushing it forward to the Dark Imperium - lots of room for the older BFG line as well as "new" vessels like the Terminus Est). I'd love to see a Horus Heresy expansion later.

 

Truth is, I'd love to see the full range of Specialist Games brought back, with Aeronautica Imperialis added into that range.

 

More importantly, I'd love to see continued support for all of the Specialist Games (now grouped under the moniker of "Boxed Games").

 

I dont have a problem with them adding 30k to BFG, and include alien fleets/ships that dont exist anymore in the 40k universe to fill in slots that the Demiurg, T'au, Tyranids and Necrons would otherwise fill. But 40K needs to be the primary focus for BFG, the armies that are at war in the here and now. Seeing new ships for primaris chapters (since belisarius cawl cant use older STC tech for his primaris, i bet he is an Iphone user), seeing chaos ships become even more corrupted and possessed, adding more ships to Necrons and T'au and bioforms for Tyranids. We are seeing new models and stories for 40k tabletop, we need progression in the naval engagements too. Not to mention an update for Mighty Empires for planetary campaigns would be nice.

 

I always keep forgetting about Aronautica Imperialis (I liked the idea but the models were so expensive, and thats coming from someone with warhound titan and elysian drop troop army), but the downside to it is that the models are large and you still have to build/paint them. If GW wants to get in on that game again, they are going to have to go the way of X-Wing, Star Trek attack wing, and DnD wing games and have the models pre-built/pre-painted and will have to 'epic' size the game somewhat since the aircraft are so massive if you were to use them in the tabletop (which is something good GW has been doing, allowing you to use models from TT or boxed games unto other boxed games).

 

One good thing thats come about from the model inflation since AI (which was 4th/5th edition) first came out is that so many more aircraft have been added to the game. Space Marines actually have interceptors, gunships and the like outside of the Thunderhawk. When AI came out, all you had was imperial navy, eldar, ork and maybe some tau stuff. Everyone else was screwed if you wanted to get into it (no necrons, no marines, almost nothing of tau and only a few eldar ships until a later expansion). So if they wanted to do AI, they would either make sure ALL current flyers for the TT game would be usuable, or create a whole new line of models that you wouldnt be able to use on the TT and hope that people care enough about it to get into it. The attack wing style games are getting a little crowded, but there is a chance for 40k to make a return to it. They just gotta make sure its a lot more accessible. The AI book from ForgeWorld back then was almost $60 after shipping and tax, and the models each were something like $80 a pop, and had their own special bases and you couldnt use them in a 40k game.

 

 

They seriously need to invest in manufacturing in the US. The shipping costs from Britain to the US is incredibly expensive (and even worse for places like australia). I just put in a large order for a couple of contemptors (space wolves for my wife, salamanders for me) with arms and cyclone launchers, sicaran omega destroyer, a techmarine (because GW cant be bothered to have standard tech marines anymore) and a few other bits. I was only going to order the contemptors and techmarine until after the shipping cost kicked in, and ended up adding the sicaran and some other bits to the order to get free shipping because it would cost only somewhat more and come a week sooner. Thats another problem with FW specialist games, with shipping and tax it adds a massive chunk to the cost of an already expensive hobby.

Edited December 29, 2017 by Saxxon the Dragoon

[Brother Tyler]

Aeronautica Imperialis was the Forge World game using Epic scale. The models were actually pretty small, but coming in resin, expensive. If the game were to be rolled into the Specialist Games range, we would be far more likely to see the models released in plastic.

[Saxxon the Dragoon]

Aeronautica Imperialis was the Forge World game using Epic scale. The models were actually pretty small, but coming in resin, expensive. If the game were to be rolled into the Specialist Games range, we would be far more likely to see the models released in plastic.

 

Considering FW seems to have a pretty strong grip on their IP for models/games, I dont see them just handing it over to GW to turn them into plastic without some kind of kickback. Especially with how notorious GW own resin line turned out *notably shudders at the thought of finecast*, I actually went back and bought the pewters of Castellan Crowe and Draigo because the finecasts I got of them were terrible.

 

In order for GW to compete against other attack wing style games, its going to have to copy the wok of those games. which means prepainted and prebuilt, and effectively epic scale (similar to the original release), but that would be at odds with all the other boxed games they have come out with where you could take the models from one boxed game to another. Old school fans probably wouldnt have a problem with AI coming back, but I dont think the new blood coming into 8th would appreciate buying into another specialist game that they cant take their models from and use them on the tabletop in 30k/40k. And with how expensive the hobby keeps getting year after year, you cant blame people for wanting to get more use out of their models.

[Brother Tyler]

I have five counters to that:

 

Mk III Space Marine Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Mk IV Space Marine Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Cataphractii Tactical Dreadnought Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Tartaros Tactical Dreadnought Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Contemptor Dreadnought - Forge World/Citadel

 

Forge World doesn't "have a pretty strong grip on their IP for models/games." They are part of Games Workshop; and Games Workshop neither needs nor gets a kickback from themselves. And Games Workshop isn't (or wouldn't be) purely competing with other game systems if they brought back Aeronautica Imperialis. That game is a decent standalone game, but better as an augmentation to Epic and as a bridge between Epic and Battlefleet Gothic. It's an aerospace tabletop miniature wargame that works within the demographic of hobbyists that enjoy the rest of Games Workshop's line of games. The main problem with Aeronautica Imperialis was that, being tied to Forge World and its expensive hardback books and resin models, the game had limited exposure within the community and high prices. Shifting over to the Specialist Games range and moving to plastic, especially if they make it viable as an augmentation to Epic and give it a starter set with paperback rules and plastic models, would open the aperture up quite a bit.

 

Don't get me wrong, Aeronautica Imperialis is low on my list of games I'd like to see. If Games Workshop brings Epic back, though, I think that modifying Aeronautica Imperialis to serve as an augmentation (not truly an expansion, but more of a complementary game that can be used to additionally expand Epic) would be a viable option. Personally, I think that flyers are much more appropriate at the Epic scale than the WH40K scale. And there is a time-honored tradition of aircraft wargames among traditional wargaming hobbyists (I fondly remember playing the old Red Baron game as a youth) that are seriously gapped in this hobby (Battlefleet Gothic is surface naval warfare in space). Aeronautica Imperialis, while a good game on its own, would only do well if Epic was around first. Under the right conditions, though, it could succeed far better as a Specialist Games/Boxed Games redux than under the aegis of Forge World.

[Saxxon the Dragoon]

I have five counters to that:

 

Mk III Space Marine Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Mk IV Space Marine Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Cataphractii Tactical Dreadnought Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Tartaros Tactical Dreadnought Armour - Forge World/Citadel

Contemptor Dreadnought - Forge World/Citadel

 

Forge World doesn't "have a pretty strong grip on their IP for models/games." They are part of Games Workshop; and Games Workshop neither needs nor gets a kickback from themselves. And Games Workshop isn't (or wouldn't be) purely competing with other game systems if they brought back Aeronautica Imperialis. That game is a decent standalone game, but better as an augmentation to Epic and as a bridge between Epic and Battlefleet Gothic. It's an aerospace tabletop miniature wargame that works within the demographic of hobbyists that enjoy the rest of Games Workshop's line of games. The main problem with Aeronautica Imperialis was that, being tied to Forge World and its expensive hardback books and resin models, the game had limited exposure within the community and high prices. Shifting over to the Specialist Games range and moving to plastic, especially if they make it viable as an augmentation to Epic and give it a starter set with paperback rules and plastic models, would open the aperture up quite a bit.

 

Don't get me wrong, Aeronautica Imperialis is low on my list of games I'd like to see. If Games Workshop brings Epic back, though, I think that modifying Aeronautica Imperialis to serve as an augmentation (not truly an expansion, but more of a complementary game that can be used to additionally expand Epic) would be a viable option. Personally, I think that flyers are much more appropriate at the Epic scale than the WH40K scale. And there is a time-honored tradition of aircraft wargames among traditional wargaming hobbyists (I fondly remember playing the old Red Baron game as a youth) that are seriously gapped in this hobby (Battlefleet Gothic is surface naval warfare in space). Aeronautica Imperialis, while a good game on its own, would only do well if Epic was around first. Under the right conditions, though, it could succeed far better as a Specialist Games/Boxed Games redux than under the aegis of Forge World.

While you arent wrong in that recently GW has been getting some things that were only in the purview of FW, you have to remember that back when GW previously launched BFG, outside of the initial release everything else was from forgeworld. Wanted tau, space marines or anything other than eldar, chaos and imperial navy you had to get from forgeworld.

IA was entirely forgeworld, and had no support from GW. You couldnt even order, much less expect a GW location to stock the imperial armor books either. You had to either go to a bunker (if one was near) or just order it yourself and hope others around played.

 

Its really good that GW has been adding FW models/ideas and turning them into plastic that you can purchase off the shelf, and even better that not only has GW embraced forgeworld, they are even updating points to FW models in CA. It does look like the partnership between GW and FW is in a much better place than it was 10 years ago (when FW models were banned from tournies and having legal rules for models was a serious headache). But I have also noticed FW has discontinued a lot of their models (no repressor, no lucius or other pattern titans to name a few).

 

I do agree that adding AI to Epic would be a pretty good idea. Aircraft in support of titan and tank formations is pretty logical and the scale of war would be much more appropriate. But GW would have to take full control over its release, with FW doing alternate patterns or additional support craft in resin with experimental/pdf rules. If it goes like it did last time as an entirely FW managed release (and near the prices of its original release and shipping) its going to be another dead specialist game. The base game is going to have to be plastic, and its going to have to be supported for a good period of time. The support from FW after the expansion book for AI was utterly dead after initial release (party because not enough people knew about or played it, partly because it was incredibly expensive to get a squadron of anything to play).

 

Personally BFG is going to be my specialist go-to game, but I do hope that Epic+AI goes well too.

[Seahawk]

A quick way they could "rerelease" AI is via Bommers Over Da Sulfur River. Bring back that box, include IN and Ork flyers in plastic and rules to play on the board or just on a table, and move on from there.

[Eddie Orlock]

Bring back that box, include IN and Ork flyers in plastic and rules to play on the board or just on a table, and move on from there.

Having mucked about with a bunch of Epic stuff in the last few years, what I'll tell you is that the old Epic aircraft and those from AI that nominally match are dramatically different in size. Like twice the wingspan different. Which means to make the Sulphur River work we'd need to rescale the boards. Not a huge deal, just a thing to note.

 

The original 'Epic' scale for aircraft wasn't the same as the original scale for ground vehicles, thus the changed it for AI so the could do things like make T-Hawk transporters with underslung armour without making yet another scale of Land Raider.

 

While I'm skeptical on what neo-epic would bring, I think the way to do it would be to make several modules that could eventually interlace together.

 

A titan game that deals with titans, AI for planes, and 'Primaris Marine' for mass combat of a bunch of the rest of the stuff and a fourth module that would cover off bolting it all together. Probably a ten year odyssey of game development though.

[Toxichobbit]

While you arent wrong in that recently GW has been getting some things that were only in the purview of FW, you have to remember that back when GW previously launched BFG, outside of the initial release everything else was from forgeworld. Wanted tau, space marines or anything other than eldar, chaos and imperial navy you had to get from forgeworld.

 

I think your memory is playing tricks. As stated above AI was Epic scale on release (I have the rulebook and some of the FW models) and every race you mention in the above post was released in metal, by GW (sometimes in addition to FW) as well as several other races.  GW supported BFG fantastically well with new races and ships, until they disolved Specialist Games that is. Back then Specialist Games was GW, not FW and the rules were written by members of the GW design team (and later on I think trainee rules designers) while the models were sculpted and cast by the GW team. With the exception of AI (and maybe some other games I've forgotten) FW just made alternative/supplementary models for specialist games, exactly like they do with 40k and Fantasy/AoS.

 

BFG Marines were originally a GW release. The release consisted of the Battle Barge and Strike Cruisers and came out not long after BFG released (within 6 months I think, but I'd have to dig out old WDs to confirm). Originally they used Imperial Navy escort rules. Later FW released Marine styled variants of the Navy escorts for Marine players as well as Marine fighters, bombers and assault boats (aka, Thunderhawks ). Later still, with the release of Battlefleet Armageddon GW released Marine escorts. They shared the name of the FW versions (Gladius, Hunter & Nova) but had unique rules rather than just being re-named versions of Navy escorts.

 

Battle Barge in GW packaging.

 

Strike Cruiser in metal (i.e. not FW resin).

 

GW and FW versions of the Marine escorts. From left to right: GW Hunter, FW Hunter, GW Nova, FW Nova, GW Gladius, FW Gladius.

 

FW Thunderhawk Gunships (I think these are the originals. If not, I have a couple of stands I got from FW years ago and they looked just like this).

http://www.bishco-post.com/Pics/EOT/BFG/ThunderHawks.jpg

 

I think T'au were GW first then FW later (though the GW versions were ugly IMO) but there's a good chance I'm getting mixed up and they were FW first. Either way, they weren't FW only.

 

GW T'au (GW's T'au Escorts are with the Kroot, Nicassar & Dark Eldar below).

http://www.solegends.com/citcat2005spc/c2005spcp0064-00.jpg

 

The much nicer FW T'au.

 

In addition to the two you mention, GW also did:

 

Orks.

http://www.solegends.com/citcat2006us/c2006usp0843-00.jpg

 

Tyranids (why GW, why! They look like someone poured glue into a Tyranid bits box ).

http://www.solegends.com/citcat2005spc/c2005spcp0063-01.jpg

 

Dark Eldar, Kroot and Nicassar.

http://www.solegends.com/citcat2005spc/c2005spcp0065-02.jpg

 

Necrons, random Imperial system ships & Imperial stations.

http://www.solegends.com/citcat2004/P0935-00.jpg

 

Imperial Defense Platforms

http://chaosorc.com/images/Battlefleet%20Gothic%20Orbital%20Defense%20Platforms%20Blister%20Packet.JPG

 

Adeptus Mehcanicus

 

Space Fleet style Eldar.

 

New ships for Eldar.

http://img0.reactor.cc/pics/post/full/Warhammer-40000-Wh-%D0%9F%D0%B5%D1%81%D0%BE%D1%87%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%86%D0%B0-%D1%84%D1%8D%D0%BD%D0%B4%D0%BE%D0%BC%D1%8B-battlefleet-gothic-2550114.jpeg

 

New ships for Imperial Navy.

 

New ships for Chaos.

http://www.solegends.com/citcat2005spc/c2005spcp0056-02.jpg

 

and various attack craft, torpedo and mine stands, some of which are in the above pictures. Everything above either had rules in the original BFG rulebook or in the later published supplement BFG Armageddon.

 

FW did do some stuff other than T'au and Marine fleets too.

 

T'au Orbitals.

http://miniset.net/files/set/gw-sg-bfg-g-034.jpg

 

http://miniset.net/files/set/gw-sg-bfg-g-035.jpg

 

Imperial & Eldar Transports.

 

 

The fantastic Ramilles Star Fort.

 

Demiurg.

http://jodrell.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/2013-02-17-20.43.57.jpg

 

Grey Knights (just a Strike Cruiser)

http://miniset.net/files/set/gw-bfg027.jpeg

 

I actually thought more of the range was FW, notably the Kroot Warsphere, the Imperial Defense Platforms and the various attack craft, mines and torpedos, but they were all GW. As you can see, FW did a very small amount of the total BFG range, with GW covering most of it. There should be plenty of proof here that BFG was a GW game through and through. It was a GW IP, not something mainly FW. FW were, as was common at the time, just making supplemental stuff.

 

Here endeth the history lesson. Hopefully BFG fans got a kick from seeing all that old stuff. I certainly did. I'd love if they brought all of this back. The amount of stuff BFG had at it's height was staggering. It didn't rival Epic but it was more than a match for other specialist games like Mordheim or Necromunda. It made for fantastic variety in games which were a visual spectacle.

 

Sadly, none of the above are mine (though I do have a full Marine fleet with both GW and FW versions ) so credit to the respective owners.

Edited December 30, 2017 by Toxichobbit

[Wargamer]

BFG should not be 30K. Nor should it be modern 40K - it should focus on the Gothic War and act as a source of oft-forgotten lore. How many people coming into the game from 5th onwards have any idea where the Blackstone Fortresses came from? 

Besides, one of the great things about 40K in general is you can tie seemingly disparate elements together. Let the core game be what it was always meant to be - Imperial Navy, Chaos, Orks and Eldar in the Gothic War. Then you can have another expansion with another splatbook, this time adding new fleets and new lore about a conflict where those fleets played a major role. Imagine a book detailing a huge fleet battle between the Tyranid Hive Fleets and the Tau Empire, for example.

[Seahawk]

A little more history to tack on! Here's all that Forgeworld produced:

 

 

 

I don't know the order in which things came out, but I believe GW's attack craft came out after FW's, since GW produced all the IN AC and Chaos AC (sans dreadclaw). I'm also not sure to which fleet the Avenger bombers belong, but I assume the IN.

Edited December 30, 2017 by Seahawk

[Marshal Rohr]

Releasing BFG as a 40k game trades cool ships like the Gloriana and Abyss classes for the little tiny two km battle barges that only carry three companies of marines. That’s a nightmare. Imagine trading epic ship combat for some space crabs with tentacles. Hard pass.

[Eddie Orlock]

Releasing BFG as a 40k game trades cool ships like the Gloriana and Abyss classes ...

Makes about as much sense as fielding a Knight in a 750 point game. Might be fun once or twice but it so distorts the experience and obviates so much tactical study as to greatly reduce replay value.

[Gillyfish]

Let's see what happens with BFG. It's interesting that Titanicus is still not released, which suggests that something is holding it up. Perhaps the rules aren't quite there yet or they are having issues with the models. I know that people who got to play it last year enjoyed it (with 28mm scale titans too!), so hopefully it will be good, but it will not be like the Epic game I knew. Hopefully that scale of game will come back if Titanicus is successful. If they are wanting to show a seriously large scale game, then perhaps they could use some of the abstractions adopted in the Honour games by Sam Mustafa. They play very well and would suit the grand scale of Epic.

 

In terms of the new RPG system, I would wait and see what happens. I've played some other games by the same publisher and they have played well. Not too rules heavy either, which was one o the issues with the FFG system (I played Deathwatch last year and the poor GM had to keep spending time calculating armour penetration, toughness etc, which slowed the game down a fair bit). So let's wait and see. I'm quite optimistic.

[Allart01]

The point of setting stuff in the Heresy, I think, is that the studio needs just one line of models and boom, it's done.

It takes a lot less time, effort, money and they all but have the certainty that sales will be good.

I'm not saying that it is better per se, but when you consider the size of the specialist team, you can see why such a decision makes sense.

Edited January 2, 2018 by The_Bloody

[Wargamer]

Releasing BFG as a 40k game trades cool ships like the Gloriana and Abyss classes for the little tiny two km battle barges that only carry three companies of marines. That’s a nightmare. Imagine trading epic ship combat for some space crabs with tentacles. Hard pass.

Showing your ignorance of Battlefleet Gothic there; a Battle Barge is around 7km long or more. 2km is around the size of Frigates - the ships with a single hit point.

[Marshal Rohr]

 

 

Releasing BFG as a 40k game trades cool ships like the Gloriana and Abyss classes for the little tiny two km battle barges that only carry three companies of marines. That’s a nightmare. Imagine trading epic ship combat for some space crabs with tentacles. Hard pass.

Showing your ignorance of Battlefleet Gothic there; a Battle Barge is around 7km long or more. 2km is around the size of Frigates - the ships with a single hit point.

Definitely not ignorant of battlefleet gothic, but thanks anyway.

[Toxichobbit]

Releasing BFG as a 40k game trades cool ships like the Gloriana and Abyss classes for the little tiny two km battle barges that only carry three companies of marines. That’s a nightmare. Imagine trading epic ship combat for some space crabs with tentacles. Hard pass.

 

The whole point of Battlefleet Gothic was it was set in the Gothic war. Not 30k. Also not quite current 40k either as it's set right at the start of the 41st Millenium, about 1000 years before where we are now. Changing it to be set in 30k would ruin the setting completely, all for what, a few dozen ships that would barely see play because they're so massive and powerful that they solo fleets (at least in the case of the Abyss class). May as well set it during the Fall of the Eldar or maybe the Age of Apostasy. because if they're going to gut a setting they should at least replace it with something more interesting than more HH. If they did a BFHH to go alongside BFG that wouldn't be as bad, because the largely unexplored Gothic War remains intact as a setting instead of just a footnote in various books like the other 10,000 years between the Heresy and 40k.

 

Anyway, multiple Gloriana class survived to the 41st Millenium (Vengeful Spirit, Macragge's Honour, maybe more). Sure, they're named ones, but there was what, 20 Gloriana class built and they were mostly Legion flagships? If I'm remembering that correctly, then they're pretty much all named ships. In fact, given the Gothic War was the start of Abaddon's 12th Black Crusade, I'd say a retcon to include the Vengeful Spirit would be in order, so there's your Gloriana class. The Abyss class didn't make it to 40k, but to be honest they're  ridiculously powerful mcguffins for Lorgar to overcompensate with (plus about as usable in a standard fleet battle as a Titan in a standard size 40k game), so no great loss.

 

TLDR: The Gothic War is unexplored beyond BFG which provides the only window into those events. Replacing it with the already over-exposed 30k setting would be a massive shame.

[Morovir]

Other Glorianas that survived include the Eternal Crusader, and possibly the Lex Talonis of the Nemesis Chapter, formerly the Chronicle of Ashes of the Word Bearers, who were listed as possessing 9 Glorianas.

 

This thread contains more information on that front:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/336479-status-of-all-gloriana-class-legion-flagships/

[Warpmiss]

I know everyone is talking about BFG right now but I just saw this:

 

 
What I've read about the new PnP (Wrath and Glory?) does not sound promising to me personally (dice pools? meeting lore figures? fighting primarchs?) but at least we still have the stellar Fantasy Flight Game... games.

 

 

I was hoping to get the Wrath and Glory rulebook as soon as it came out since some of my friends had shown interest in starting a Roleplay group but things like fighting Primarchs seem so unfitting for 40K. A random character from a random planet taking on a Primarch? Yeah, right. It really clashes with the setting.