Drop Regiment Flyer Crews

[Lady_Mournival]

Hey All,

Simple question that stumbled across my mind today, who supplies the flight crews for a Drop regiment's flyers? Unlike the regular guard, flyers are allegedly an organic part of drop troop regiments, so who provides the crews? Do the Elysians or Harakoni Warhawks have a special training pipeline for them? Does the navy permanently second trained crews?

Looking for opinion and/or concrete source. 

Thanks!
 

[Arganias]

I am pretty confident the Valkyrie pilots are completely separate from the Imperial Navy. I imagine they are like the warrant officer pilots of Air Cavalry units in the US military. I think it would be a logistical nightmare to have to request Valkyrie pilots for your unit's equipment. What's more, since Elysians are a special regiment, I imagine they would want to train with the pilots they have as much as possible to make the overall unit readiness higher!

 

I know that is not a concrete answer, but it is the conclusion I have come to based on what info is available.

[shandwen]

I want to say elisians got some rule that permitted them to function with officers of the fleet and valks (keyword perhaps?). So the current rules would point to organic pilots and crew, unlike all other regimental doctrines.

[librisrouge]

In drop troop regiments, where the flyers are permanently part of the regiment, the crew are typically recruited directly from the regiment’s homeworld or assigned long term from the Imperial Navy. Drop troop regiments are rare and, as such, their organization is going to be wierd and varied. Some might have no assigned flyers and just be closely assigned with the navy all the time. Others just have their own dedicated staff of pilots, like some regiments integrate battle tank crews, allowing them to have a smoother integration of tactics. Edited January 8, 2018 by librisrouge

[Galron]

They likely get tested for mechanical aptitude and the guys who pass get sent to advanced school to learn to be crew chief and simply get trained to use the heavy bolters in the process. I know in the US military in the past it was normal for infantry guys to be assigned positions as door gunners more or less officially. I don't know how they do it now or if Blackhawks even have full time gunners.

[Shamansky]

As stated here 'Typically each Drop Company will have its own motor pool of Valkyries for transporting each individual squad into battle, and include a squadron of Vulture Gunships to provide them with fire support', we can presume that crews are part of the regiments. At least that is very likely true for Elysian Drop Troops. 

 

For another example, from 'Double Eagle' by Dan Abnet, The Phantine Air Corps' combat units consist almost entirely of pilots, bomber crews and their aircrafts.

[Galron]

Can you imagine the logistics of this? Assuming a battalion of drop troopers, not even the full regiment, 4 squads per platoon, 3 platoons per company + say two squads worth of assorted HQ personnel, 4 companies per battalion. Plus a large battalion headquarters of say company strength for the scout platoon, mortars, medics, supply, cooks, fuel, chem, internal maintenance, paper pushers. You are talking roughly 60 Valkyries per battalion and a regiment would likely consist of minimum 2 battalions. That's not even counting how they add in transport for the equipment, taurosi, sentinels, heavy weapons, their crew and maintenance, etc. So lets say 160 Valkyries chassis. Now add in a squadron of Vultures per company and I am assuming 4 birds in a squadron so 32 Vultures.

 

You need multiple battalions just to support this many aircraft. Each bird would have its own multi-person maintenance team plus the actual 3 man crew. 544 pilots and crew, another conservative 2 man ground crew per valk/vulture at 384 men, a supply column from hell supplying ammo, bullets, bolts, fuel, medical, food, higher level maintenance for everything.

 

Essentially if you deploy a regiment of Elysians you are sending an entire brigade. Figure out the numbers but conservatively speaking you probably still end up close to the 1:10 ratio of trigger pullers to support. Which is kind of funny since you never hear about the support guys who make up the majority of the IG in the BL books. How often do you hear Gaunt's Ghosts talk about their logistical team or their medic platoon or the guys who cook for the regiment?

[Tallarn Commander]

Shamansky, thanks for including the citation!

 

As I'm sure you all know regular aircraft such as Marauders are almost alwys Imperial Navy. The Phantine were the exception that proved the rule.  Abnett stated in 'Double Eagle' that the Phantine Air Corps were an exception not the norm. The Munitorum was awarded with the right to equip Phantines with flyers because of the sacrifice they made to regain their planet in 'Guns of Tanith.' Most Marauders, Thunderbolts, and Lightnings are crewed by Imperial Navy.

 

Galron, Note that Abnett does briefly reference unarmed support crew in a few of his novels: ferry crew in 'Necropolis' and porters and cooks in 'His Last Command.' And, of course, he has always covered the exploits of the medicae support personnel and they interact regularly with front line Tanith. But, yes, his main characters are the minority of warriors at the tip of the spear rather than the support crew.

[Shamansky]

Can you imagine the logistics of this? 

Easily. A Jericho-class freighter vessel or maybe two

 

And let's review some classic literature. Imperial Armour vol. 3 2nd edition

Edited January 10, 2018 by Shamansky

[Marshal Rohr]

Can you imagine the logistics of this? Assuming a battalion of drop troopers, not even the full regiment, 4 squads per platoon, 3 platoons per company + say two squads worth of assorted HQ personnel, 4 companies per battalion. Plus a large battalion headquarters of say company strength for the scout platoon, mortars, medics, supply, cooks, fuel, chem, internal maintenance, paper pushers. You are talking roughly 60 Valkyries per battalion and a regiment would likely consist of minimum 2 battalions. That's not even counting how they add in transport for the equipment, taurosi, sentinels, heavy weapons, their crew and maintenance, etc. So lets say 160 Valkyries chassis. Now add in a squadron of Vultures per company and I am assuming 4 birds in a squadron so 32 Vultures.

 

You need multiple battalions just to support this many aircraft. Each bird would have its own multi-person maintenance team plus the actual 3 man crew. 544 pilots and crew, another conservative 2 man ground crew per valk/vulture at 384 men, a supply column from hell supplying ammo, bullets, bolts, fuel, medical, food, higher level maintenance for everything.

 

Essentially if you deploy a regiment of Elysians you are sending an entire brigade. Figure out the numbers but conservatively speaking you probably still end up close to the 1:10 ratio of trigger pullers to support. Which is kind of funny since you never hear about the support guys who make up the majority of the IG in the BL books. How often do you hear Gaunt's Ghosts talk about their logistical team or their medic platoon or the guys who cook for the regiment?

You’re looking at something more along the line of one battalion of Valkyries per regiment, which would be organized more like RCTs or BCTs. Essentially one ‘Regiment’ or ‘Wing’ per division sized grouping of Drop Troops. There are also the unseen heavy drop ships Elysians use for gravchute mass insertions at the company level, represented by their ability to deep strike without a Valkyrie as a dedicated Transport. They would deploy in waves, with the gunships cycling back and forth. Edited January 11, 2018 by Marshal Rohr