How Stabby are the Angels?

[Spagunk]

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

[barjed]

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

 

Which is why I like to use that stratagem on the Captain Smash armed with The Angel's Wing. Very reliable due to the re-roll and you don't immediately start to wheeze when something goes sideways. Right now, at 1500 points I am experimenting with dropping the big assaulty units altogether and relying on the good ol' Captain for aggressive alpha strikes.

Edited January 16, 2018 by barjed

[Xenith]

 "Smashypants" (I don't like the name, the old IH's one was cooler Smash er...)

 

But what is Blood Smasher (there, i've renamed him for the benefit of all!)

 

 

Noooo, MC Hammer!

 

 

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

 

Average on 3 dice is 11, meaning if you deepstrike 9" away you should get in easily.

 

If you think about the 2D6 average being 7, and you need a 9 to charge, then you only need a 2+ on that third dice with an average roll on the first. It's quite solid.

Edited January 16, 2018 by Xenith

[Pendent]

 

 "Smashypants" (I don't like the name, the old IH's one was cooler Smash er...)

 

But what is Blood Smasher (there, i've renamed him for the benefit of all!)

 

 

Noooo, MC Hammer!

 

 

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

 

Average on 3 dice is 11, meaning if you deepstrike 8" away you should get in easily.

 

If you think about the 2D6 average being 7, and you need a 9 to charge, then you only need a 2+ on that third dice with an average roll on the first. It's quite solid.

 

I think we have a winner.

[Shaezus]

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

That seems to be the thing with BA specific stuff. It almost all depends on the charge, so aside from red thirst itself there's not too much which will do its thing every single time. Anything which combines a reroll with DoA gives a 93% chance of making the charge iirc. Which narrows it down to Angels Wing and Lemartes with DC.

[Brother Crimson]

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

I think you mean 74% of the time it works every time 

 

But yeah once in a while youll fail the roll and lose the unit. You cant completely rely on deep strike.

[NTaW]

 

 

"60% of the time it works every time" is pretty much how I feel about 3d6 deepstrike. It works great, when it works. Otherwise you wasted your anemic CP on something.

Which is why I like to use that stratagem on the Captain Smash armed with The Angel's Wing. Very reliable due to the re-roll and you don't immediately start to wheeze when something goes sideways. Right now, at 1500 points I am experimenting with dropping the big assaulty units altogether and relying on the good ol' Captain for aggressive alpha strikes.

You haven't ended up with your Captain isolated after his backup fails the charge yet? I love Slamguinius as much as the next guy but I feel like I'd be more tempted to use the 3d6 stratagem on whoever is with the Captain given that he already has a re-roll from Angel's Wing.

 

That being said there's just no counting on assaulting from Reserve and I don't really think I'll be trying for it any more unless the situation is dire or the game is casual.

[brother_b]

 

 

 

 

 

Could also call him captain caveman since he definitely has similar behaviors.

Fighting with a hammer = being a caveman. Okay then.

Fighting with a hammer = fighting with a club = saturday morning cartoon analogy.

 

I know what you were aiming at. Doesn't make the post better tho. ^^

Totally makes it better if you grew up with CAPTAIN CAAAAAVEMAN!

[Dont-Be-Haten]

Lots of good points made here.

 

Personally BA are in a great place, we are still a hybrid army, with lot more flair. Our Intercessors are probably the best utility troop in the astartes line up next to scouts.

 

Our ability to bring the Foe-hammer down in a turn and reliably get a charge off.

 

We have a character that can, with investment, 1 shot primarchs.

 

However; we're still MEQ at the end of the day, and need utility elsewhere and can not be solely dedicated to CQC. We have had some really scary lists pop up in the Army-List thread, I would take a gander over that way.

 

The blokes that know me, have seen some.of my more optimized lists and they almost all have the trifecta, range, toughness, and martial prowess that revolve around each other and synergies quite well in my opinion.

Edited January 16, 2018 by Dont-Be-Haten

[Firepower]

In retrospect, I never shoulda asked this question. I really wanna build an Angel army now :teehee:

 

Everything I'm hearing here sounds great.

[Firepower]

Alright then...let's assume for a moment that, y'know...stars align and I make the mistake of trying to make a 2nd army (again).

 

Where to begin?  Are there, broadly speaking, typical approaches?  I figure beginning would fall back on the old standard of an HQ or 2 and a few Troops?  Do people bother with Tactical Squads, or is it a toss up between Scout spam and Primaris?  Can Assault Squads still be taken as Troops?  Should a starting HQ be something cheap and simple like a Lieutenant/Captain, or a named Character?  All assuming a lean towards a stabby army, of course. :tu:

 

From a painting perspective, are there good arrangements of decals in the boxes, or should I look elsewhere?  I've never been able to paint a blood drop to satisfactorily consistent standards

 

Are there good guides for a more 'orangey' color scheme?  I'd like to play to my roots...if this happens.  If...

Edited January 16, 2018 by Firepower

[Panzer]

Alright then...let's assume for a moment that, y'know...stars align and I make the mistake of trying to make a 2nd army (again).

 

Where to begin?  Are there, broadly speaking, typical approaches?  I figure beginning would fall back on the old standard of an HQ or 2 and a few Troops?  Do people bother with Tactical Squads, or is it a toss up between Scout spam and Primaris?  Can Assault Squads still be taken as Troops?  Should a starting HQ be something cheap and simple like a Lieutenant/Captain, or a named Character?  All assuming a lean towards a stabby army, of course.

 

From a painting perspective, are there good arrangements of decals in the boxes, or should I look elsewhere?  I've never been able to paint a blood drop to satisfactorily consistent standards

 

Are there good guides for a more 'orangey' color scheme?  I'd like to play to my roots...if this happens.  If...

This thread should provide some insight for out troop choices. ;) http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342613-blood-angels-troops-discussion/?hl=troop&do=findComment&comment=4967248

 

And yeah I'd definitely start with 2 HQ and 2 Troop units. You pretty much always want to have a Battalion anyway.

[Brother Crimson]

Are there good guides for a more 'orangey' color scheme?  I'd like to play to my roots...if this happens.  If...

Color wise:

The old marines are usually painted mephiston red, agrax earth shade recess shade, touch up, evil sun highlight, fire dragon bright highlight. (As per sons of sanguinus painting guide)

 

The new primaris are done a little differently (and more bright/orange), with mix fo evil sun and mephiston as base, and shades done with a "blacklining" mix of khorne red and chaos black. Credits goes to Blindhamster.

Read the complete receipe here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342188-ba-paint-questions/?hl=%2Bprimaris+%2Bpaint&do=findComment&comment=4957136

Edited January 16, 2018 by Brother Crimson

[Firepower]

I've taken to using Vallejo more and more.  Dropper bottles are a must for airbrushing 

[Brother Crimson]

I've taken to using Vallejo more and more.  Dropper bottles are a must for airbrushing 

There is easilly equivalent colors in Vallejo.

[Firepower]

 

I've taken to using Vallejo more and more.  Dropper bottles are a must for airbrushing 

There is easilly equivalent colors in Vallejo.

 

 

Yup, just don't know 'em off the top of my head.  I have to order all my Vallejo online, and you can't trust color swathes on a computer monitor.  So I just look around for tutorials.  I'm sure I'll find one somewhere.  :teehee:

 

But I've steered things off topic a wee bit.  If and how to build a proper stabby army is the main thrust.  How to paint them is a matter I should look into elsewhere :)

[Brother Aether]

 

 

I've taken to using Vallejo more and more.  Dropper bottles are a must for airbrushing 

There is easilly equivalent colors in Vallejo.

 

 

Yup, just don't know 'em off the top of my head.  I have to order all my Vallejo online, and you can't trust color swathes on a computer monitor.  So I just look around for tutorials.  I'm sure I'll find one somewhere. 

 

But I've steered things off topic a wee bit.  If and how to build a proper stabby army is the main thrust.  How to paint them is a matter I should look into elsewhere

 

 

I know there's a hex-color conversion chart floating around The Internets that has some conversions between the various brands, color names, part #s, etc...

[Zynk Kaladin]

 

My dear cousin, my 20ish year old can of Blood Red primer most definitely is, and has always been, orange.  As are the Angels in the Angels of Death codex sitting in my stasis vault.  Venerables like myself are kept around not only for our paddlin' prowess, but our long memories.  

 

Anyway, those are some gloriously nasty melee rules.  Got me pining for my old days, both Templar and Angel alike.

 

Unfortunately being a wee lad at the time I never played 2nd, so I deferred to your ancient wisdom.  I thumbed through my Angels of Death codex and sure enough the scheme is an oppressive and wrathful reddish-orange!

 

If I were to start in this edition with unrelenting stabby in mind I'd build the battalion below with a choice between death company and vanguard veterans.  It's a solid core and you can easily supplement this list with more options as desired.

 

Battalion

 

Captain (JP, hammer, optional storm shield)

 

• If choosing Death Company route: spend a CP on Death Visions before the game starts and make him Death Company for +1A on charge and 6+++ FNP.  Give him Hammer of Baal relic for a 2+ to hit.  Give him Gift of Foresight warlord trait to bump up his FNP to 5+++ with rerolls on 1.  This stacks well with Lemartes's reroll charges.

 

• If choosing Van Vets:  give him Artisan of War warlord trait providing him a 4 damage hammer.  Also give him Angel's Wing relic for reroll failed charges and cannot be overwatched.  You also have the option to spend a CP to give him +1A on the charge and 6+++ FNP, but not really required.  Personally, I'd probably do it anyway.

 

Lemartes or Mephiston depending on DC or VV choice below

 

5 scouts (sword, 4bp/ccw) <-- Honestly I'm having a hard time choosing between bolters or bp/ccw scouts... so in your case... stabby!

5 scouts (sword, 4bp/ccw)

5 scouts (sword, 4bp/ccw)

 

10 Death Company (JPs, 1 hammer, 2 sword) or 10 Vanguard Vets (JPs, 1 hammer, 2 sword, 3 storm shield)

Edited January 17, 2018 by Zynk Kaladin

[Firepower]

If I were to go with Scouts (and to be honest, I loathe painting them) I think I actually would go for Bolters over blades.  It does seem from general meta and the opinions here that at least someone has to be shooting rather than charging.  May as well let it be the chaff units rather than the elite stabbers.

 

Looking at the Troop topic linked earlier, I'm actually leaning rather heavily towards Intercessors...which surprises me for a number of reasons, to be honest.  But I can mentally justify them for Angels a lot easier than I can for Templars, so that helps

 

Is the Hammer Bro really that much of a must-have, or just a fun gimmick?  There seems to be quite a lot of praise for him here.

 

As for the orange, the decorations of Marines from all Chapters could be hilariously hideous.  The Ultramarines were quite fond of flames.  Checkers still hold a special place in my heart, though. :)

Edited January 17, 2018 by Firepower

[NTaW]

I can't see myself playing without a hammer Captain any time soon. He hangs out with my three Predators for re-rolls behind a Scout screen until he's needed elsewhere, then jumps out to deal with threats or relocates with Upon Wings of Fire as needed. It has worked quite well for me since I started employing it. He's always my Warlord and always takes the Artisan of War trait for a 4D hammer, occasionally I will spend the CP to give him the DC keyword but there's the Red Fury (+d3 attacks regardless of the name) stratagem to boost in a pinch if needed. 5 games with him so far, and he has always made his points back.

[Firepower]

I'll have to familiarize myself with the dex before I understand half of the rules/relics/stratagems you just threw at me, and how they or alternatives might be applied to the Cap or elsewhere, but it certainly sounds cool :D

[Zynk Kaladin]

You really cant go wrong with any BAngel troop choice because each fill their niche quite well.  Intercessors are a great choice and have beautiful models.  I just dislike how tall they are next to my old marines (and a litany of other recent fluff misgivings).

 

Captain Gallagher is a great choice at a very inexpensive price tag.  Not necessarily must have, but highly recommended.

[NTaW]

I'll have to familiarize myself with the dex before I understand half of the rules/relics/stratagems you just threw at me, and how they or alternatives might be applied to the Cap or elsewhere, but it certainly sounds cool :D

:lol: right. Let me put it to you another way maybe. He usually deletes two or three units per game for me and there are several stratagems and psychic powers that can more than double his attacks, which hit on 3+ re-rolling 1s often wounding on 2+ with a s8 hammer and the Red Thirst (+1 to wound on the charge) and cause 4 damage per failed save. You can give him a jump pack relic that lets him re-roll charge ranges and ignore overwatch, and there's a stratagem that lets you take a jump pack unit and relocate it anywhere on the table 9" away from enemies. I like keeping him on the table with my trio of Predators, set up behind a screen of Scouts against enemies coming in from reserve, to make use of the Captain's 6" re-roll 1s to hit aura.

 

...that ramble make a bit more sense?

[Firepower]

Yup, thanks :)

[Xenith]

In retrospect, I never shoulda asked this question. I really wanna build an Angel army now

 

One of us! One of us!

 

A Third War for Armageddon themed army would be ace, and tie in with your Templars. That was the theme for my BA/Codex Omega Marines army.