Diagramdude Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 This requires imperial soup, but you take an Astra Militarum warlord with Grand Strategist, and choose Kurov's Aquila as your free relic. Then you spend 1CP on Armoury of Baal to equip the Veritas Vitae. Now you roll 1D6 per strategems and on a 5+ "gain" a CP, and you also roll a D6 per CP spent on a stratagem and on a 5+ that CP is "refunded." So you get to roll n+1 D6 on an n-cost stratagem and on 5s you get a CP back, and because the Veritas Vitae is worded as "gain" not "refunded" you can actually profit by one if all your dice come up 5+. And from Kurov's Aquila you can gain CP off of your opponent's use of stratagems. I've found this makes for an almost limitless use of stratagem if you take a cheap Astra Militarum brigade to start with a large (10+) pool of CP to work with. Especially since so many of the good blood angels strats cost 2 or 3 CP. Even with a 1CP stratagem, you roll 2D6 and if either one comes up 5+ the stratagem is free. This would also work with Guilliman' s warlord trait, basically it exploits the CP regenerating warlord trait combined with a CP regenerating relic. Crimson Ghost IX 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Yep, already known. Works great, is cheap and I'd consider it as auto-include for (mostly) BA tournament lists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Explorer1 Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 And it can be really cheap - Company Commander and 3 Inquisitorial Acolytes for a 54pts Vanguard Detachment. Painted one of those yesterday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Referenced in the tactica thread and elsewhere! But, well worth its own mention! Played the last game with it and generated points every turn. One turn I generated more points than I used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackcadian Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 And it can be really cheap - Company Commander and 3 Inquisitorial Acolytes for a 54pts Vanguard Detachment. Painted one of those yesterday! Ohhhhh and here I was thinking I‘d need at minimum 21 miniatures to pull that off (2 infantry squads plus the commander). Wow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 And it can be really cheap - Company Commander and 3 Inquisitorial Acolytes for a 54pts Vanguard Detachment. Painted one of those yesterday! Cheap on both points and £££s. Question is though, is it worth taking a minimum-sized Battalion instead? IIRC that comes to about 200 points but it does give you 3 Troops units for cheap Objsec and bubble wrapping as well as some extra Lascannons. Not to mention that a Battalion provides 3 CPs rather than the 1 for a Vanguard. What do people think? Go as cheap as possible or spend a bit extra to increase the usability of the units you get? Crimson Ghost IX 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 (edited) Well for my Primaris I'll definitely go and take an AM Battalion for some cheap Lascannons, bodies and Command Points eventually. Edit: typo Edited January 22, 2018 by sfPanzer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 And it can be really cheap - Company Commander and 3 Inquisitorial Acolytes for a 54pts Vanguard Detachment. Painted one of those yesterday! Do you not only get relic/ warlord trait access if the detachment is an Imperial Guard one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 And it can be really cheap - Company Commander and 3 Inquisitorial Acolytes for a 54pts Vanguard Detachment. Painted one of those yesterday! Cheap on both points and £££s. Question is though, is it worth taking a minimum-sized Battalion instead? IIRC that comes to about 200 points but it does give you 3 Troops units for cheap Objsec and bubble wrapping as well as some extra Lascannons. Not to mention that a Battalion provides 3 CPs rather than the 1 for a Vanguard. What do people think? Go as cheap as possible or spend a bit extra to increase the usability of the units you get? If you were going ultra competitive, I dont think you can go wrong with this idea! For me, i struggle having filthy regular humans in my lists as is :P It can also be even cheaper, no? Just 30 points for the Commander in an Auxilliary Crimson Ghost IX 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 It can also be even cheaper, no? Just 30 points for the Commander in an Auxilliary But that comes with -1 CP now, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Crimson Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 If you don’t like guard you can do it with ultramarines too. A lot more expensive aaaand you get ultramarine in your army... I’d Rather have guards :-) full brigade for around 700 pts is hard to beat cp wise. Or better around 1000 you get a proper one with some leman Russ. Then you just blast in lemartes, another hq and DC units and have fun with honour the chapter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 If you don’t like guard you can do it with ultramarines too. really?! What do UM have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Crimson Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Warlord trait to gain cp back on 5+ To combine with our relic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 So if you use a 3CP stratagem, you roll 3 dice for the UM trait and 1 dice for the VV. For each 5+ you get a CP back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Yeah this seems pretty cool and all, but I plan on running smashy pants, so need my warlord trait to be the plus +1 damage trait. Plus I don't like the idea of running soup as I don't want to be THAT guy. cake_farts, Panda_Saurus_Rex and Karhedron 3 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorre Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 This seems really good! Good enough for me to consider trying it...... but is it working as gw intended and will they fix it before i finish building/painting?? I supose i could use a cheap imperial detachment anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 And it can be really cheap - Company Commander and 3 Inquisitorial Acolytes for a 54pts Vanguard Detachment. Painted one of those yesterday! Do you not only get relic/ warlord trait access if the detachment is an Imperial Guard one? Nope, they both just depend on what faction the Warlord is from, rather than the Detachment. It's Stratagems that depend on having a dedicated Detachment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diagramdude Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 Jorre, the basis for this combo is confirmed in the Death Guard FAQ https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Codex_Death_Guard_ENG.pdf Explicitly permitted to have a certain faction warlord and still use the relic stratagem from another faction detachment to take relics from the other faction. BA have a CP regenerating relic, and Guard and Ultramarines have CP regenerating warlord traits. I could see it getting hotfixed, but IMO it's similar to the various ways to stack FNP saves, which is still allowed although many of the newer rules clearly state that certain FNPs don't stack, like standard of sacrifice and black rage. Morticon 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Oooh! The UM stuff is almost as good as IG!! I may have to have a look at it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Crimson Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 This seems really good! Good enough for me to consider trying it...... but is it working as gw intended and will they fix it before i finish building/painting?? I supose i could use a cheap imperial detachment anyway! The ways it’s worded we gain a cp when we use the stratagem and could get it refunded as well. I’m pretty sure they will faq it so that we can’t generate more cp than what was used. Still pretty cool to get double chance to get a cp back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diagramdude Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 Mort, im flipping through C:SM and some of the potential synergies are bonkers... Can anyone confirm that the Librarius Disicipline spells can affect Blood Angel targets? If so, three Ultramarine Librarians in an Ultramarine Supreme Command detachment could be giving Might of Heroes to a libby dread or land raider... or Veil of Time onto a death co blob to give them charge/advance rerolls and always fight first... or null zone to counter enemies that rely on invulns... And you'd get to select one free relic, teeth of terra is an obvious standout but the Sanctic Halo for UM is also quite strong... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Mort, im flipping through C:SM and some of the potential synergies are bonkers... Can anyone confirm that the Librarius Disicipline spells can affect Blood Angel targets? If so, three Ultramarine Librarians in an Ultramarine Supreme Command detachment could be giving Might of Heroes to a libby dread or land raider... or Veil of Time onto a death co blob to give them charge/advance rerolls and always fight first... or null zone to counter enemies that rely on invulns... And you'd get to select one free relic, teeth of terra is an obvious standout but the Sanctic Halo for UM is also quite strong... They will affect us yes, as we are all "Adeptus Astartes", which I believe is the target :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodTzar Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 I mean this tread changed my mind towards DKoK detachment , for sheer 240-50 you get 3CPs 32 bodies that have some 4+ hitting (with re rolling 1's) heavy weapons (AC,LC) with commissar with 4+ in cover. I mean for us this is neat addition, multiplied this can be nice fire base for our DC,SG and all the in your face elements.. Personally I do believe being able to farm CP's while having 6CPs and 64 bodies...for 500 points its a bargain(while getting access to all the FW artillery pieces, and the mecharius tanks <3 :) ) I just know how "small detachments" do end...personally I can-not justify another army (having 5-6 nowadays) ~BT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Unseen Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Just a quick question, does this work with a DKOK Marshal, or no? (I prefer my allied guard just as fearless and almost as choppy as my Blood Angels) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diagramdude Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 It would only work if the DKOK Marshal can select the Grand Strategist WL trait from the Astra Militarum codex. If not, then you're outta luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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