Las Vegas Open

[Crimson Ghost IX]

 

Now my concern is that now we're going to eat a nerf.

 

I don't think so but see where you are coming from. He worked alot of things to get that Fire Raptor ending charge from the Captain.

The lucky explode result made it epic and telling, but not really OP I feel.

His opponent almost wrapped him out of being able to pull it off as well I would also note.

 

The way all the strats etc have to line out I think it is unlikely every Imperial Player can get a Blood Angel captain into a workable list to do that reliably or something. Capt is good but so are many things out there. It is single use pretty much so there is that too.

 

In an earlier game I happened to catch on Friday against Nids the Capt went over and missed it all doing nothing. So many command points gone...

 

 

If anything the Fire Raptor needs a points re-nerf as it is point and kill.  So are the Eldar Dark Reapers etc it is looking like to me.

 

One good CQC option that doesn't break the point bank keeping it real isn't grossly out there like some of the spammable shooty things I have seen.

 

In my opinion anyhow =)

Edited January 28, 2018 by Crimson Ghost IX

[Calistarius]

I was just coming here to post about this. When I saw someone in the top 5 taking Intercessors (which I love) my jaw almost hit the floor.

 

Now my concern is that now we're going to eat a nerf.

I watched every BA game they streamed. I didn’t see anything from the intercessors that would warrant a nerf. What alarms me is the amount of people running with 1 or more versions of our Captain Slamguinous. I’ve one in every match I played since our dex was released. I don’t see it getting nerfed directly. I mean its a steep investment to pull off requiring specific relics, strategems and warlord traits. I felt incredibly proud when I watched him take down the Chaos Fire Raptor in one phase. This also left me feeling uneasy about the future.

 

On another note, I’d expect to see some BA pairings with Custodes at upcoming events. Specifically, something like a supreme command detachment with 3 shield captains on dawn eagle jet bikes. If our smashy Captain has a rival its one of these guys. At only 160 points each the amount of fire and wounds alone raises an eyebrow. They have some nifty strategems as well. Just something to think about.

[Panzer]

I honestly was expecting a Captain nerf already however I'm really not sure how they'd do that considering it's a combination of a warlord trait, a relic (both things already being only for characters/your warlord) and a Stratagem specifically for more generic characters like the Captain.

Upping his points would be stupid since it would effect all the Captains and not just that one build.

 

The only thing I could see is taking away his Thunderhammer (then we still have other good options tho) or his Jump Pack (which would be really silly considering it's a BA Captain).

[wildweasel]

I doubt Slamguinius is getting nerfed - yeah he’s strong, but he’s a pretty large investment for one model.

[Calistarius]

I honestly was expecting a Captain nerf already however I'm really not sure how they'd do that considering it's a combination of a warlord trait, a relic (both things already being only for characters/your warlord) and a Stratagem specifically for more generic characters like the Captain.

Upping his points would be stupid since it would effect all the Captains and not just that one build.

 

The only thing I could see is taking away his Thunderhammer (then we still have other good options tho) or his Jump Pack (which would be really silly considering it's a BA Captain).

It’d be hard to pull off a nerf to just captains. Maybe something like a points change for characters to take thunder hammers? I don’t know. He’s an incredibly points efficient option for taking down high toughness high wound units for us and Imperium allies. I hope they leave it alone, but seeing the number of these guys that were taken for LVO leads me to believe that we will see something happen. Edited January 28, 2018 by Calistarius

[Panzer]

Maybe we have to wait and see how it goes when more tournaments are played. BA and especially the Captain are rather new and bound to surprise people who were most likely building and testing lists against any of the other armies but not BA. 

[Calistarius]

That’s a really good point man. You’re absolutely right. As soon as I hit post I thought about what I said about Custodes. Our captains may just be the new hotness. I won’t get all doom and gloom yet.

[Brother Crimson]

I doubt we will be nerfed. That’s one list of pure BA on the top 8. If anything the BA codex should be a comparison point for Space Wolves etc.

Also lot of people underestimate the hitting power of our characters.

 

There is also a lot of Eldar lists. And Guard mixed list.

[Pendent]

I don't necessarily *think* we'll be nerfed, but I do worry about some sort of knee-jerk reaction from GW.

 

My own thought is that we're going to heavily shift the meta for competitive play but once it adjusts I think we'll see fair representation but will probably be to one-note to actually take first place. I'm just concerned about a comissar-style nerf where GW drastically overcorrects.

[Crimson Ghost IX]

It must be remembered that whatever army actually takes the event is not the absolute best army in the game or definately broken needing to be fixed etc.

Although it seems likely it will be Eldar to me at a guess and they have been great since... forever really... ;)

 

Also Also it must be remembered that many of these games are being decided abruptly before the normal conclusion of turns (2)3-4(5) because of round time available. So that skews things a great deal as well I am thinking for some armies and generals etc. Although they have tried to account for that for sure it still seems a tourney issue in 8th to me as the game takes a long time to play out fully.

[Calistarius]

There was a day 1 match between BA and ‘nids soup that took an hour and a half for turn 1. They had to end the game before turn 3. The twitch chat was clamoring for the points limit for ITC to be lowered to 1500-1750. Even with the points decrease I struggle to compete against high model count armies at lower points games. I hope they don’t mess with the point limit yet. We aren’t a full year into this edition of the rule set. I think it will get faster as people get more accustomed to the nuances. I’m not a novice but even I have to look things up in the BRB occasionally. It will speed up. I wonder how many people are intentionally playing slow for an advantage? I hope this is easy to spot, but who knows.

 

I’m eager to see who comes out on top of this one!

[Morticon]

amazing thread!!  Interesting to follow. 

[Kappel]

As far as I can figure out the pure BA list is out. But BA is still represented in a Imperial Soup list. It is getting streamed live right now. Opponent is Eldar. And it seems like Captain Smashy is represented:

 

 https://www.twitch.tv/frontlinegaming_tv

[toaae]

He has a supreme command detachment of two BA captains and Mephiston. Which is probably point-for-point the best option in our codex, so I can see why he splashed them in.

[Calistarius]

Ah, well the BA’s run has come to an end. They were both eliminated in the first round according to the BCP app. That’s okay though! 2 too 10 finishes 1.5 months after the codex release makes me happy.

 

Edit: I can’t post a picture from my phone. The Guy that beat Michael (BA/Guard soup) is the guy that has the supreme command detachment with the 2 captains and Mephiston. The rest of his list makes me cringe reading it. Space Wolves HQs leading Guard troops with mortars. Along with 3 assassins thrown in. He has a total of 5 Wolf Lords mounted and a WHBL. A sum of 9 HQ choices. Do whatever it takes to win I guess lol.

Edited January 28, 2018 by Calistarius

[Ceril]

he uses the characters too to just sit objectives if needed. The sang priest in the featured battle just collected points all game. The Ancients can do that role if neeeded. If you play to win you play the objective almost always.

[Karhedron]

I'm just concerned about a comissar-style nerf where GW drastically overcorrects.

The Commissar was a problem because it could not be negated, it worked against everyone and it made for very un-fun games.

 

Captain Smash really needs high-value targets to make his points back on. He can also be blocked with screening or simply shot to pieces by a firing squad after he destroys his first target.

 

He is a hard-counter to certain high-power units but he is not likely to cause the sort of problems that Commissars did.

[Calistarius]

he uses the characters too to just sit objectives if needed. The sang priest in the featured battle just collected points all game. The Ancients can do that role if neeeded. If you play to win you play the objective almost always.

I don’t think we are referring to the same list. This guy has no priest or ancient. But he has 12 characters, 6 AM infantry squads and 5 fenrisian wolves. I also know that playing objectives is the only way to win ITC matches. Especially, given the importance of drawing the right secondary objectives.

[A.T.]

I doubt we will be nerfed. That’s one list of pure BA on the top 8. If anything the BA codex should be a comparison point for Space Wolves etc.

 

From what I can tell the final composition of the to 10 was -

4 Eldar (including 1st and 3rd place)

1 'pure' Blood Angel list

2 Blood Angels with Guard

1 Blood Angel with Guard and Sisters

1 Blood Angel with Guard and Wolves and Assassins

And a Death Guard / Tzeentch player with a vortex missile launcher - not something you see every day.

[toaae]

 

he uses the characters too to just sit objectives if needed. The sang priest in the featured battle just collected points all game. The Ancients can do that role if neeeded. If you play to win you play the objective almost always.

I don’t think we are referring to the same list. This guy has no priest or ancient. But he has 12 characters, 6 AM infantry squads and 5 fenrisian wolves. I also know that playing objectives is the only way to win ITC matches. Especially, given the importance of drawing the right secondary objectives.

 

 

ITC no longer has random missions, primary or secondary. You choose three secondary from a list in each game.

 

The SW/IG/BA player was on the FLG stream, and lost to an Ynnari list. A shame, because the Imperium player, Alex Fennell, was an excellent sportsman. He unfortunately deployed his assassins from reserve before he finished moving every other unit, and his opponent wouldn't let him finish his movement phase, but Mr. Fennell didn't complain and took it in stride.

 

EDIT: This all kinds of off topic, but a guy in the Twitch chat was saying he wanted to give $5000 to Alex for good sportsmanship. Turns out, that Twitch chatter is Riot Games co-founder Marc "Tryndamere" Merrill, and he was being serious.

Edited January 28, 2018 by toaae

[Brother Crimson]

Here’s the official FLG article on top 8.

 

https://www.frontlinegaming.org/2018/01/28/40k-lvo-2018-championships-presenting-the-top-8-players/

 

So yeah 4 Eldars, 1 AM/BA, 1BA, 1 imperium super soup, 1 demon.

[Calistarius]

 

 

he uses the characters too to just sit objectives if needed. The sang priest in the featured battle just collected points all game. The Ancients can do that role if neeeded. If you play to win you play the objective almost always.

I don’t think we are referring to the same list. This guy has no priest or ancient. But he has 12 characters, 6 AM infantry squads and 5 fenrisian wolves. I also know that playing objectives is the only way to win ITC matches. Especially, given the importance of drawing the right secondary objectives.

ITC no longer has random missions, primary or secondary. You choose three secondary from a list in each game.The SW/IG/BA player was on the FLG stream, and lost to an Ynnari list. A shame, because the Imperium player, Alex Fennell, was an excellent sportsman. He unfortunately deployed his assassins from reserve before he finished moving every other unit, and his opponent wouldn't let him finish his movement phase, but Mr. Fennell didn't complain and took it in stride.EDIT: This all kinds of off topic, but a guy in the Twitch chat was saying he wanted to give $5000 to Alex for good sportsmanship. Turns out, that Twitch chatter is Riot Games co-founder Marc "Tryndamere" Merrill, and he was being serious.

I know how it works. I didn’t mean the objectives are random at all. I meant drawing objectives to fit the opponent you’re playing. Drawing I guess implies random, substitute that with “choosing” instead. My apologies.

 

Best Coast Pairings has stayed pretty updated. They had Alex Fennell beating Michael Brandt in the first round of 8. Then Alex lost in the semi-finals to Tony Grippando. Tony was fielding Ynnari. Seeing as how I didn’t watch the stream this is what I have to go on. Either way it’s down to Eldar for the finals.

Edited January 29, 2018 by Calistarius

[depthcharge12]

 

 

 

he uses the characters too to just sit objectives if needed. The sang priest in the featured battle just collected points all game. The Ancients can do that role if neeeded. If you play to win you play the objective almost always.

I don’t think we are referring to the same list. This guy has no priest or ancient. But he has 12 characters, 6 AM infantry squads and 5 fenrisian wolves. I also know that playing objectives is the only way to win ITC matches. Especially, given the importance of drawing the right secondary objectives.

ITC no longer has random missions, primary or secondary. You choose three secondary from a list in each game.

 

The SW/IG/BA player was on the FLG stream, and lost to an Ynnari list. A shame, because the Imperium player, Alex Fennell, was an excellent sportsman. He unfortunately deployed his assassins from reserve before he finished moving every other unit, and his opponent wouldn't let him finish his movement phase, but Mr. Fennell didn't complain and took it in stride.

 

EDIT: This all kinds of off topic, but a guy in the Twitch chat was saying he wanted to give $5000 to Alex for good sportsmanship. Turns out, that Twitch chatter is Riot Games co-founder Marc "Tryndamere" Merrill, and he was being serious.

Not only do you have to play top tier eldar...but you’ve got to be an :cuss:hat while doing it :P

 

I’ve been riding that intercessor gravy train and been trying to convince other BA players to rock it out. I love that 8 man squad with a heavy Bolter. Absolute genius.

[Crimson Ghost IX]

Yeah well that was a sub optimal finish to the event in my opinion.

 

Was hoping to actually see the pure BA game, but it was not to be as WarhammerTV switched to Sigmar and the table was not covered. Such is life.

I hope the players generally had a great weekend.

 

The top 3 Eldar lists were all more or less mirrors of one another as they were created/copied by an evil cabal of players switching to Aelves for the raw power.

 

Mad Sportmanship chops on Alex Fennel for playing his final 4 round like such a gentleman in the face of... -unneeded adversity from a WAAC player.

Yeah let's call it that...

 

Alex's army was something to see (soupy soup) and the guy strikes me as a dude I would love to have a game with anytime anywhere and a thoughtful general etc.

 

Nick Nanavanti who wrote the original Eldar nasty (to hear him tell it anyhow) and refined it got some revenge for Alex at the end of it all and took the event with a sick Eldar army. If you see Shining Spears... pucker up buttercup, those gotta die priority target etc.

 

The event was entertaining to watch, but the last couple games especially did little to convince me I wanna play in those kind of circles myself personally.

The WAAC was strong by the end of it all for certain and I prefer hardcore games with a more casual attitude towards it being a game at the end of the day.

 

Anyhow great to see some BA doing well at a big event.

Our relative power and representation overall seems greater than it has been for several editions compared to ourselves previously at tourneys for whatever that is worth as a take away. The top Eldar players literally laughed when asked if they were concerned about the BA army or indeed imperials in the top 8 for whatever that is worth as a take away also.

[Ceril]

 

he uses the characters too to just sit objectives if needed. The sang priest in the featured battle just collected points all game. The Ancients can do that role if neeeded. If you play to win you play the objective almost always.

I don’t think we are referring to the same list. This guy has no priest or ancient. But he has 12 characters, 6 AM infantry squads and 5 fenrisian wolves. I also know that playing objectives is the only way to win ITC matches. Especially, given the importance of drawing the right secondary objectives.

My bad, sorry. Was thinking of the pure BA list.