How are your Custodes doing?

[Prot]

What is our cheapest riable psychic denial then?

Pure Custodes I use impregnable mind I think it’s called. It’s a plus 1 to a single deny. I got that off on a what would have been a nasty Warp Time. If my opponent is heavy Psyker it’s my go to.

[CaptainMarsh]

Custodes have some anti-psyker options. They aren't entirely defenseless, even if allies are required to really shore it up. But with so few models on the table that rely on beefy toughness and great saves, mortal wounds hurt us more than they do others. 

[Scurvydog]

Played 2 games this weekend with my Custodes, one against Space Wolves and one against Harlequins/Ynnari for 2000 pts.

 

I used this list for both games:

 

2 x Shield Captain on bike (1 with bike relic)

 

3 x guard squads, 2 with 3 and 1 with 5 man, 1 SS in all squads.

 

1 x 3 man allarus squad

 

2 x 3 Bikers, 1 salvo 2 HB in each squad

 

Grayfax

3 x 5 man squad of sisters of silence

 

 

First game was against Space Wolves, he fielded lots of longfangs, Bjorn, Njal, 2 dreads with 3++ shields, 3 characters with hammers/fists, rest was just grey hunters or cyberwolves.

 

I used deep strike stratagem for my 5 man guard unit. Due to short edge deployment, it took me 2 turns to advance into charge range, as he stayed back, his shooting only amounted to 2 lost bikes and 2 squads of the sisters, as the bikes were good at getting behind terrain. I used deep strikers in turn 3 with the 5 man guards and terminators, to support the bikes and captains. 

 

The 5 man guards went into Bjorn, I used the piercing strike strat to wound better, which got enough dmg in on him to take him down, before he could strike (with his WL trait). He then interrupted and struck my bikes with his dread, which took 1 bike to 1 wound, I struck back with the 3 man bike squad and only managed 2 wounds due to lucky 3++ saves. My other captain and remaining bike murdered long fangs and grey hunters at will, MEQ wihtout specialized melee equipment just melts to them. Next round ended up with him killing the 3 man bike squad and otherwise losing just about everything but his last dread. We called it then.

 

This might have looked different if I had not managed to deep strike and charge with my guards, being charged by Bjorn in turn would have hurt, a lot. Dreads with 3++ really hurts too. Grayfax managed to deny 2 powers from Njal and terrify some grey hunters with 3 flamers so they could not overwatch, so she was definitely worth the points. My bikes rolled terribly, missing or failing to wound with everyhing, only killed 1 longfang in total with combined 36 hurricane bolter shots... salvos did nothing as well. 

 

My takeaway here was mostly that grayfax is cool backup for custodes and that having a shield or two in guard squads is a very good idea.

 

The second game againt harlequins/ynnari was brutal and fast. He had Yvraine and a lot of characters and troupes in transports with a total of 30 fusion pistols... His plan of attack was to get the combo of involving disembark, psychic power to get an extra move phase, and then psychic soulburst to get bonus shooting phase, before shooting again.

 

He attempted this on 1 of my bike squads, the soulburst power got denied by grayfax (my hero), so I only lost 1 bike to pistol shots and another in the following charge, killing 2 back. This allowed me to fall back with it and murder the troupe with sister bolters and having a 3 man guard squad clean them up. 

 

Rest ended up in scattered brutal melees, with deep striking allarus charging a transport, killing it and then loosing 2 models from the troupe inside, while killing 2 (harlequins 4++ on everything is so annoying). Combined with his characterss, which give him reroll to wound and -1 to my wound rolls, make them dangerous and tough to kill, and their high AP reduces me to invul saves at all times.

 

It was vital to kill within 1 round, as allowing a shooting phase with his pistols would be the end of my guys. I got lucky though, with grayfax and sisters taking a few wounds of a psyker, he was then at 3 wounds and managed to perils for 3 wounds the next phase, even with a rerolll, which was glorious to see. Those Eldar players are so confident never failing anything ;).

 

The 2 dmg bolters in the guard spears ended up being surprisingly useful against the flimsy transports. And the following melee landed me on top, mostly due to a lack of multi dmg melee gear for harlequins. I ended up having lost my warlord biker, the 2 bikes in the beginning, 2 terminators and 8 sisters of silence. The pendulum could easily have swung the other way though, with these 2 elite armies.

 

 

All in all thye were fun games and i was pretty happy with my list. Grayfax and some sisters is definitely worth it, but I might try going pure custodes and use the points for a larger allarus squad and standard bearer in allarus armor as well, perhaps giving the warlord the deny trait. This is because of the speed of the bikers, you will without doubt outrun both grayfax and the sisters and deny range might be lacking to protect the bikers and I feel having a WL deny is a better trade, than using the deny banner relic, as I'd like the biker relic and dont want to lose the -1 to hit banner effect.

 

Right now I have a hard to seeing how trading anything for a land raider could help me or the dreadnaught. I liked the idea of getting a FW dread, but that would be for rule of cool gaming, as it seems a poor trade point for point. 

 

As a Grey Knight player I feel custodes are a much better elite army, as they have the staying power to live up to the name and the punch to back it up. They might fall short of the absolute peak of tournament spam lists and max cheese, but anything else they can deal with, thanks to interesting strategems, warlord traits and relics. Oh and tanglefoot grenade is one of the coolest strategems ever against enemy deep strikers.

[Prot]

Nice report.

 

I don't use as many bikers as you so I'm still really looking at Greyfax. I really got lucky my last game with Impregnable Mind. I don't think we can afford to not have a dedicated denial of some form. The wrong army will just blow through Custodes with different forms of mortal wounds.

 

I would prefer to stay pure Custodes but there is a price.

 

I also think you might be better off without the landraider. It's just way too expensive.

 

Funny enough I think Grey Knights are one army that would be good against Custodes. Whomever gets the charge is going to wreck face, and the psychic phase is still potent.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Landraiders are not worth it. Use the deep strike strategem. I run a SC in ATA and a squad of Allarus - the innate deep strike is really good for Custodes.

[Prot]

I am using that combo right now because the models are so darn cool. Thinking of taking an Allarus Magnifica too. But this leaves my foot sloggers in real trouble. I am really trying to resist 6 bikes.

 

The problem with this is I have Valois on the pavement with 9 guardians and the banner. My 3 bikes are playing mid field. My previous list had the Landraider for AT but really in this army it gets obliterated ( literally- pun intended)

[dtse]

Was thinking of running a larger unit of guardians. To maximize that +1 wound stratagem which seems quite good (ask any Blood Angels player!). But a large section of your army relying on making a 9” charge just doesn’t seem ultra good.

 

I also have versions with greyfax and culexus. At least culexus drops midfield to help your psychically while greyfax catches up. While taking sisters seems good I think they are just toughness 3 marines that die fast and have to walk

[Prot]

Yea I have sisters I want to use in this army but I can't find a practical application for them. Greyfax has been my goto for months, and the Culexus is always decent. I may just throw in another Assassin for the third elite (Acolyte) for the formation.

 

Someone here is using tons of Guardians (with the Strategem in mind).

[Withershadow]

Landraider...

I Park the -1 to hit vexilla next to it and push other units forward to distract away from it.

doesnt that only work for Infantry, or am I thinking of the invuln?

[Emissary]

 

Landraider...

I Park the -1 to hit vexilla next to it and push other units forward to distract away from it.

doesnt that only work for Infantry, or am I thinking of the invuln?

 

 

The -1 to hit vexilla works on all Custodes units, not just infantry.

[Frostbit3]

You may want to look at hector Rex instead of greyfax. For 30 extra points can deep strike with a 2+3++. Don’t have to worry about keeping up with the bikes. And against enemies that don’t have psykers can ds him into a corner or out of line of sight to hold a table quarter or linebreaker.

[Ishagu]

Eisemhorn is good too, as he can deny 2 powers and summon Cherubael :-)

[Withershadow]

Yeah, but a Daemonhost around Custodes? That is some mighty great heresy.

[Stoic Raptor]

While taking sisters seems good I think they are just toughness 3 marines that die fast and have to walk

 

Every turn your opponent is concentrating fire on the perceived threat is a turn that the actual threat can advance unmolested.  Give your opponent a couple of unfavorable dilemmas and let him struggle to decide which to ignore - or to divide his attentions amongst.

 

I don't think they're ideal for every matchup, but they can't be all that bad.

[Prot]

That’s true. I’d rather have the sisters shot at. They are actually doing most of what I need if even one is alive.

 

The thing is the Culexus is a solid all around unit for me, perhaps more than sisters.

 

As far as Greyfax, I do like her self loathing attitude.. it’s got Imperium written all over it. ;’

 

She does keep it really cheap to take a Vanguard, adding a CP to an army that is starved for them. I definitely see the value in Rex. While I don’t know his rules , for quite a while I took a generic Termie hq with my GK back in the day. I really don’t know their options that well.

[dtse]

Is Rex FW? Cause that’s a dealbreaker around my parts

[Gentlemanloser]

Rex is FW.

 

One bonus Greyfax has for Denies if that's why you take her is her inbuilt +1.  Brings her to the same prowess as GK units or Impregnable Mind.

[Ishagu]

Is Rex FW? Cause that’s a dealbreaker around my parts

Really? Even after all the nerfs?

 

Rex is indeed FW.

[Prot]

 

Is Rex FW? Cause that’s a dealbreaker around my parts

Really? Even after all the nerfs?

 

Rex is indeed FW.

 

 

 

 

This isn't a forgeworld thread really, but locally we allow it for fun and I still see bizarre stuff in it. This is why I would like to get an Achillus for my Custodes but it's hard to pay that much for all the fees for something I won't really be able to use out side of houserules. I may still get  the Achillus for fun though.. great model.

 

Rex is FW.

 

One bonus Greyfax has for Denies if that's why you take her is her inbuilt +1.  Brings her to the same prowess as GK units or Impregnable Mind.

This is why I like her so much. 

 

The deepstrike isn't a huge thing for me and Rex because I find with Custodes so much of the army is on the table anyway... footslogging that she's rarely if able going to be targeted by anything other than snipers.

[Gentlemanloser]

Not had a game in a couple of weeks, my current idea for meshing my AC with GK (and testing the FW Beta Achillus) is;

 

Supreme Command

HQ SC on Dawneagle, Bolters

HQ SC on Dawneagle, Bolters

HQ SC on Dawneagle, Bolters

 

Vanguard

HQ SC in Allarus, Axe

Elite Contemptor Achillus

Elite Vexila in Allarus, Magnifica, Misericordia

Elite Allarus Custodians, Spear x3

 

Vanguard

HQ GMNDK, Gattling Psilencer

Elite Doomglaive

Elite Doomglaive

Elite Doomglaive

 

I'll probably take a Bike as Warlord with IM for extra Deny.  Then Mantle it over to the SC in Allarus if he's still alive.

 

Allarus over Wardens so I don't need to pay CP to DS them.

 

Bikes, GMNDK and Doomglaives set up midfield, this gives me 5 +1 Denies first turn.

 

Achillus for backfield control.

 

SC, Vex and 3x Allarus to DS, protected by the -1 hit bubble.  To follow up the Bikes.

 

Lots of high toughness, durable units to try to soak fire, and all CC monsters to boot.

[Prot]

The list looks really nasty.... really potent. I love the Doomglaive personally but I don't know if it really will do a lot of heavy lifting in this list.

 

Overall though it's fast, and it's going to hit like a truck. There's so much low end pew pew that clouds of chaff will have trouble covering tanks/etc. I've cleared large swaths of Cultists with a single squad, and the opponent has maybe one real turn of shooting it all down before it's close combat time. 

 

But in this case (far stronger list than I use) you're going to have so many heavy hitters between the SC Dawn Eagles and GMNDK... I almost think this is an army you give up on board control and go for a deep pin. 

 

Out of the groups I play, I can see some Nid lists being a problem... I still find Astra immensely frustrating, but this list is quite strong. Something I'd try at an ITC event perhaps.

[Gentlemanloser]

Mainly it's based on minis I own.  Would love to use Greyfax and some SoS.  But my wallet. lol.

 

Bikes are to tie up problem units (or jump over screening), I'm just hoping to have so many big threats up front my opponent has too much to focus on.

 

Tried to shift things around, either Guard Squads or Strike Squads, to get a Battalion, but I think I'll have to settle for 6CP.

 

I'm not sold on how the Achillus will perform (I love it's model though, always planned on using them as 'counts-as' Doomgliaves pre AC codex), but prefer it for the long range shooting option over Land Raiders (or even GK Razorbacks).

[shanewatts]

Rex is really good, he also has +1 to deny (only within 12 though as opposed to greyfax's 24.) Being able to deepstrike and have a 2+/3++ makes him more durable than greyfax as well. His melee attacks will smash some daemons, every hit scored (out of 3 attacks) deals a mortal wound to them in addition to normal damage.

Edited March 7, 2018 by shanewatts

[Prot]

Does he have two denies though?

 

I just had a game wher I did not take my standard Impregnible Mind and even with my opponent having bad dice rolls, I really felt it.

[Withershadow]

Does he have two denies though?

 

I just had a game wher I did not take my standard Impregnible Mind and even with my opponent having bad dice rolls, I really felt it.

No, the mighty Hector Rex can deny three powers per turn at +1 within 12".