Lord on Juggernaut?

[steamius]

Hi there. I think its time to build my self a lord on jugg. But I dont know how good is he and how to use him. Was hoping that some of you might help me with that.

[Goreshed]

Pretty sure they pulled that option as they are no longer selling that model on the GW website. Unless its an option on the daemon side of things. For conversion wise I think it is always an awesome model to add to a collection.

[Panzer]

Pretty sure they pulled that option as they are no longer selling that model on the GW website. Unless its an option on the daemon side of things. For conversion wise I think it is always an awesome model to add to a collection.

You can still play one with the Index rules.

[Khornestar]

 

Pretty sure they pulled that option as they are no longer selling that model on the GW website. Unless its an option on the daemon side of things. For conversion wise I think it is always an awesome model to add to a collection.

You can still play one with the Index rules.

 

 

Indeed! He's still an option.

 

The drawbacks are: No official 40k model and unaffected by any Legion traits. The latter is far worse than the former IMO, and there's no good reason for it, but that's what we're working with. He's also just a touch too expensive, but once again, nothing to be done about that.

 

He's S5 base, so giving him a power fist bumps him up to S10, meaning he splatters anything T5 with 2+ to wound and he can in general threaten any target. However, he isn't generating any Death to the False Emperor! attacks with the fist. Giving him a Black Mace will bump him up to S8 and allow him to wound most vehicles on 3+ and still wound most infantry on 2+, keep his Death to the False Emperor! attacks and also inflict some mortal wounds once in a while. I really don't like the Axe of Blind Fury this edition due to the inability to re-roll 1's. A combi-weapon of some sort is also not a bad idea. I'd take a combi-melta, myself, since he's gonna be operating up close and can take a pop at something juicy.

 

If you're playing World Eaters, the Talisman of Burning Blood is also a good option, because he can then advance and charge, and re-roll charge distance if you want him to. He can get by with whatever power weapon, honestly, so this isn't a bad choice. Keeps him cheaper, since there's no reason to buy a combi-weapon with this relic.

[steamius]

 

 

Pretty sure they pulled that option as they are no longer selling that model on the GW website. Unless its an option on the daemon side of things. For conversion wise I think it is always an awesome model to add to a collection.

You can still play one with the Index rules.

 

 

Indeed! He's still an option.

 

The drawbacks are: No official 40k model and unaffected by any Legion traits. The latter is far worse than the former IMO, and there's no good reason for it, but that's what we're working with. He's also just a touch too expensive, but once again, nothing to be done about that.

 

He's S5 base, so giving him a power fist bumps him up to S10, meaning he splatters anything T5 with 2+ to wound and he can in general threaten any target. However, he isn't generating any Death to the False Emperor! attacks with the fist. Giving him a Black Mace will bump him up to S8 and allow him to wound most vehicles on 3+ and still wound most infantry on 2+, keep his Death to the False Emperor! attacks and also inflict some mortal wounds once in a while. I really don't like the Axe of Blind Fury this edition due to the inability to re-roll 1's. A combi-weapon of some sort is also not a bad idea. I'd take a combi-melta, myself, since he's gonna be operating up close and can take a pop at something juicy.

 

If you're playing World Eaters, the Talisman of Burning Blood is also a good option, because he can then advance and charge, and re-roll charge distance if you want him to. He can get by with whatever power weapon, honestly, so this isn't a bad choice. Keeps him cheaper, since there's no reason to buy a combi-weapon with this relic.

 

 Thanks! That really helped ^^) But what do you think about the murder sword?

[Khornestar]

I don't think a juggerlord is the best unit to wield it. He isn't that fast, and if the opponent throws roadblocks in his way then he'll never reach the character marked for death.

[Panzer]

Yeah Murdersword is best on mobile units like a Jump Pack character to avoid screening units.

[Goreshed]

Ah, I stand corrected my bad!

 

With all the codexes that have come out I keep forgetting about the Indexes...aw well.

[Khornestar]

The juggerlord also has the daemon keyword, so he can be buffed by a Herald of Khorne for +1S. This could take his power fist attacks to S12, which is pretty sick, but he doesn't have that many attacks. I think the herald's locus to re-roll failed charges should also apply to him on that basis. It's only the stratagems in the Daemons book he can't make use of, unless I'm mistaken.

 

For funsies:

 

Make him the warlord and give him the +1A warlord trait. An extra attack can end up making a big difference. The Flames of Spite warlord trait could also be awesome, because if you include the juggernaut's attacks he has 7 total, so he has a decent chance of getting a 6 or two on the wound roll. Death to the False Emperor! could enhance this.

 

Run him along a buddy Bloodmaster (herald on foot) or Skullmaster (herald on juggernaut) for the daemon buffs. This just makes him better in any situation.

 

I think I have to take back what I said about the Axe of Blind Fury. I've engaged in some pretty squirrely calculations, so I could be totally mistaken, but it looks like the ol' AoBF actually deals more total damage than any other weapon option against T4 3+, T4 2+/5++, T5 4++, and T7 3+. This is speaking in terms of dealing total damage.

 

These are taking +1A warlord trait and DttFE! into account. These are the only ones I've calculated so far. This is using only averages, I didn't even try deviations. Get outta here!

 

At any rate, slow man's math-hammer right here. Please let me know if I totally screwed my calculations up:

 

This is Axe of Blind Fury & Herald of Khorne +1S buff, so S9 AP-3 D3, 5 attacks base due to +1A trait and no re-rolls for rolling 1's

• Against T4 3+ (e.g. Space Marines) it deals 10.1 wounds on its own. 

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 1.2 wounds for 11.3 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 1.0 wounds for 11.1 wounds total

• Against T4 2+/5++ (e.g. Terminators) it deals 8.1 wounds on its own:

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 0.9 wounds for 9.0 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 0.6 wounds for 8.7 wounds total

• Against T5 4++ (e.g. Ogryns with Bruteshields) it deals 8.1 wounds on its own

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 1.0 wounds for 9.1 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 0.7 wounds for 8.8 wounds total

• Against T7 3+ (e.g. Rhino/Predator/Razorback) it deals 6.5 wounds on its own

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 1.0 wounds for 7.5 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 0.5 wounds for 7.0 wounds total

If he is NOT the warlord/using another trait, the situation is still the same, he'll just do less damage:

• Against T4 3+ (e.g. Space Marines) it deals 8.1 wounds on its own. 

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 1.2 wounds for 9.3 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 1.0 wounds for 9.1 wounds total

• Against T4 2+/5++ (e.g. Terminators) it deals 6.5 wounds on its own:

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 0.9 wounds for 7.4 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 0.6 wounds for 7.1 wounds total

• Against T5 4++ (e.g. Ogryns with Bruteshields) it deals 3.9 wounds on its own

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 1.0 wounds for 4.9 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 0.7 wounds for 4.6 wounds total

• Against T7 3+ (e.g. Rhino/Predator/Razorback) it deals 5.2 wounds on its own

1. With S8 Juggernaut attacks (on the charge), add 1.0 wounds for 6.2 wounds total
2. With S6 Juggernaut attacks (all other situations), add 0.5 wounds for 5.7 wounds total

I think the only time a different weapon is better is a pair of lightning claws against Space Marines, and then it's so marginal (0.1 more unsaved wounds if he's the warlord, 0.2 if not; so virtually the same).

Edited February 17, 2018 by Juggernut

[Panzer]

Keep in mind that while he'd do 10.1 damage against Space Marines, it's not 10 dead Marines since you'd overkill each Marine with your D3 stat. Certainly useful against units with FnP effects tho!

[Trevak Dal]

I wish that they still moved 12" instead of only 8", that's what killed it for me.

[Khornestar]

Keep in mind that while he'd do 10.1 damage against Space Marines, it's not 10 dead Marines since you'd overkill each Marine with your D3 stat. Certainly useful against units with FnP effects tho!

 

Yup, definitely. He'd only kill 3.4 + 1.2 = 4.6 at a time (on the charge).

 

The most surprising/pleasing part is that the Axe of Blind Fury is the best weapon for him, in general, against the targets listed, which seemed like the most common targets that I fight against.

 

I wish that they still moved 12" instead of only 8", that's what killed it for me.

 

Me too. A bit slow for my taste, as well. 10" would have been more palatable, even.

Edited February 16, 2018 by Juggernut

[Commissar K.]

Certainly give him a go! He's very cool to play and model :D 

[Vantraxx]

He's good for hanging with your Landraiders for reroll 1's on your Lascannon shots.

Also Talasmin of Burning Blood is good for him to keep up with your Zerkers when they come out of the Landraiders and the rhino rush...

[Khornestar]

He's good for hanging with your Landraiders for reroll 1's on your Lascannon shots.

Also Talasmin of Burning Blood is good for him to keep up with your Zerkers when they come out of the Landraiders and the rhino rush...

 

Yeah, the Talisman is sick.

 

If that's what you go with, I think the "best" loadout is probably a pair of lightning claws against most single-wound infantry, and a power fist against anything tougher.

Edited February 17, 2018 by Juggernut

[steamius]

Wanted to thank you all for the help! This really have me an insight to the unit and where I want to go with him ^^)