Really tired of seeing flying golden bananas everywhere.....

[Kasper_Hawser]

.... I'm sorry, I mean custodes. It seems like everyone and their dog is trying to field 3 shield captains on bikes in their lists. I don't know why this feels me with rage.

 

Sorry, just needed to rant to my fellow wolves. But just so I have a reason to post this here, can somebody explain to me WHY the cheesemongers are doing this? I know they're power houses in melee and even have good anti horde weapons, but seriously, isn't 3 characters zipping around still vulnerable even with character protection?

 

And if so, what is the best way to take down those bloody Imperial strippers.... I mean custodes. I swear those 3 Shield Captains are the same guys as the TTS idiots. And even the TTS idiots look better than those golden bikes.

Edited February 27, 2018 by WarriorFish
Unnecessary words edited

[Jackalwolf]

Ask the opponent the reason there are three freaking custodes captains out of the 100 of the galaxy in his detachment without any troops to command.

 

If he can't answer, don't play.

[Kasper_Hawser]

Ask the opponent the reason there are three freaking custodes captains out of the 100 of the galaxy in his detachment without any troops to command.

 

If he can't answer, don't play.

 

Yeah well sadly I can't do that without sounding like a fluff fanatic. Which incidentally, I am. Well, not a fanatic in the sense I want to kill and suicide bomb anyone who comes up with such a list, but I get unnecessarily upset when I see this "Imperial soup" armies. And that's just Imperial Soup. There are others who can put Magnus, Mortarion and Grand papa smurf in a list.

[TiguriusX]

I run around with Bjorn and there is only 1 of him in the entire galaxy.  The Space Wolves don't wake him up for menial 750 point patrol missions.

 

Who am I to criticize

[Kasper_Hawser]

I run around with Bjorn and there is only 1 of him in the entire galaxy.  The Space Wolves don't wake him up for menial 750 point patrol missions.

 

Who am I to criticize

 

Not sure why you think its wrong about using Bjorn frequently. Nothing wrong with Bjorn getting some exercise once in awhile even if its just a simple 1000 point battle. I think they used him pretty frequently up to a certain point in time, when it became harder and harder to wake him up. After all, once upon a time he would have been a younger dreadnought.

 

back to topic, going to face a lot of solo Shield captains soon. Hopefully a few Wulfen in the face will suffice.

[Guest Triszin]

Just get some ablative rhinos and form a conga line to make them stuck in combat, when one rhino dies, send in the next.

[TiguriusX]

 

 

I run around with Bjorn and there is only 1 of him in the entire galaxy. The Space Wolves don't wake him up for menial 750 point patrol missions.

 

Who am I to criticize

Not sure why you think its wrong about using Bjorn frequently. Nothing wrong with Bjorn getting some exercise once in awhile even if its just a simple 1000 point battle. I think they used him pretty frequently up to a certain point in time, when it became harder and harder to wake him up. After all, once upon a time he would have been a younger dreadnought.

 

back to topic, going to face a lot of solo Shield captains soon. Hopefully a few Wulfen in the face will suffice.

It was in the context of complaining someone else has a non fluffy list

 

IMO they paid money for their toys they can paint them whatever colors they want and make up whatever story or justification they want.

 

Is the list legal no cheating?

 

Ok game on and good luck to you

[Kasper_Hawser]

 

 

I run around with Bjorn and there is only 1 of him in the entire galaxy. The Space Wolves don't wake him up for menial 750 point patrol missions.

 

Who am I to criticize

Not sure why you think its wrong about using Bjorn frequently. Nothing wrong with Bjorn getting some exercise once in awhile even if its just a simple 1000 point battle. I think they used him pretty frequently up to a certain point in time, when it became harder and harder to wake him up. After all, once upon a time he would have been a younger dreadnought.

 

back to topic, going to face a lot of solo Shield captains soon. Hopefully a few Wulfen in the face will suffice.

It was in the context of complaining someone else has a non fluffy list

 

IMO they paid money for their toys they can paint them whatever colors they want and make up whatever story or justification they want.

 

Is the list legal no cheating?

 

Ok game on and good luck to you

 

 

as mentioned, i'm not going to go wulfen on them and pick a fight based on fluffiness. I'm very well its my own personal tastes and sensibilities that are being irritated, but I will not seek to transmit them to others.

 

I just need a pick me up in biased ranting, so forgive me. 4 years of 40K and I'm still playing mono-codex.

[TiguriusX]

You have been and shall always be my mono codex battle brother.

 

People in my escalation league were confused when i said i dont care about resetting and picking new factions

 

I always have been and always will be a space wolf. I'm tempted to augment with a small detachment of codex marines for the BAO (need scout deployment bad...) but i also want to be a stubborn mono codex wolf

[MeatGrinder]

People wanna play a unique list, let them be and don't get salty about it. They are brand new, with awesome models. Theyre not even that good in the competitive meta.

[Rannik the White]

I would willingly face those three captains, instead of Magnus the Red.  A Thousand Sons in our store uses him in every game he plays.  Why would a Primarch bother with small actions.

[PeteySödes]

Anyone found any reliable counters? Normally i'd say my 3PC/2LC fangs would do the trick but i dont like the -1 to hit that most WL seem to take.

[sturguard]

Comes down to the same old issue, people are going to field what they think gives them a competitive edge, sadly even in one off games at gaming stores. It just is more apparent now that few people use mono codexes. I too play all my armies as mono lists, I have no real use for the new 40k fluff (which is being ever expanded)- I prefer playing in the original 40k universe.

[Trevak Dal]

Something that doesn't sit well with me (being an aspiring grey knight player) is how many Grand Master Dreadknights come out to play.

 

Yeah...it's the actual "most effective use" of the model (like crisis commanders), but still it kind of irks me.

 

I would willingly face those three captains, instead of Magnus the Red. A Thousand Sons in our store uses him in every game he plays. Why would a Primarch bother with small actions.

Why would Guilliman, lord commander of the Imperium come out to a patrol?

Edited February 27, 2018 by Trevak Dal

[RikuEru]

Why would Guilliman, lord commander of the Imperium come out to a patrol?

He likes to take "very enthusiastic walks through the park".

(Kudos to anyone who gets the quote...

Go watch Hellsing Abridged if you didn't and enjoy some dark humor ;) )

 

To be honest, I get you.

I only play Space Wolves aswell and I probably would play all other armies mono-codex aswell - except for maybe a special narrative game, if ever.

And it's why I do not play at the moment.

We do not have a Codex, which after all is said and done, still is a disadvantage.

Add to that my local store being very competitive, little social skills among some of the players and the store owner trying to sell you Models "your army lacks" DURING games.

(And my "play at home" group of friends has shifted their focus away from 40k, sadly)

 

Funny thing is:

Some of the Players are very eager to play beginners/young teens, to get easy wins.

But they never wanna duke it out between each other, Soup against Soup.

 

...can't wait to make a nice, hot Fenrisian Stew soon and get some enemy blood to salt my stew.

[Kasper_Hawser]

Did somebody edit my original post? I feel like missing a paragraph although somehow still looks the same to me, but someone other than me seems to have edited it. I would really appreciate it if i was told/pm  if I needed to edit my post rather than just straight away censored like that. Otherwise, I don't even know what I did wrong.

 

I guess I do sound like a whiner, but i like to think this is just to let others vent a bit rationally.

 

@ Rikueru - thanks for getting me.

 

@ Trevaldal - I hear you. Although it's not the mass baby carriers that irk me, normal or grand master. it's the fact that they march into the battle alone without bothering about battle brothers. If you bring three Grand Masters in baby carriers accompanied by terminators, paladins and even allied troops, it wouldn't irk me so much.

 

At least with Custodians, I can somewhat justify in fluff that they've always operated in VERY small numbers and First Heretic made it clear that they don't bother so much with unit cohesion, being an army of lions instead of wolves (no pun intended) which Astartes doctrine focus on.

 

I still despise them.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

90% of WH40k games are skirmish style and the current format lends itself to what many call "soup."

GW hasn't really developed much to reward player to build fluffy or mono Armies, yet either.

 

I don't have any issues with it at all.. a player can say his army is from a very specific point in the 40k timeline and can develop any excuse to validate whatever the imperial soup of the day is. 

Honestly, I blame the internet and forums. It's nothing personal against them, however, you can't get any list advice on the interwebnets without someone saying "wellll thats not very competitive." It's producing a pretty poor culture within the 40k community.

 

 

 

To be honest, I get you.
I only play Space Wolves aswell and I probably would play all other armies mono-codex aswell - except for maybe a special narrative game, if ever.
And it's why I do not play at the moment.
We do not have a Codex, which after all is said and done, still is a disadvantage.
Add to that my local store being very competitive, little social skills among some of the players and the store owner trying to sell you Models "your army lacks" DURING games.
(And my "play at home" group of friends has shifted their focus away from 40k, sadly)

 

 

 I completely agree and I have stopped playing my Space Wolves as well for the time being. I no longer only play Space Wolves though. I felt they were very underwhelming in 7th edition and after reading their rules in the index I decided to take a break. Hopefully the wait wont be too much longer. 

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

Did somebody edit my original post? I feel like missing a paragraph although somehow still looks the same to me, but someone other than me seems to have edited it. I would really appreciate it if i was told/pm  if I needed to edit my post rather than just straight away censored like that. Otherwise, I don't even know what I did wrong.

 

I guess I do sound like a whiner, but i like to think this is just to let others vent a bit rationally.

 

 

Your original post was edited by WarriorFish. The gold bar at the bottom of your post tells you that.

The reason for the edit is told to you in the gold bar at the bottom of your post.

 

Two single words were removed from your post. Profanity is not tolerated on the B&C. Our mission statement: The Bolter & Chainsword exists to help people better enjoy and understand the Warhammer 40,000 hobby and games set in the Warhammer 40,000 universe through constructive discussion.

 

If you find yourself unfamiliar with the rules of the Bolter and Chainsword, I advise you to refresh yourself here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/334648-rules-of-the-bolter-chainsword/?p=4781291

 

If you have any further questions or grievances, please contact one of the mods of the Fang or Admin. We are always willing to discuss an issue with our fellow frater. 

 

Jarl Kjaran Coldheart

Moderator of the B][C

 

[Kasper_Hawser]

@ Jarl Coldheart, point taken. Will be more careful.

[Nrthstar]

So I was on board with the mono list until 7th.  When you first could take allies, I hated the idea.  My wolves would stand alone and be badasses.  But as someone who does read a lot of Black Library, the idea of a combined force (what you guys are calling soup) made more sense.  Rarely does any imperial force muster by itself.  All Adeptus Astartes fight side by side with guard, other chapters, etc.  I think we got stuck in our old ways, because most of us here in the Fang started 5th or before, when you could only take one army, and most of us, only built one army, Wolves, because we absolutely loved it and couldn't imagine anything else.

 

Basically, I would argue that it's even more fluffy to have Wolves fighting alongside another imperial force, not less so.  I do play 40k under two contexts though, narrative/open war deck/fun and tournaments, mostly team tournaments, because they are amazingly fun, and it keeps me abreast of what is really out there.  I have seen disgusting totally non fluffy lists, and I've seen some where both teammates went out of the way to match each other.  This last weekend my partner and I played double Nids to have a massive swarm on the table mixed with big bugs.  I did come across a Nurgle/Tzeentch (who hate each other) with Magnus and Morty and daemon princes.  It was hideous in every way.  My next game was 6 banana bike captains and guard.  A little better themed, but the odds of six shield captains doesn't make sense (unless maybe Tyranids are invading, and it's a key world).  

[Nrthstar]

Anyone found any reliable counters? Normally i'd say my 3PC/2LC fangs would do the trick but i dont like the -1 to hit that most WL seem to take.

 

 

You can't tie up bikes, they have fly.  You can charge them and they'll just scoot away.  For wolves, you need a big pack of Fenrisian Wolves to block out the bikes from charging what they really want to charge.  Give them no space to land to charge.  I blocked 6 shield captains on bikes this weekend with my Nids using large blobs of Termagants.

[Kasper_Hawser]

 

Anyone found any reliable counters? Normally i'd say my 3PC/2LC fangs would do the trick but i dont like the -1 to hit that most WL seem to take.

 

 

You can't tie up bikes, they have fly.  You can charge them and they'll just scoot away.  For wolves, you need a big pack of Fenrisian Wolves to block out the bikes from charging what they really want to charge.  Give them no space to land to charge.  I blocked 6 shield captains on bikes this weekend with my Nids using large blobs of Termagants.

 

 

While I thank you for your simple tactic, please note that I'm seeking a counter from the following perspectives. I really hope you are not recommending me to get some nids to bubble wrap my Long Fangs:

 

1) Using only Space Wolves Index Imperium (almost impossible I know, only cheap bubble wrap we got is fen wolves which have abysmal Lead 4.

2) Using perhaps one other ally that make sense ASIDE from golden bananas. Even allying with the wolves cross dressing cousins the Dark Angels would make more sense.

 

@ Nrthstar, point taken. Perhaps its finally time to start doing up some mortal allies for myself. I even planned for this years ago to go guard as a secondary ally but I was just so insistent on only Space Wolves, and completely disgusted with the old allies system in the past, even more with soup armies.

 

Sigh, if only like some strategy games or MMORPG like World of Warcraft, we have a unit or foot slogging character that can TAUNT a unit and force them to come nearer or even force them to shoot only them in their phase. Aggro management so to speak.

Edited March 2, 2018 by Kasper_Hawser

[TiguriusX]

I faced regular custodes bikes rather than shield captains but i basically dared them to come at my lascannons. If i had a shot i took it. Needed cp reroll on a bad damage roll but i dropped the sobs and their 4++ eventually. All it takes is a few failed saves.

 

The jet bikes couldn't charge my LF because i had a screening force in the way that would tear them up. Besides shield dreads i also had my own wg bikers who throw buckets of dice and can get lucky wounds through.

[NKWulf]

I field 4 Shield Captains muhahahaha   jk.

[Kasper_Hawser]

I faced regular custodes bikes rather than shield captains but i basically dared them to come at my lascannons. If i had a shot i took it. Needed cp reroll on a bad damage roll but i dropped the sobs and their 4++ eventually. All it takes is a few failed saves.

 

The jet bikes couldn't charge my LF because i had a screening force in the way that would tear them up. Besides shield dreads i also had my own wg bikers who throw buckets of dice and can get lucky wounds through.

 

Regular custodes bikes I would say are manageable since unlikely they can bump their saves to 3++ unlike the solo shield captains, and you can shoot them anytime you want as long as you can see then. But super characters on super flying bikes are just begging to abuse the character rules and on top of that, bring their durability into better than TH/SS level on a FAST unit. 

 

You used your Dread and WG bikers as your counter charge unit? Bear in mind though, normally I put Long Fangs on upstair ruins, and dreads and bikes can't climb ruins. Besides, once they charge, they would have killed the back line heavy support and done their job before the counter charge units come knocking. Unless you have someone like Ragnar who as a 6" heroic intervention.

 

Hmmm, I think I'll do what I've been doing in my regular games: park the Long Fangs out of LOS, then use Rhinos and Razorbacks left behind by my GH squads whom I decided to outflank, then move to better locations while escorted by my counter charge units. This will give the bananas no viable or valuable weak targets to shoot/charge.

Edited March 2, 2018 by Kasper_Hawser