FSE - Updating the Eight - A Discussion

[StruManChu]

I've always loved Farsight, his tiny empire and penchant for a massive bodyguard, and when the FSE Codex dropped I was giddy, because the Eight, while not necessarily a hugely effective thing, were freaking baller. 

 

With the new codex and new edition bringing a whole raft of changes, I'm wanting to update Farsight's mob to be useful, characterful and most importantly, usable. I'm not interested in looking at points costs or effectiveness at the moment, necessarily. I just want to get it to a starting point that we can build something more effective from.

 

Given that we now have a limit of max. three Commanders, this is going to be difficult. Equally, given that some of the signature systems that used to be available to FSE are now Other-Sept-only (lookin' at you, Vectored Retro Thrusters...), and given that Signature Systems are one per army unless you're using Emergency Dispensation to get some more, this makes things difficult. However! Some of those same Signature Systems are now stratagems instead, which gives a flexibility that we didn't necessarily have before.

 

 

Now, breaking down the Eight, we have 6 Commanders and 2 others - 

 

 

Commander Farsight

- Obviously a special character, not much to say. If you're playing fluffy, he's probably an auto-include, but if you're not then he seems like he might be a bit naff to me.

 

 

Commander Bravestorm

- XV8-02 Iridium Battlesuit - XV8 upgrade

- Plasma Rifle

- Flamer

- Stimulant Injector - 1CP Stratagem for Battlesuit units w/ 10 or more wounds, i.e. not Bravestorm

- Shield Generator

- 2 Gun Drones

- Onager Gauntlet - Signature System (1 per army)

 

Even though Iridium Armour goes in all the XV8 squads now, if you want to run Bravestorm with his 7th Ed equipment, then there's no option but to run him as a Commander, because that's the only way to give him the Gauntlet. Interestingly though, there's no FSE-specific equipment in his loadout, so you could run him as another Sept to make him slightly more effective. With 2+/4++ he's got decent protection, and also only has 3 out of 4 slots taken up, so you can add in something else. However his signature system, with its single S10 attack, is best placed going up against vehicles or lone support characters (Apothecaries etc.) and there's someone better at that... Speaking of which -

 

 

Commander Brightsword

- XV8 Commander

- Twin-linked Fusion Blasters

- ATS

- Stimulant Injector - As above

- Shield Drone

- Fusion Blades - FSE Only Signature System (1 per army)

- Warscaper Drone - Doesn't exist in current ruleset, but granted Move through Cover, Outflank and Acute Senses, as well as making difficult terrain dangerous for any enemy unit within 12"

 

Arguably the star of the show, in my book. To make up for his loss of maneuverability now that Warscaper Drones have been lost to the ages, I'd suggest giving him a Coldstar suit as a good way to represent both Move Through Cover and Outflank, as a 40" move will let him get around or alongside most things. As mentioned above, Brightsword's Fusion Blades will be more effective at killing vehicles, with 2 attacks rather than one, D6 damage on both. The only downside is S8 vs. S10, but you get to shoot -and- assault with Fusion Blades, so that's money to me. With Fusion Blades now replacing the TL-Fusion Blasters, you've also got a spare slot for another weapon or support system, as well as a second drone. Might be worth hanging on to that HOBC if you're putting him in a Coldstar in case he needs to do some crowd-control? 

 

 

Commander Sha'vastos  

- XV8 Commander

- Plasma Rifle

- Flamer

- Shield Generator

- Vectored Retro-Thrusters - T'au Sept only Sig. System - Gives JSJ (1 per army)

- 2 x Gun Drones

- Puretide Engram Chip - Sig. System (1 per army)

 

Not much here either, tbh. The Puretide chip is much more important to Sha'vastos as a character than the VRT, so if you're running him and you're not taking Emergency Dispensation, that's probably your lot. Again, there's a spare hardpoint here, so go nuts with a CIB or a Drone Controller or whatever you want to add. Actually, with the Puretide Chip granting a once per game anything-at-all re-roll, you might be better off dropping it and running Sha'vastos as a Psuedo-Buffmander using C&C Node, because you're getting more re-rolls for a single CP and it's still kinda what the Puretide Chip does, so it's not completely fiuff-breaking. You do lose the Puretide Chip's ability to potentially give you 1CP on a roll of a 6 every time you or your opponent use a stratagem, but that's likely only going to net you an extra one or two a game. Not really sure what to do with this guy though.

 

 

Shas'O Arra'kon

- XV8-05 Enforcer Commander

- Plasma Rifle

- CIB

- AFP

- Counterfire Defence System - Support System: Re-roll failed to hit in Overwatch

- 2 x Gun Drone

- Repulsor Impact Field - 1CP Stratagem: If you're successfully charged, every model within 6" suffers a Mortal wound if you roll a 6.

 

Someone get this guy charged! If you're happy to not run him as FSE Sept, then run Arra'kon as T'au Sept and get overwatch on a 5+ (as well as your drones, and anyone within 6" of you), then re-roll your misses, then if the charge still succeeds, you've got the chance of inflicting automatic Mortal wounds before combat even begins. Not too shabby. Probably a one-trick pony, but if he survives he can do it again! Arra'kon's is the simplest translation from 7th to 8th because he's not missing anything and everything still works. Loadout isn't amazing, but you've got the CIB which is good, and an extra wound for the Enforcer upgrade. Not awful, but not as good as a Commander should be.

 

 

Sub-Commander Torchstar

- XV8 Commander

- 2 x Flamers

- Target Lock

- Drone Controller

- 2 x Markerlight Drones

- Multi-spectrum Sensor Suite - 1CP Stratagem - Removes enemy cover this turn

- Neuroweb System Jammer - 2CP Stratagem - Pick an enemy unit with 18" of a Battlesuit Commander. That unit shoots at -1 this phase

 

Again, a relatively simple translation from 7th to 8th. I've said this in another thread, but given her simple loadout and the three Commander limit, I'd say it makes sense to run Torchstar as the nomial Shas'vre of an XV8 squad and drop the Drone Controller or the Target Lock. She is a 'Subcommander' after all. Marker Drones don't sit well here, and the MSSS won't help her flamers particularly, but if she's in a unit with two other XV8s with BCs or CIBs, then it's potentially pretty good shooting. Not sure if it's good enough to be a competitive take, but if you were going to take a twin-flamer Battlesuit, you should just call it Torchstar and be done with it. 

 

 

And the not-Commanders -

 

 

O'Vesa 

- Riptide

- Ion Accelerator

- Twin-Linked Fusion Blaster

- Riptide Shield Generator

- Early Warning Override - Support System - May shoot at any enemy units that deploys within 12" (Deep Strike etc.) at -1 BS

- Stimulant Injector - 1CP Stratagem - Battlesuit w/ 10+ wounds may use it's full stats until turn end despite damage, unless destroyed

- 2 Shielded Missile Drones

- Earth Caste Pilot Array - No such thing in 8th

 

I'm not completely up to speed on Riptides in 8th, other than I'm aware they've slightly improved from the Index and that you're better off taking a Y'Vahra anyway, despite the points. In any case, this is all pretty standard. The Earth Caste Pilot array is probably best replicated by the Branched Nova Reactor (being able to choose two effects representing the old 're-roll your result), but as there's seemingly no way to reduce your WS to 6+, that's about it. Maybe O'Vesa's been practicing his blade work in the 200 years since 7th Edition...

 

 

Ob'Latai 9-0

- Broadside Battlesuit

- TL High Yield Missile Pod

- TL Smart Missile system

- Velocity Tracker - Support System - Shooting attacks get +1 against Fly keyword

- 2 Missile Drones

- Seeker Missile

- Bonding Knife

 

Again, very simple shift from 7th to 8th. He's not doing anything unexpected. It's a shame that Seeker Missiles only hit on a 6, but 12 shots a turn (plus 2 each from the drones) with +1 against anything with the Fly keyword is pretty good. I'd rather he had a railgun, but that's what you get. Not sure what else to say. Does what it says on the tin.

 

 

So there you have it. 

 

In terms of actually updating them, I'm not up to speed enough with 8th yet to offer any clever suggestions, because I've been playing Heresy since well before 8th dropped and have only played a handful of games, but I love the FSE, and I very much want to run them. As you may have seen, I'm not at all opposed to running a 'Farsight' army that's made up of different Sept Detachments, because I think that's a good way of representing defectors and such and, in order to make some stuff work, you do need to pick and choose a little.

 

Examining the Septs, and how members of the Eight may relate to them -

 

Farsight Enclaves - Up close, hard-hitting, alpha strike. Brightsword and Torchstar definitely suit this style, and its warlord trait as well

Vior'la - Similar to the above. Aggressive, Fast moving. Great for gunline, but not seeing a heap of synergy between the Tenet/trait and the Eight though, tbh

T'au - Given the T'au warlord trait, Bravestorm is the obvious candidate here, purely because he should be dead but his resolve won't let him be.

Sa'Cea - A steady, measured hand. One good shot will do if you do it right. Arra'kon the analytical or Sha'vastos the tactician would fit here as less aggressive Commanders.

Bork'an - Technology! Craftsmanship! Great for O'Vesa and Ob'Latai, but they can't be Bork'an all by themselves, so you'll need to pick a Commander and make him be Bork'an to get the range bonuses.

Dal'yth - Kinda leave this one at home? 

 

Looking at the above, I'd potentially do something like - 

 

Coldstar Brightsword as Warlord in an FSE Sept Detachment with FSE type things (Breachers, etc. Stuff that wants to be close. A Shas'vre Torchstar potentially in here doing a Manta Strike)

Arra'kon or Sha'vastos as a respec'ed Buffmander (somehow) commanding a small Sa'cea Sept Detachment with gunline stuff camping on the home objective/s

Arra'kon (maybe Bravestorm?) as a Bork'an or Sa'Cea Sept for the Big Suits (O'Vesa and Ob'Latai go here)

 

That gives me a good six out of the Eight, with Farsight and one other benched for now. If they FAQ Special Characters out of the Commander restriction, which they may well because they were never part of the Commander Spam problem as their gear is fixed, then he'll be in, but otherwise I prefer what's above, I think.

 

Anyway. That's a load of text. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

 

[Panzer]

Uhm you can have more than 3 Commanders. The 3 detachments at 2k thing is just an advice, not a fix rule. Unless you play on tournaments with such a rule nothing is stopping you from taking more.

Also since is more a fluff thing it probably fits better in Narrative games anyway where there's no Commander limit in the first place.

[StruManChu]

Oh, I'm very much aware that you can. However, my gaming group consists pretty much solely guys with girlfriends/wives and/or families, so we only get a couple of hours a month together for gaming, so our meta is very much Matched Play at around 2k points, because that way you pretty much know how long the game will go.

 

Obviously that's not going to be everyone's thing, but I want to be able to run as many of the Eight in matched play as I can. I know I'll probably be at a disadvantage, but I want to mitigate that as much as possible with cold hard analysis and discussion. ;)

[Guest Triszin]

for

Torchstar

 

consider making their sept the one that gives the super flamer

[Panzer]

Oh, I'm very much aware that you can. However, my gaming group consists pretty much solely guys with girlfriends/wives and/or families, so we only get a couple of hours a month together for gaming, so our meta is very much Matched Play at around 2k points, because that way you pretty much know how long the game will go.

 

Obviously that's not going to be everyone's thing, but I want to be able to run as many of the Eight in matched play as I can. I know I'll probably be at a disadvantage, but I want to mitigate that as much as possible with cold hard analysis and discussion.

Don't worry, I'm in the same boat. But as I said, there's no such limit as max 3 Commander or max 3 detachments in the rules. It's an advice and as long as you don't plan to play on tournaments who take that advice as fix rule you don't have to worry about it. ;)