InquisitorBlack Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Hi all I didn't want to derail the other thread about FAQ expectations, but there's been a lot of discussion in local gaming groups and on Facebook about the FAQ delay. There's a plethora of different opinions on it, what do you think? It is affecting your army building/hobbying as you wait for the details or are you soldiering on as normal?I personally think GW should have known about the power of Flyrants and Poxwalkers and not needed to delay the FAQ into April... I made a video with some of my concerns about it which I'll post here as well: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
domsto Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 I think it is good they wait with it. There are some big Problems in the Meta right now (Dark Reaper,Flyrants,Poxwalker) and they must be nerfed, but in a way they are still playable. Look at the Conscripts for example. They got over nerfed in a little Panic reaction and now completely unplayable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042560 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ascanius Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 "Who cares?" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042605 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexington Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 I think it's a bit of a stretch to assume the delay is specifically for those issues. They might be taking any number of things about Adepticon into account, not just the top table stuff that's causing so much community chatter. Honestly, I'd hope so - the community always focuses on what wins, but that's a really tiny sample size with a lot of potential for skewed results. A list may only be so-so overall, for example, but end up being an excellent counter for whatever the hottest army around might be. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042699 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 The most cynical part of me thinks they barely had anything changed, didn’t like what they saw at Adepticon, and then decided to actually make some changes. I mostly don’t care, I’m just worried they’ll senselessly nerf things that many players use but very few “exploit” in the ways tournament players do. I guess we’ll see, if and when they finally give us the document. Ultimately, it probably won’t change all that much. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042709 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mileposter Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Mountains out of mole hills. The consumer base always overreacts. And typically without thinking, too. It's possible that the reason for the delay has absolutely nothing to do with 40k whatsoever. Getting all worked up over it is just a waste of everyone's time and provides no benefit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042736 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Mountains out of mole hills. The consumer base always overreacts. And typically without thinking, too.It's possible that the reason for the delay has absolutely nothing to do with 40k whatsoever.Getting all worked up over it is just a waste of everyone's time and provides no benefit. Yeah, hard to argue with that. I think some folks are more prone than others to react emotionally when something they love is tinkered with in a way they don’t enjoy, even if it’s just a game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Mountains out of mole hills. The consumer base always overreacts. And typically without thinking, too. It's possible that the reason for the delay has absolutely nothing to do with 40k whatsoever. Getting all worked up over it is just a waste of everyone's time and provides no benefit. Well seeing as the reason given for the delay was "Delaying the March faq just a little bit so we can integrate our findings from AdeptiCon with your feedback" I'd say it had everything to do with 40k. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042877 Share on other sites More sharing options...
InquisitorBlack Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 The most cynical part of me thinks they barely had anything changed, didn’t like what they saw at Adepticon, and then decided to actually make some changes. I mostly don’t care, I’m just worried they’ll senselessly nerf things that many players use but very few “exploit” in the ways tournament players do. I guess we’ll see, if and when they finally give us the document. Ultimately, it probably won’t change all that much. That is certainly possible, although I'm fairly certain Eldar were always copping it (rightfully so to an extent). I'd love to see what they had planned pre-Adepticon. As I said in the video I'd be pretty disappointed if Nids and Poxwalkers weren't on their radar at all. The other option is that they'd done very little and were waiting for the event to start doing anything at all. Mountains out of mole hills. The consumer base always overreacts. And typically without thinking, too. It's possible that the reason for the delay has absolutely nothing to do with 40k whatsoever. Getting all worked up over it is just a waste of everyone's time and provides no benefit. Well seeing as the reason given for the delay was "Delaying the March faq just a little bit so we can integrate our findings from AdeptiCon with your feedback" I'd say it had everything to do with 40k. I agree GML, it's fairly clear it was for 40kl reasons. To Mileposter — While the 'mountains out of molehills' argument isn't wrong as such, it's very subjective. There is a very strong international competitive community that care a lot about 40k. It might be a molehill to you, but not to everyone. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042889 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mileposter Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 To Mileposter — While the 'mountains out of molehills' argument isn't wrong as such, it's very subjective. There is a very strong international competitive community that care a lot about 40k. It might be a molehill to you, but not to everyone. Data does not suggest that a delay in the FAQ affects any significant amount of sales, events, or participation in the hobby at large. This is not subjective. "Feeling" it is a big deal does not make it a big deal - even should the grand majority of hobbyist 'feel' it is a big deal, that does not make it one until a large portion of the target audience acts on that feeling in a way that has significant impact. To which, complaining on the internet does not count. Well seeing as the reason given for the delay was "Delaying the March faq just a little bit so we can integrate our findings from AdeptiCon with your feedback" I'd say it had everything to do with 40k. You are correct, and this was poor wording on my part. I had meant to indicate it might be for reasons other than the playing of 40k, such as internal sales and politics about updating rules that could affect upcoming products. Or even as stupid as it being based on feedback they had about how the FAQ is laid out and presented. Point was, no one outside of that department of GW has the answer, and claiming certainty is folly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042908 Share on other sites More sharing options...
InquisitorBlack Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 To Mileposter — While the 'mountains out of molehills' argument isn't wrong as such, it's very subjective. There is a very strong international competitive community that care a lot about 40k. It might be a molehill to you, but not to everyone. Data does not suggest that a delay in the FAQ affects any significant amount of sales, events, or participation in the hobby at large. This is not subjective. "Feeling" it is a big deal does not make it a big deal - even should the grand majority of hobbyist 'feel' it is a big deal, that does not make it one until a large portion of the target audience acts on that feeling in a way that has significant impact. To which, complaining on the internet does not count. What data? Are you part of the GW economic department? If so, I'd be very interested in seeing such data. Until then, your post is nothing more than haughty nonsense and is just as subjective as any other comment on either side of the argument. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
redmapa Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Damn, this thread got sour quickly. Anyway I honestly just feel curiousity more than anything, what exactly did GW see at Adepticon that they had to change stuff around? Are they really so stuck in their own ways of playing the game that they cant see opportunities for abuse or are they just patching things as they come? Because every time there's a winning combo GW patches it out, from Tau commanders, Malefic Lords, Primarch spam and now Hive Tyrants. Now I cant say that this is a good or bad thing because it may be good short term but in the end GW has to set its own limits to this and realize that Tournament players WILL find the most broken configuration or the game will end up with several armies nerfed and a new meta will arise and then new nerf cycle will begin again, maybe thats their goal but Im skeptical of how good of an outcome that may be. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042930 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Red, they hadn't nerfed Hive Tryrants. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042934 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorin Helm-splitter Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Damn, this thread got sour quickly. Anyway I honestly just feel curiousity more than anything, what exactly did GW see at Adepticon that they had to change stuff around? Are they really so stuck in their own ways of playing the game that they cant see opportunities for abuse or are they just patching things as they come? Because every time there's a winning combo GW patches it out, from Tau commanders, Malefic Lords, Primarch spam and now Hive Tyrants. Now I cant say that this is a good or bad thing because it may be good short term but in the end GW has to set its own limits to this and realize that Tournament players WILL find the most broken configuration or the game will end up with several armies nerfed and a new meta will arise and then new nerf cycle will begin again, maybe thats their goal but Im skeptical of how good of an outcome that may be. Hopefully its because they had a presence there and took advantage of it to get feedback. Their ideals may not have matched expectations or new issues came up from left field. Red, they hadn't nerfed Hive Tryrants. They also may have decided on a different way to nerf them as well. Personally I don't think supreme command detachments are good for the game, and maybe they get rid of them or raise points. There are lots of different ways that they can choose to fix things. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5042971 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevak Dal Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 I don't really think I care anymore. Whatever I couldn't sell I gave away, whatever I couldn't give I threw away. I feel better than I have for 8 years and got rid of a lot of excess clutter. Also sold all my old videogames too (I built an emulator so I didn't need them-kept my original Zelda though. Battery is probably dead and it's one bit of sentimentality like my toy ankylasaur I keep). I wish you guys luck and all that noise. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043038 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuvassin Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Probably saw a friendly one-off between Guard players and realized the Conscripts could use another round of nerfing. More seriously...I dunno. I haven't seen anything in the coverage that suggests a brand new issue that hasn't already been known about for a while. My only real hope is that any change to Smite doesn't hurt my friend's Grey Knights. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043169 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyriks Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 My thoughts are I'd rather wait a bit and get a better update than have them rush it out just to be on time and have clumsy fixes or miss things. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043176 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinstryfe Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 My honest opinion, after a couple decades in the hobby, is that GW really doesn't expect their game to be played cutthroat tournament style. They always put out what they think is a neat, balanced product, and almost inevitably seem blindsided that this type of play exists. They were formed by a bunch of people who liked painting miniatures and reenacting historical battles while drinking beer and eating bacon sandwiches, and I think they've stayed overly optimistic that that's what their product is for. With the boom in popularity in 8th though, I think they're starting to realize that as tournament play gets more and more popular they need to start reacting to this more, which is a mixed bag really. I keep seeing little hints that they're realizing how much of 8th is open to terrible abuse, and that the new system is a little too open to account for every possible unit interaction. If that's the case, I would rather they take their time and put out something of quality, rather than rush just to meet an arbitrary deadline. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043265 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven1 Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 My honest opinion, after a couple decades in the hobby, is that GW really doesn't expect their game to be played cutthroat tournament style. They always put out what they think is a neat, balanced product, and almost inevitably seem blindsided that this type of play exists. They were formed by a bunch of people who liked painting miniatures and reenacting historical battles while drinking beer and eating bacon sandwiches, and I think they've stayed overly optimistic that that's what their product is for. With the boom in popularity in 8th though, I think they're starting to realize that as tournament play gets more and more popular they need to start reacting to this more, which is a mixed bag really. I keep seeing little hints that they're realizing how much of 8th is open to terrible abuse, and that the new system is a little too open to account for every possible unit interaction. If that's the case, I would rather they take their time and put out something of quality, rather than rush just to meet an arbitrary deadline. Absolutely agree, i dont think are many hardcore tournament at GW and on top of that it wasn't too long ago that they were a model company that happened to make rules so for me being reactive at all to the state of the game is a big rhing, but to then look at the most hardcore of the player base and take the tournaments in consideration is huge in my opinion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043270 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melete Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Mountains out of mole hills. The consumer base always overreacts. And typically without thinking, too. It's possible that the reason for the delay has absolutely nothing to do with 40k whatsoever. Getting all worked up over it is just a waste of everyone's time and provides no benefit. I really need to know what I am supposed to get upset over! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043280 Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle captain corpus Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Honestly?..... I couldn't give a monkeys ;) I don't used the FAQ's at all and just use the Dex's and Rulebooks. BCC Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043424 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Honestly?..... I couldn't give a monkeys I don't used the FAQ's at all and just use the Dex's and Rulebooks. BCC Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043429 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaplain Killmer Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 The problem with the FAQ is it's usually not covering problems of the system but specific wording problems and or missing options. In most cases thats just fine. I am much more eager to see the 2nd Chapter Approved- because there we will see if the need to carry a library around to every game will come back - just to enable your opponent to understand your army properly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043432 Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle captain corpus Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Meh...I just follow the Dex and rulebooks and that's about it. I hate quick fixes and FAQ's etc. In my mind if I buy a product then that's how it was meant to be. If they've made mistakes then ho-hum I live with it. Weird but hey its my hobby... BCC Boy....it's just an FAQ sheeeeeesh! BCC Edit: posts merged Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5043601 Share on other sites More sharing options...
justicarius6 Posted April 12, 2018 Share Posted April 12, 2018 At this rate we'll be looking at a May FAQ, never mind April.... Anyone have anymore thoughts or rumours on why it's being delayed quite so much? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/345671-what-are-your-thoughts-on-the-faq-delay/#findComment-5053773 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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