Tactics against necrons

[Trunkello]

Hi guys,

Recently lots of new necron players started to pop up at my local meta. Their reanimation protocols are a pain in the ass but they are manageable as they usually must have 20 man units to maximize their effectiveness but it will make them vulnerable to morale checks. My biggest issue is the dreaded quantum shielding and doomsday arks. I just cant find the right tools against it with dark angels. With my other army (foul xeno scum die! *BAM*) Tau i can easily field lots of durable hard punching units like riptide and... riptide, with great invu save and drones to soak up damage. But with dark angels my best bet is to field autocannon predators or vendreds with 2x twin autocannons. They would be great but as the doomsday ark can fire d6 s10 ap-5 d6 dmg shots each with rerolling 1s with dynasty code that would almost certainly kill all of my vehicles in 1 turn. Hellblasters can potentially kill them because of their fixed low dmg (low lol.. 2-3s) that gets through quantum shielding, but they have only 30" range and doomsday arks tend to sit at the corner.

My other plan was melee with sammael and talonmaster but they are far away and the quantum shielding even works in melee. Also the overwatch could be painful too as those abominations can dish out 20 shots with -1 ap.

 

What do you think would be a great tool to counter 2-3 of these?

[Berzul]

8 veterans full plasma guns, a master with combi plasma, and a lieutenant with combi plasma, all in a drop pod. Turn two, drop within 12, overcharge everything and get 20 S8 AP-3 D2 shots with rerrolls at them. Dont use WotDA as that gets you to D3 and quantum shielding can start activating

[Berzul]

6 inceptors with dual assault bolters could also work. Kill them through wound saturation on turn two after a deepstrike.

[sneakybamsen]

Make it 7 and an ancient instead for overcharging giving more plasmatastic fiery death?

 

While the strategy is valid, they can easily counter it by deploying to deny that drop pod.

 

That said, d6 shots can only target one vehicle, and yes, 3 of those have a decent chance of severely hurting or outright destroying vehicles, but d6 S10 shots is not that good against parking lot plasma with Azrael. Thinking devastators with plasma cannons and a couple of ablative wounds or hellblasters - it's 10 shots at 30" and movement to increase threat range. That's just nasty. Also Hellfire Shells with amorium cherub and signum for 2 salvos landing d3 mortal wounds after they hit on 2's with rerolls from Azzy. CP reroll one dice if you get a 1 from the d3.

 

Or, if you prefer the deep strike variant, use jump pack on master and lieutenant, and inceptors for plasma carnage. Should be cheaper on points and less demanding in space (no drop pod plus disembark taking space).

Alternatively getting Ravenwing bikers with speed of the raven (20" move and 4++ against shooting) to charge them and tie them up. You can even bring plasma which you overcharge to put dents in them before the charge. 6-9 bikers should be decent for that.

 

Sableclaw and talonmaster to help deliver the damage and some extra wounds by shooting.

[Kasper_Hawser]

If I may suggest, for Ghost arks at least, use Twin Assault cannon razorbacks. Ghost arks are only T6 vs S6, so will be wounding on 4s. Moreover, since the assault cannons are only 1 damage, he can't use quantum shielding vs it. whatever you do, don't waste any weapon with more than 2 damage.

 

In other words, forget about using Weapons of the Dark Age when fighting Necron Quantum shielding. Overcharge plasma but don't WTDA, or he'll effectively get a 5+ invuln.

 

 

6 inceptors with dual assault bolters could also work. Kill them through wound saturation on turn two after a deepstrike.

 

This may work too except harder to wound due to S5. Need lieutenant and captain to make those shots count.

[Hantheman]

If I may suggest, for Ghost arks at least, use Twin Assault cannon razorbacks. Ghost arks are only T6 vs S6, so will be wounding on 4s. Moreover, since the assault cannons are only 1 damage, he can't use quantum shielding vs it. whatever you do, don't waste any weapon with more than 2 damage.

 

In other words, forget about using Weapons of the Dark Age when fighting Necron Quantum shielding. Overcharge plasma but don't WTDA, or he'll effectively get a 5+ invuln.

 

 

 

6 inceptors with dual assault bolters could also work. Kill them through wound saturation on turn two after a deepstrike.

This may work too except harder to wound due to S5. Need lieutenant and captain to make those shots count.

Inceptors bolters are S5, -1 so not too bad. Plus more resilient

[The Unseen]

Step 1. focus fire.

Step 2. Focus Fire

Step 3. FOCUS FIRE

Step 4. You obviously aren't focusing hard enough damn it!

 

Only partly jesting here, focus firing Necron units down is even more important than usual, as everything in their army either heals or doesn't stay dead as long as its friends are still shuffling around.

Decide what 1 specific unit you need to die this turn, and shoot at it until it is dead. Not crippled, not hanging on by a thread and your trusting morale will finish them, DEAD. Because that necron player will spend the 2 CP to autopass morale, and pop a strat and resurrection orb, and you'll watch all the work you did hurting that unit be undone. Once your primary target is dead, switch to a secondary one, and fire at it until it is dead. Repeat until you run out of shooting.

 

Against their vehicles, stuff with lots of shots and 2 damage is the sweet spot, as then Quantum shielding only kicks in on a 1. 1 damage hits will still struggle to get through their wounds, and they regen 1 per turn, more if they have a cryptek around. If you can, bait out the improved quantum shielding strat on the 2nd scariest vehicle with it. Start firing at it, and if the opponent pops it early, switch to firing at the actual scariest target with quantum shielding. If he pops it too late, you just got a bunch of shooting in where he didn't get the benefit of the strat but he spent the CP anyway, and the vehicle can usually be focused down through the strat with 1-2 damage weapons if its already low.

 

Otherwise, their pretty much marines with better guns, act accordingly.

[SnakeChisler]

Assault cannons work as does 2 damage plasma.

 

If your running Hellblaster's mostly you need some speed across the board with bikes character speeders and Inceptors, the vehicles are only 4+ save so get wasted by small arms fire.

 

I Always hide my dakka Dreads so they can't be targeted T1, the doomsday looses range and punch if it moves, if it wants to kill the auto Dreads it has to come forward so -1 to and no auto re-roll 1.

[Tommytheone]

I also had quite some trouble with destroyers.

 

Last game i played the necrons got T1, the destroyers (6 of them) moved up with a cryptec and slaughtered my plasma devs. I didn’t do a good deployment so my hellblasters where not in RF range and of the three wounds he made all the invul saves the cryptec gave them. He then proceeded to slaughter my hellblasters and eventually tablled me T5.

I do blame part of this defete on my poor deployment but what can you do again these destroyers other than drown them in overcharged plasma? They have a 5+ invul, 3 W, the FLY keyword (so they can just walk out of combat and pump out their 3 S6 AP-3 DD3 ) and they don’t suffer from -1 to hit with a heavy weapon when moving. And for 1CP they have a stratgem that allows them to reroll All failed hits and wound rolls. At about 50 points per model (hum? About the same as a terminator you say?) they can easily field a unit of 6 in any game.

And if you fail to kill all of them , well we all know what happens...

[Disciple of Caliban Sgt]

plasma

[Berzul]

Plasma, plasma, and more plasma. Focused, and overcharged, when possible. Its a tough scenario. Destroyers are beasts, and cheap for what they do, so you really need some good rolls all around as well as good placement.

[Tommytheone]

yes i fully agree that plasma is the answere and had i done a better positionning i could have given him some pain.

But they will always get a free turn of shooting (they can hid behind a cover and move 10 inches anywhere afterwards) and in small games it’s not easy to have and dark knights, ans plamsa devastators and hellblasters and the characters to give the rerolls.

[Berzul]

Maybe a more spead put force? Lots of cheap bikes that will die slowly against high D weapons, can cross the distance, and saturate the ark with high numbers of low D fire? With a Talon Master around, the low S gets kinda sorted out with rerrolls on the wound rolls

[Trunkello]

Thx brothers. I will try to focus them down with the hell blasters. I will have to choose priority targets carefully as i need to gun down necron warriors fast too, untill i still have the firepower.

[Kasper_Hawser]

Target priority:

 

1) Wraiths

2) Ghost Arks

3) Characters

 

It goes without saying, focus fire focus fire focus fire, otherwise they'll keep getting bak up as long as one is alive.

[Master Ciaphas]

Hail! 

I just had my first game vs. Necrons last night. They are a terror to play against. A mate and I have started a mini-escalation campaign (three games total) with the following restrictions:

 

- The entire army must be chosen from the same codex.
- The entire army must be part of one (and only one) battalion detachment.
- A minimum of 400 pts must be spent on Troops.
- No doublets besides Troops or Dedicated Transports.
- No unit may cost more than 200 pts.
- No named characters may be chosen
- No relics may be chosen
- A Warlord trait is fixed for the duration of the campaign
- Stratagems which permit a unit to fight or shoot twice are prohibited.

 

The first game yesterday was 1300 points, and the remaining two battle are 1400 and 1500 points respectively.

 

I fielded the following army:

 

HQ  
Master Ciaphas 
- Plasma pistol, Relic Blade & Iron Halo
- Warlord trait: Brilliant Strategist
  
Lieutenant Zoreal Namaat 
- Jump pack, pair of lightning claws

Elites  
3rd Company Veterans 
- Veteran Sergeant Parvel w. combi-plasma
- 2 Veterans w. a heavy bolter and a boltgun

 

Troops  
2nd Tactical Squad 
- Sergeant Raziel w. power sword & bolt pistol
- 9 Marines w. a plasma gun and 9 boltguns
  
5th Tactical Squad 
- Sergeant Anon w. chainsword & boltgun
- 9 Marines w. a plasma gun, a lascannon and 7 boltguns
  
6th Tactical Combat Squad 
- Sergeant Raphael w. chainsword & plasma pistol
- 4 Marines w. a plasma cannon and 3 boltguns

Fast Attack  
Ravenwing Black Knights 
- Huntmaster Kormaan w. Corvus Hammer & plasma talon
- 3 Black Knights w. Corvus Hammers & plasma talons
  
2nd Ravenwing Bike Squad
- Sergeant Arion w. chainsword
- 3 Ravenwing Bikers w. 2 flamers and chainswords 
 
Heavy Support   
9th Devastator Squad 
- Sergeant Hezekiah w. signum, boltgun & chainsword
- 5 Marines w. 4 missile launchers & boltgun
  
Predator “Fury of Caliban” 
- Predator autocannon & heavy bolters

 

The Necron player fielded something along these lines:

 

Overlord

Cryptek w. a 5++ save to units with X".

 

10 Warriors

15 Warriors

10 Immortals with Tesla guns

3 Canoptek Wraiths

4 Destroyers w. gauss cannons

8 Scarab Swarms

Triarch Stalker with heat-rays?

 

Mephrit Dynasty rules. 

 

I lost the game 7-0. He held both objectives (2x3 VP)and had linebreaker for an additional 1 VP. 

 

So - for the next battle, I will have an additional 100 points to play with. Any advice to a fellow Battle-Brother?

 

Kindly,

Master Ciaphas

[Knight Angels]

try to lock them in combat. shoot the destroyers first with the predator and the devastator (and plasma). focus fire to deny reanimation. def. add some rhinos or better razorbacks with twin assault cannons for your troops. the warriors will eat your tacticals without protection.

 

use your superior mobility. the immortals should also be a high priority target

[Kasper_Hawser]

Target priority:

 

1) Wraiths

2) Ghost Arks

3) Characters

 

It goes without saying, focus fire focus fire focus fire, otherwise they'll keep getting bak up as long as one is alive.

 

@ Master Ciaphas - Had a few games with Necrons myself recently, I need to revise my target priority now

 

1) Destroyers. These will be their best and likely ONLY Strength 8 or 9 weaponry, and they WILL HURT as they have several rules and even strategems to boost their shooting and rerolling to wounds. Also reasonably fast and tough, so you need them gone ASAP, and I mean TOTALLY DESTROYED before they can reanimate.

 

2) Wraiths, same as usual. I've downgraded their threat level but only a little below Destroyers.

 

3) Ghost Arks - Once you deal with the above, then it's time to deal with the good old necron warrior/immortal bob. And to make sure its difficult for them to get up, kill the Ghost arks, best with Twin Assault cannon, or non charged plasma.

 

4) Characters.- it goes without saying, My Will be Done and improved reanimation protocols are nasty, almost as good as our captains reroll 1s. If you are not careful, the immortal teslas will be procing on 5s in addition to 6s. 

 

One way to deal with characters is to try assassinate them with flyers or fast moving units, which I believe you have the Ravenwing. But my way is to use my flyer to suddenly zoom over behind his lines. I try to subtly put my flyer about 40 inches away from his character in every turn, far enough to make him not think about it, yet near enough to utilise 50 inch movement to go behind his character and unload EVERYTHING in it. not sure how expensive the Nephilim or Dark Talon is, but my Stormwolves cost 270-320 points. Yet it is a very worthy investment to kill the Cryptek or Lord even if it means making your flyer vulnerable. At best, even if destroyed, it can crash and cause D6 mortal wounds.

 

Hope this helps.

[Master Ciaphas]

Thank you both for your comments. 

Destroyers and Wraiths are indeed very high on the target priority list. Them...and then the Tesla Carbine Immortals. They practically deleted a combat squad per turn of shooting. Truly they are scary! There was one round of shooting, where 18 shots inflicted 22 wounds. Yes, them 2 extra hits pr. 5 & 6 rolled do add up!

 

I like the idea of using an assassin flyer! 

Neither the Dark Talon nor the Nephilim have yet made it to my vast collection of (unpainted) models, yet. As I am pretty much nearing the stage where I cannot physically fit more plastic toy men into my apartment, which of the two Dark Angel fliers would be the better (ie. most competitative) model? Aesthetics-wise, I fancy both of them..., so I am not partial to one or the other model (otherwise I would just go for that...)

Faithfully,
Master Ciaphas

[Knight Angels]

magnets are your friend here ;)

i choose the body of the nephilim.

[Kasper_Hawser]

Thank you both for your comments. 

 

Destroyers and Wraiths are indeed very high on the target priority list. Them...and then the Tesla Carbine Immortals. They practically deleted a combat squad per turn of shooting. Truly they are scary! There was one round of shooting, where 18 shots inflicted 22 wounds. Yes, them 2 extra hits pr. 5 & 6 rolled do add up!

 

I like the idea of using an assassin flyer! 

 

Neither the Dark Talon nor the Nephilim have yet made it to my vast collection of (unpainted) models, yet. As I am pretty much nearing the stage where I cannot physically fit more plastic toy men into my apartment, which of the two Dark Angel fliers would be the better (ie. most competitative) model? Aesthetics-wise, I fancy both of them..., so I am not partial to one or the other model (otherwise I would just go for that...)

 

Faithfully,

Master Ciaphas

 

Dark Talon seems to be popular due to the S10 of the rift cannon and possibility of additional mortal wounds after wounding. Suggest you go with that, although Nephilim I'm told is also not bad, just overshadowed a bit by Dark Talon, and now I hear the Stormraven is made available to DA as well.

[MaxB]

Thank you both for your comments. 

 

Destroyers and Wraiths are indeed very high on the target priority list. Them...and then the Tesla Carbine Immortals. They practically deleted a combat squad per turn of shooting. Truly they are scary! There was one round of shooting, where 18 shots inflicted 22 wounds. Yes, them 2 extra hits pr. 5 & 6 rolled do add up!

 

I like the idea of using an assassin flyer! 

 

Neither the Dark Talon nor the Nephilim have yet made it to my vast collection of (unpainted) models, yet. As I am pretty much nearing the stage where I cannot physically fit more plastic toy men into my apartment, which of the two Dark Angel fliers would be the better (ie. most competitative) model? Aesthetics-wise, I fancy both of them..., so I am not partial to one or the other model (otherwise I would just go for that...)

 

Faithfully,

Master Ciaphas

 

Yes, may as well magnetise since you get both in the kit. Though I can't see myself taking the Nephilim over the Dark Talon any time soon. 24 bolters hitting on 2's at generally whatever target you like is no joke, round it off with the Rift Cannon and Stasis Bomb and you have a very well rounded flyer. Use Speed of the Raven to get a 4++

[sneakybamsen]

I use my Dark Talon more or less every game I play with my DA at the moment. Partially because it's painted (and I'm pleased with the result) but also because the rules are just that damn good. Last outing saw it take out 7 firewarriors with the bomb (good rolling on my part and the only 10-man unit in my opponents list), then shoot at two other targets that turn, deleting a squad of firewarriors and hurting devilfish with the rift cannon. It continued like that (scoring 66 hits from 72 bolter shots fired) untill I was in a position where I would be tabled later, and even though I had 30 VP after three turns (custom mission), I wouldn't be able to stay on the board. Apart from my Dark Talon and Stormraven, my list was pretty soft. The Dark Talon is a massive threat and a prime candidate for Speed of the Raven, especially in those situations where your opponent is sitting back, thinking himself safe. Advance the talon with SotR, dropping the bomb on a 10-man (or bigger) unit, unload bolters into what is a decent target and riftcannon as well. It's not too unlikely to have made up most of it's points after a turn in sheer threat potential and killing power. And your opponent will have to react to it. If they don't they usually just die. And when they do react it's -1 to hit (-2 if you can manage to get a darkshroud nearby that also advances) with 4++ against shooting. Bloody amazing, even if it's 40 more points than it was when the codex hit (FAQ'ed later).

 

But the advice on magnetizing it is solid. I haven't done it myself, but I do have a Nephilim that needs assembly and paint, so I'm not too fuzzed about that.