Dreadnought, what should I build?

[munocat]

I have a blizzard/axe dread.

I have a Björn Dread with hell frost canon.

I have a Daka redemptor.

 

I have an unopened space wolves dread kit

 

Should I go for murderfang or should I build another kind of dread, if so what?

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

Honestly muderfang is a pretty fun counter assault unit this edition. At least the 2 games I ran him in.

[TiguriusX]

2 shield dreads are better than 1

[Bulwyf]

Murderfang + Bjorn = your opponent crying. No jokes. Murderfang is hella fun to run this edition.

[munocat]

How do you run murderfang?

[Bulwyf]

How do you run murderfang?

 

I think I have a list on the SW 2k list that has him in it. If not I'll post it here:

 

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) [120 PL, 1998pts] ++

 

+ HQ +

 

Bjorn the Fell-handed [14 PL, 239pts]: Assault cannon, Heavy flamer, Saga of the Warrior Born, Warlord

 

Njal Stormcaller in Runic Terminator Armour [9 PL, 153pts]: 2. Tempest's Wrath

 

Ragnar Blackmane [7 PL, 141pts]

 

+ Troops +

 

Grey Hunters [6 PL, 95pts]

. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Power sword

. 4x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Plasma gun

 

Grey Hunters [6 PL, 95pts]

. Grey Hunter Pack Leader: Power sword

. 4x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Plasma gun

 

Grey Hunters [6 PL, 91pts]

. Grey Hunter Pack Leader

. 4x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Plasma gun

 

+ Elites +

 

Murderfang [10 PL, 170pts]

 

Wulfen [26 PL, 280pts]

. 2x Great frost axe

. 3x Thunder hammer & Stormshield: 3x Storm Shield, 3x Thunder Hammer

. 5x Wulfen

. Wulfen Pack Leader: Frost claws

 

+ Heavy Support +

 

Land Raider Crusader [17 PL, 310pts]: 2x Hurricane bolter, Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

 

Predator [9 PL, 192pts]: Storm bolter, Twin lascannon

. Two Lascannons: 2x Lascannon

 

+ Dedicated Transport +

 

Razorback [5 PL, 116pts]: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

 

Razorback [5 PL, 116pts]: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

 

++ Total: [120 PL, 1998pts] ++

 

Created with BattleScribe

[Bulwyf]

RB have one GH squad each. The LRC has Wulfen, Ragnar and Njarl. I put Bjorn behind the LRC for cover. I put Murderfang behind the Predator for the same thing. The one squad of GH not in a transport are put behind Bjorn to keep him from being hit from behind by deep strike or some other mechanism.

 

This is my default list. Sometimes I swap out the Pred and some points to get TWC in there. But when you hit the enemy with Wulfen, Bjorn, Ragnar, Njarl and Murderfang all together ....the tears will flow. I promise you will see your opponents eyes bulge out when they realize what Murderfang does in CC. That's an almost guaranteed 15 wounds just from Murderfang.

[Kasper_Hawser]

Problem is getting him in CC. I hope you've been having success with your LRC and Razorbacks tanking all the shots until Bjorn + murderfang reaches them. And even then, its just 11 attacks between two of them., 12 if you put Legendary fighter on Bjorn.

[TiguriusX]

I personally put all my hopes and dreams behind storm shields

 

We are the only codex I am aware of with dreads having a 3++

 

shield dread also has 5 attacks and although no rerolling for wounds it can do d6

 

i have taken on a knight with my shield dread (something i would not advise for murderfang or even bjorn)

[Kasper_Hawser]

I personally put all my hopes and dreams behind storm shields

 

We are the only codex I am aware of with dreads having a 3++

 

shield dread also has 5 attacks and although no rerolling for wounds it can do d6

 

i have taken on a knight with my shield dread (something i would not advise for murderfang or even bjorn)

 

OK OK, next game weekend I'll take a Shield dread. 

=][=No discussion of politics=][=

[TiguriusX]

remember this truth for every list

the whole is greater than the parts

shield dread has amazing synergy with Bjorn

Bjorn basically cant be shot while shield dread is standing nearby (I have parked Bjorn in the open for stationary Lascannon shots at flyers and that knight I mentioned earlier knowing it was impossible for Bjorn to be shot back)

shield dread goes bonkers with Bjorn rolls (shield dread has ws2)

shield dreads also draw fire...every gun will point his way (hence 2 better than 1)

the rest of your army if built for that can take advantage

 

Here is my current 2k draft list you can compare with Bulwyf

 

*I replaced my 2nd shield dread with a leviathan (T8 and 4++) because it has ranged firepower as well (basically replaced a LF unit and shield dread to get it)

 

I play in ITC environment

 

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) ++

+ HQ +

Bjorn the Fell-handed: 1. Legendary Fighter, Heavy flamer, Twin lascannon, Warlord

Njal Stormcaller in Runic Terminator Armour: 1. Storm Caller, 2. Tempest's Wrath, 3. Jaws of the World Wolf

+ Troops +

Grey Hunters
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader
. 2x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol
. Grey Hunter w/Plasma Pistol: Plasma pistol
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Plasma gun
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Combi-plasma, Storm shield

Grey Hunters: 4x Chainsword
. Grey Hunter Pack Leader
. 2x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol
. Grey Hunter w/Plasma Pistol: Plasma pistol
. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Meltagun
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Combi-melta, Storm shield

Grey Hunters: Grey Hunter Pack Leader, 4x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

+ Elites +

Venerable Dreadnought
. Fenrisian Great Axe and Blizzard Shield: Blizzard shield, Fenrisian great axe

Wolf Guard on Bikes
. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield
. . Bike: Twin boltgun
. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield
. . Bike: Twin boltgun
. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield
. . Bike: Twin boltgun
. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield
. . Bike: Twin boltgun
. Wolf Guard on Bike Pack Leader: Bolt Pistol, Power sword, Storm bolter
. . Bike: Twin boltgun

+ Heavy Support +

Long Fangs
. Long Fang: Lascannon
. Long Fang: Lascannon
. Long Fang: Lascannon
. Long Fang: Lascannon
. Long Fang Pack Leader: Boltgun and Bolt Pistol, Chainsword
. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Storm shield

Relic Leviathan Dreadnought: 2x Heavy flamer, 3x Hunter-killer missile, Storm cannon array, Storm cannon array

++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) ++

+ HQ +

Librarian: 2) Might of Heroes, 6) Null Zone, Boltgun, Force sword, The Armour Indomitus

+ Fast Attack +

Cyberwolves: Cyberwolf

Cyberwolves: Cyberwolf

Cyberwolves: Cyberwolf

++ Vanguard Detachment (Imperium - Officio Assassinorum) ++

+ Elites +

Culexus Assassin

Culexus Assassin

Eversor Assassin

++ Total: [115 PL, 2000pts] ++

[Bulwyf]

Problem is getting him in CC. I hope you've been having success with your LRC and Razorbacks tanking all the shots until Bjorn + murderfang reaches them. And even then, its just 11 attacks between two of them., 12 if you put Legendary fighter on Bjorn.

 

Opponents focus on the LRC, Predator and RB in that order. Since the two dreads in Bjorn and Muderfang aren't really shooting at their precious vehicles or ranged units they pretty much ignore them.

 

As for the attacks, it isn't just Bjorn and Murderfang. Bjorn alone is always going to be supporting Ragnar, Njarl and a Wulfen squad. That's a crap ton of damage right there. You add Murderfang to that for even more CC bonanza.

[Bulwyf]

remember this truth for every list

 

the whole is greater than the parts

 

shield dread has amazing synergy with Bjorn

 

Bjorn basically cant be shot while shield dread is standing nearby (I have parked Bjorn in the open for stationary Lascannon shots at flyers and that knight I mentioned earlier knowing it was impossible for Bjorn to be shot back)

 

shield dread goes bonkers with Bjorn rolls (shield dread has ws2)

 

shield dreads also draw fire...every gun will point his way (hence 2 better than 1)

 

the rest of your army if built for that can take advantage

 

Here is my current 2k draft list you can compare with Bulwyf

 

*I replaced my 2nd shield dread with a leviathan (T8 and 4++) because it has ranged firepower as well (basically replaced a LF unit and shield dread to get it)

 

I play in ITC environment

 

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Wolves) ++

 

+ HQ +

 

Bjorn the Fell-handed: 1. Legendary Fighter, Heavy flamer, Twin lascannon, Warlord

 

Njal Stormcaller in Runic Terminator Armour: 1. Storm Caller, 2. Tempest's Wrath, 3. Jaws of the World Wolf

 

+ Troops +

 

Grey Hunters

. Grey Hunter Pack Leader

. 2x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

. Grey Hunter w/Plasma Pistol: Plasma pistol

. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Plasma gun

. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Combi-plasma, Storm shield

 

Grey Hunters: 4x Chainsword

. Grey Hunter Pack Leader

. 2x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

. Grey Hunter w/Plasma Pistol: Plasma pistol

. Grey Hunter with Special Weapon: Bolt Pistol, Meltagun

. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Combi-melta, Storm shield

 

Grey Hunters: Grey Hunter Pack Leader, 4x Grey Hunter w/Bolt Pistol

 

+ Elites +

 

Venerable Dreadnought

. Fenrisian Great Axe and Blizzard Shield: Blizzard shield, Fenrisian great axe

 

Wolf Guard on Bikes

. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield

. . Bike: Twin boltgun

. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield

. . Bike: Twin boltgun

. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield

. . Bike: Twin boltgun

. Wolf Guard on Bike: Storm bolter, Storm shield

. . Bike: Twin boltgun

. Wolf Guard on Bike Pack Leader: Bolt Pistol, Power sword, Storm bolter

. . Bike: Twin boltgun

 

+ Heavy Support +

 

Long Fangs

. Long Fang: Lascannon

. Long Fang: Lascannon

. Long Fang: Lascannon

. Long Fang: Lascannon

. Long Fang Pack Leader: Boltgun and Bolt Pistol, Chainsword

. Wolf Guard Pack Leader: Bolt pistol, Storm shield

 

Relic Leviathan Dreadnought: 2x Heavy flamer, 3x Hunter-killer missile, Storm cannon array, Storm cannon array

 

++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) ++

 

+ HQ +

 

Librarian: 2) Might of Heroes, 6) Null Zone, Boltgun, Force sword, The Armour Indomitus

 

+ Fast Attack +

 

Cyberwolves: Cyberwolf

 

Cyberwolves: Cyberwolf

 

Cyberwolves: Cyberwolf

 

++ Vanguard Detachment (Imperium - Officio Assassinorum) ++

 

+ Elites +

 

Culexus Assassin

 

Culexus Assassin

 

Eversor Assassin

 

++ Total: [115 PL, 2000pts] ++

 

This is a solid list. I would never play it because I am an ardent mono army player. I only play pure mono lists. There's nothing wrong at all with playing with combined armies but it just isn't my cup of tea.

[Kasper_Hawser]

 

Problem is getting him in CC. I hope you've been having success with your LRC and Razorbacks tanking all the shots until Bjorn + murderfang reaches them. And even then, its just 11 attacks between two of them., 12 if you put Legendary fighter on Bjorn.

 

Opponents focus on the LRC, Predator and RB in that order. Since the two dreads in Bjorn and Muderfang aren't really shooting at their precious vehicles or ranged units they pretty much ignore them.

 

As for the attacks, it isn't just Bjorn and Murderfang. Bjorn alone is always going to be supporting Ragnar, Njarl and a Wulfen squad. That's a crap ton of damage right there. You add Murderfang to that for even more CC bonanza.

 

 

Sorry, was thinking of my own lists, which do not have Wulfen in them. I don't focus on getting the assault these days, only counter assault. So no CC bonanza in my list.

 

Sigh, do I dare try go for an assault list again? I had quite some bad luck for a spell trying to use Blood claws, Wulfen and even the Axe Shield Dread before I switched back to more MSU and Razorbacks twin assault cannons, Stormwolf support and finally my Long Fangs.

 

Going back to assault means either the Stormwolf or the Long Fangs will have to go to make some variant of your list Bulwyf. 

 

damn my Ultramarine Mentor, now my mindset is stuck with a semi mobile gunline. to be fair, that seems to be my equilibrium now and I have good fun even if I lose, which surprisingly hasn't happened much, even beating his Guilliman centred list.

 

Still, if its OK with you Bulwyf, I'll draw inspiration from your list to design my own. Might make the predator a Dakka pred since it is actually more dangerous to MEQ and is decent enough in anti-tank to attract just enough Aggro for less cost than an annhilator pattern.

[Bulwyf]

 

 

Problem is getting him in CC. I hope you've been having success with your LRC and Razorbacks tanking all the shots until Bjorn + murderfang reaches them. And even then, its just 11 attacks between two of them., 12 if you put Legendary fighter on Bjorn.

 

Opponents focus on the LRC, Predator and RB in that order. Since the two dreads in Bjorn and Muderfang aren't really shooting at their precious vehicles or ranged units they pretty much ignore them.

 

As for the attacks, it isn't just Bjorn and Murderfang. Bjorn alone is always going to be supporting Ragnar, Njarl and a Wulfen squad. That's a crap ton of damage right there. You add Murderfang to that for even more CC bonanza.

 

 

Sorry, was thinking of my own lists, which do not have Wulfen in them. I don't focus on getting the assault these days, only counter assault. So no CC bonanza in my list.

 

Sigh, do I dare try go for an assault list again? I had quite some bad luck for a spell trying to use Blood claws, Wulfen and even the Axe Shield Dread before I switched back to more MSU and Razorbacks twin assault cannons, Stormwolf support and finally my Long Fangs.

 

Going back to assault means either the Stormwolf or the Long Fangs will have to go to make some variant of your list Bulwyf. 

 

damn my Ultramarine Mentor, now my mindset is stuck with a semi mobile gunline. to be fair, that seems to be my equilibrium now and I have good fun even if I lose, which surprisingly hasn't happened much, even beating his Guilliman centred list.

 

Still, if its OK with you Bulwyf, I'll draw inspiration from your list to design my own. Might make the predator a Dakka pred since it is actually more dangerous to MEQ and is decent enough in anti-tank to attract just enough Aggro for less cost than an annhilator pattern.

 

 

The only point in sharing lists is in the exact wording: SHARING lists. Please use mine to use or adjust as you see fit. We all brothers of the Fang!

[Bulwyf]

And I have to point out....assault is not dead. The deep strike on turn 1 is gone but you can still get your assault units up close on someone with transports. The Wulfen in particular with their charge and advance make them almost impossible to stop from getting on top of something in CC. I know some SW players don't like Wulfen or TWC for fluff/personal dislike but they are absolutely devastating on the table.

[Kasper_Hawser]

And I have to point out....assault is not dead. The deep strike on turn 1 is gone but you can still get your assault units up close on someone with transports. The Wulfen in particular with their charge and advance make them almost impossible to stop from getting on top of something in CC. I know some SW players don't like Wulfen or TWC for fluff/personal dislike but they are absolutely devastating on the table.

 

thanks mate for sharing list.

 

I know assault isn't dead, but reliable charges are still difficult while 1st turn charges now impossible. I get more delicious kicks from assault by forcing my opponent to assault me first before I mulch them with Bjorn and other characters on the counter assault. 

 

Patient hunter is my MO these days, rather than Bloodied Hunter.

 

Again, won't copy and paste from your lists, but I will attempt your general strategy. At least against marines, not IG or Reaper Spam Eldar. Actually may have to be careful around nids too to make sure their flying Hive Tyrants don't assassinate Bjorn or Murderfang.

 

Time to bring out my Team Jacob again. (wulfen)

[wilkco]

I would go for muderfang as it gives you another different unit to put in your army bjorn shield dread and muderfang plus a wulfen unit is pretty unstoppable little gang

[crd26a]

I'll hijack the thread for some advice - Mainly painting here, but I'm going to pickup a kit to get Bjorn done plus a Forgeworld Venerable Dreadnought for a tribute to Brand.  Originally I was thinking of kitting the Venerable out with Axe & Shield from the leftover parts of the Bjorn kit, however, I was also contemplating an Axe with range weapon build (Auto-cannon / Lascannon / Multi-Melta).  Anyone have thoughts if I should go full Axe Shield, a hybrid mix or full forgeworld build?

[PeteySödes]

I'll hijack the thread for some advice - Mainly painting here, but I'm going to pickup a kit to get Bjorn done plus a Forgeworld Venerable Dreadnought for a tribute to Brand.  Originally I was thinking of kitting the Venerable out with Axe & Shield from the leftover parts of the Bjorn kit, however, I was also contemplating an Axe with range weapon build (Auto-cannon / Lascannon / Multi-Melta).  Anyone have thoughts if I should go full Axe Shield, a hybrid mix or full forgeworld build?

 

The best part of the dread is the shield IMO, I wouldnt leave home w/o it.

[wilkco]

I'll hijack the thread for some advice - Mainly painting here, but I'm going to pickup a kit to get Bjorn done plus a Forgeworld Venerable Dreadnought for a tribute to Brand. Originally I was thinking of kitting the Venerable out with Axe & Shield from the leftover parts of the Bjorn kit, however, I was also contemplating an Axe with range weapon build (Auto-cannon / Lascannon / Multi-Melta). Anyone have thoughts if I should go full Axe Shield, a hybrid mix or full forgeworld build?

try not to mix melee and shoot you on your dreads it is better to have one or the other. Out of the Forgeworld dreads athe best currently is the leviathan it is the hardest dread to kill even bjorn will struggle to kill it in one turn and hits on 2 and if fitted for full cc is a beast nearly better than bjorn due to its 4+ invulnerable save and a normal +2 save

[TiguriusX]

I went outside our codex to grab a vanilla librarian just to have access to null zone as an emergency plan for stuff like that.

 

 

Also...pretty sure you cant take the axe without the shield.

[GrFlur]

I went outside our codex to grab a vanilla librarian just to have access to null zone as an emergency plan for stuff like that.

 

 

Also...pretty sure you cant take the axe without the shield.

 

Correct, Axe and Shield go altogether. Imperium:Index 1( pag 131)

[Konnavaer]

I will throw my two imperial credits in here, I have used the axe/shield dread a few times now and he always does work for me, he is a great distraction and can soak up a ton of shooting plus when he gets into combat he is a wrecking ball. I usually run him up a flank and point him at something my opponent wants to keep safe, he isn't the fastest so can be vulnerable to being kited about but man whatever he gets in close to knows about it afterwards. Plus to me he is one of the embodiments of the 'rule of cool' and one of the many reasons I love the wolves as much as I do  

[mactire]

Whatever you decide pledge for the wolves in the ETL