Musing on the Libby Dread in a Post BETA World...

[Charlo]

There has to be more than one way to skin a cat aye?

 

So with the BETA rules a lot of our Alpha-strike is gone or at least a little less top heavy.

 

Now we need to build around turn 2 as the WHAMMY turn, which isn't amazing as we now have to suffer at least one turn of enemy shooting...

 

The good news is we more than have the speed to make up for this.

 

My idea essentially revolves around our very unique and special character Walker, the Librarian Dreadnought. Even without wings, this thing is speedy! 8"+D6" advance is more than enough to keep up with jump troops most of the time, add on wings and to quote indomitable Actor Carl Weathers; "You got yourself a Stew goin'!"

 

So what makes this work? Essentially, you use some Assault Squads/ Vanguard Vets/ Company Vets w/ Packs, hell even bikes to screen the Dread and hey - as a character with less than 10 wounds - it can't be shot without first killing everything else near it. Neat.

 

Remember as well, if the enemy is on the assaulty offensive, Heroic intervention is a wonderful thing.

 

This can also work with the incredible Chaplain Dread, however he doesn't have wings so is a little slower.

 

Nothing groundbreaking I know, but food for thought at least brothers.

[Brother Crimson]

The librarian dreadnought always was good. The problem is that he is up against Mephiston, and Mephiston is not just good, he is great.

 

He is an infantry, meaning he can get inside buildings to slaughter hidden troops and use honornthe chapter. His extra deny is a huge boost against psycher and he knows an extra power. Add in a 2+ save and a built in feel no pain. His downside is to have D3 weapon instead of flat 3 and lower toughness.

 

As for ways to screen and gain mid control for turn 2, I feel ill bring back the rhino. They can move upfront 12+advance and pop smoke, the characters follows and are protected by 11w t7 bricks (this can be the dreadnought characters)

[Charlo]

100% on Mephy, but there is one of him and unlimited Libby Dreads!

 

Not to mention he can ride in a Pod if need be (until FW restock the Dreadnought Pod I count it as not really existing...)

 

Rhinos are nice, just very expensive - like all transports, however in the current meta, that metal box sure is nice to have.

[Panzer]

I'm a fan of the Librarian Dread, however besides having to compete with Mephiston (and Captain Smash tbf) he has two big weaknesses. No invul save and only 3 attacks bin his profile.

That means that he basically always eats 1CP for +1d3 attacks when in combat which other units could need as well and that I feel very uncomfortable not giving him the invul power if I want to bring him to where the big points are.

So you can work around those weaknesses but at the cost of having less to support the rrst of your army. You can also do it only for one Librarian Dread in your army in Marched play.

[Kappel]

The Libby only has 6” in movement. A Librarian with jump pack is a more reliable turn one charge. But so very vulnerable...

[BluejayJunior]

Using Quickening (along with Wings) can give the Librarian Dread the +1d3 attacks without worrying about using command points for Red Thirst. 

I've been using mine pretty regularly and he usually gets work done. I don't have Mephiston, so that hasn't been a choice for me. 

[Panzer]

Yeah but it requires you to push through two psychic powers if you want to cast wings or shield as well, not to mention that it costs you the slot for wings or shield and prevents you from casting smite if you go all out on buffs.

[Bremon]

He’s too unreliable. Getting him moving and making him dangerous relies on two powers, one of which goes off 83% of the time, and one that goes off 58%. If he swings big and you roll well enough for 9 attacks, he’s fantastic. If you end up with 4-5 attacks he’s not nearly as fantastic. He looks intimidating at least, so that’s a plus.

[Diagramdude]

One recommendation I highly recommend is to remember to pop the "Wisdom of the Ancients" stratagem before the libby dread fights in the fight phase if he doesn't have a Captain's reroll aura nearby. It gives the dread a 6" reroll 1's aura for the duration of the phase.

 

Hitting on 2's is so much better when you reroll 1's compared to just hitting on 2's. 1 CP spent will save you tons of regret when you roll a couple ones to hit. As noted above, every attack counts with this guy because he has so few.

[Panzer]

He’s too unreliable. Getting him moving and making him dangerous relies on two powers, one of which goes off 83% of the time, and one that goes off 58%. If he swings big and you roll well enough for 9 attacks, he’s fantastic. If you end up with 4-5 attacks he’s not nearly as fantastic. He looks intimidating at least, so that’s a plus.

 

To be fair even with just 4 attacks he's as fantastic as any regular Captain with a Thunderhammer (against Sv3+ 2.7 unsaved wounds from the Captain vs 2.8 unsaved wounds from the Librarian Dread).

The difference between a monster like Captain Smash and the Librarian Dread is that you can pure a lot more CP into the Captain to buff him than you can do with the Librarian Dread. However 4 attacks without re-rolls still results in ~9 damage against anything with less than T10 and no invul save. Aka tanks and monsters.

The Librarian Dread can't solo Knights and stuff like Captain Smash but that's not his job. Use him in combination with other units or to solo smaller stuff. Regular tanks/monsters and infantry with 3 wounds like Tyranid Warriors and Crisis Suits (without Drones nearby) are the right targets for him, not Mortarion&Co.

 

But yeah he has less buff potential and is more unreliable. If you want a simple beatstick, take Captain Smash instead. Then Mephiston. And if you then still have points and the need for another beat stick then the Librarian Dead is the right choice. Of course if you don't play with special characters and have your CP planned for other units to use then the Librarian Dread becomes a much more interesting choice. ^^

[Djangomatic82]

I have been thinking of using him with a Storm Raven, Assault Terminators and their Ancient. Seems like one of the better support options with Unleash Rage as well as Wisdom of the Ancients if something happens to the Ancient or he is close enough to another unit that can benefit from it. Pretty much, I look at him as more the Swiss Army knife HQ that can dish out some serious damage as well.

[Indefragable]

If you go armor saturation, bring a Libby Dread.

 

If you go infantry saturation, bring Mephiston.

 

If you want insane Formula 1 speed, bring a Jump Librarian (12" move + 12" Wings of Sang + 12" charge).

[Panzer]

I don't think the Librarian Dread counts for armor saturation considering it's a Character with less than 10 wounds so it's not like the enemy has to split his anti-tank shooting between him and other targets until most of your army is gone anyway. :P

[Indefragable]

I don't think the Librarian Dread counts for armor saturation considering it's a Character with less than 10 wounds so it's not like the enemy has to split his anti-tank shooting between him and other targets until most of your army is gone anyway.

 

...but the Libby Dread is FAR more resilient to bolters et al when it gets to that point.

 

And if you killed all his predators/meltas/missile dudes already...

[Panzer]

Yeah but when it's gotten to that point the opponent should have worked through half of your army already anyway so it's already far past the point where target saturation would be a problem since either you got rid of the anti-tank by that point or the opponent got rid of your other tanks so he's only the Librarian Dread left.

Yes, he's more durable than other Librarians but that's the case whether you go with armor saturation or not. ^^

[Aothaine]

My problem with the chaplain dreadnought is that he is just too expensive. I'd rather take a cheaper chaplain push in a sang priest and load the boys up in rhinos if I'm rushing like that. The only time I would use him is in a fluffy, non-competitive, list. 

 

However, if I wanted to make him as competitive as possible I would field an army with 6 max sized scout squads with 3 squads with combat knifes and 3 with bolters. Then fill the rest of the list with Dreadnoughts and use Libby and Chaplain Dreads. Might be able to squeeze in 5-8 Dreadnoughts in total with the HQ. Still it would just be a fun list. The Libby dread is great. But the Chaplain is kind of lackluster to me.

[Arkhanist]

I like the chaplain dread as we don't have much in the way of BS 2+ lascannon platforms that are hard targets given we don't get venerable dreads. I'm thinking of him moving up the field in support of intercessors/aggressors - give them some anti-tank still at 3+ to hit; they protect him from shooting, clear out a drop zone, then he can potentially get stuck into melee to help out once the jump pack boys start dropping. Also increasing durable points on the field (thanks, beta rule). He's too slow and pricey compared to the alternatives for a pure choppy role, I agree. 

 

It's not too badly priced in the infantry support role compared to other forgeworld dreads - sure, if you want more shooty power you go for a leviathan or deredeo and crank up the points, but they can't hide behind infantry and fill a HQ slot like the chaplain dread while if I want static firepower I'm probably just going for devastators.

 

The librarian dread can't really fill the infantry support role due to lack of firepower; for combat prowess he's outmatched by mephiston, and a jump pack libby is faster and more flexible (if fragile). 

 

A full dread army would be hilarious though.

[Aothaine]

I like the chaplain dread as we don't have much in the way of BS 2+ lascannon platforms that are hard targets given we don't get venerable dreads. I'm thinking of him moving up the field in support of intercessors/aggressors - give them some anti-tank still at 3+ to hit; they protect him from shooting, clear out a drop zone, then he can potentially get stuck into melee to help out once the jump pack boys start dropping. Also increasing durable points on the field (thanks, beta rule). He's too slow and pricey compared to the alternatives for a pure choppy role, I agree. 

 

It's not too badly priced in the infantry support role compared to other forgeworld dreads - sure, if you want more shooty power you go for a leviathan or deredeo and crank up the points, but they can't hide behind infantry and fill a HQ slot like the chaplain dread while if I want static firepower I'm probably just going for devastators.

 

The librarian dread can't really fill the infantry support role due to lack of firepower; for combat prowess he's outmatched by mephiston, and a jump pack libby is faster and more flexible (if fragile). 

 

A full dread army would be hilarious though.

 

Ohhhh! I totally forgot about the BS 2+ and that he can take a lascannon. Still though. I think it would be better to put the lascannons on Predators or 5-man marine squads. Your points are valid for sure. I'm not saying it is bad. Just that I wouldn't use it in lists that I enjoy playing.

[Remtek]

I often use both Meph and Libby dread at the same time. Hang back with one of them, cast some smites. You can even run Meph with boil blood/smite/wings/unleash, he will put out a decent amount of mortal wounds while the libby dread goes in first with wings.  Then send in the second libby turn 3 or even 4. Take 6 man intecerssors to beef up power level on the table and a few rhinos  with stormbolter vets/ razorbacks to clear chaff. You won't loose anything too important turn 1. Rhinos are really undervaled! can give them 5+ fnp vs mortals and move one up" 18 with overcharged engines, great for screening our powerful characers!

[Diagramdude]

I wouldn't say the libby dread is outclassed by mephiston for melee damage. AP-4 with flat 3 damage can be much more effective than AP-3 D3 damage.

[Jolemai]

No one have a Librarian Dreadnought ready for the ETL? :(

[Paladin777]

If I get through vows 1,2, and 3 I may put one in a fourth alongside two lascannon dreads.

[Panzer]

No one have a Librarian Dreadnought ready for the ETL?

 

Unfortunately not. I'm currently using my Furioso with the Halberd arm as my Librarian Dread and a proper one with the right body is planned but that'll come once I'm done with my current backlog. ^^

[CaptainHelion]

Mine is already painted, and has been for several years, I'm afraid.

[Charlo]

Already painted both of mine for 2 years ago :P