Codex?

[Krakendoomcool]

The Orks could really do with different ways to play. You shouldnt have to take hordes and a weirdboy every time. It’s a bit odd how reliant they are on one psychic power.

 

A variety of options and ways to play would be great for us too. You shouldn’t have to sit back and shoot. We should be able to build our army’s in different ways. There are a ton of different units so workable armies that are different should be achievable.

 

Mid range. Is how I think we operate too. So getting back into that midrange would be great.

[Kasper_Hawser]

The Orks could really do with different ways to play. You shouldnt have to take hordes and a weirdboy every time. It’s a bit odd how reliant they are on one psychic power.

 

A variety of options and ways to play would be great for us too. You shouldn’t have to sit back and shoot. We should be able to build our army’s in different ways. There are a ton of different units so workable armies that are different should be achievable.

 

Mid range. Is how I think we operate too. So getting back into that midrange would be great.

 

Well, Orks being Orks, personally I think there's 3 ways you should go about, Mek heavy, Horde heavy or or Super Heavy. I really don't want your dakka to increase any further as despite BS5+, the guns Orks have you have REALLY hurt, so I don't think they should get increased accuracy.

 

But there are two thing we both need: survivability and speed. We can hit and punch well enough. It's getting there that's one of the main problem. One or the other.

[The Saint Ragnar]

I think Great Companies will be back. 8th has seen some of the fluffiest while still be good codex entries for a long while. You cannot have a fluffy edition and ignore the easy pickings of great companies for the Space Wolves. There have been multiple other Codexes out there who have never had multiple factions but they got them. Why is it so out of this world that the one faction who has repeatedly had the fact mentioned that they operate like multiple separate Chapters while being one would get multiple "traits". Every time I see someone say something along the lines of "You will absolutely not get multiple traits" I cannot help but think why not for the above reasons.

 

Will we get 13? That would be awesome but a very long shot. Will be get 5-7? I think that is much more within reason.

 

Will they all be competitive? Most likely not but that is not the point. Every multiple trait book has maybe 2 competitive and the rest are just there to be fun and fluffy ways to play your army. Nothing wrong with a fluffy way to play amongst friends and a hard way to play in tournaments.

[The Saint Ragnar]

Imagine if we got a 6++ for Logan Grimnar's Great Company which if a unit already has a FnP they increase theirs by one to a maximum of either 4++ or 5++. That would be awesome!

 

Or if we have the Firehowlers where if they charge, are charged, or heroically intervene they get +1 attack. Maybe the Blackmanes got that and Firehowlers get a fight first rule. I see those two companies as very close.

 

There are tons of possibilities!

[Guest Triszin]

Imagine if we got a 6++ for Logan Grimnar's Great Company which if a unit already has a FnP they increase theirs by one to a maximum of either 4++ or 5++. That would be awesome!

 

Or if we have the Firehowlers where if they charge, are charged, or heroically intervene they get +1 attack. Maybe the Blackmanes got that and Firehowlers get a fight first rule. I see those two companies as very close.

 

There are tons of possibilities!

firehowlers gain Flamers as special weapon options in all squads.

 

firehowler wolf guards get access to flamer pistols?

[Bulwyf]

I would love each company getting their own trait but I can't see them doing that. I just hope we get a good trait.

[Krakendoomcool]

We deserve it. Surely more so than Harlequins and Admech for example. Nothing against them it's just they have zero history, time or money invested in different types like we all do with the great companies.

[Karhedron]

BAs and DAs have had specialised formations for longer than Wolves but didn't get separate traits in 8th edition. That doesn't mean that you can't build an effective army with a strong Death Company theme (for example). You take your DC and DC Dreads, lead them with Astorath and Lemartes and then back up with whatever support you feel is suitable.

 

Great Companies only received any differentiation in Warzone Fenris. At the end of the day, do we need deparate traits to make a characterful army? 75% of Eldar armies have suddenly become Alaitoc while several traits do not synergise well with the Craftworlds they are supposed to represent.

 

I do not have strong feelings against Great Company traits. I just think we might be better off with a single, solid Chapter trait and then if you want to run Blackmanes, you take Ragnar and he provides any additional attributes that are suitable. If you want to run Iron Wolves, take a mech-heavy force with an Iron Priest or two. I would rather have a really solid Chapter Trait that everyone can benefit from than a mixed bag that either encourage min-maxing, don't reflect the fluff or three-quarters of them being not worth taking.

[VIth]

Or if we have the Firehowlers where if they charge, are charged, or heroically intervene they get +1 attack. Maybe the Blackmanes got that and Firehowlers get a fight first rule. I see those two companies as very close.

There are tons of possibilities!

Firehowlers should be gone given their destruction at Cadia and a new Great Company should be in their place. I didn’t want the setting/timeline to advance, but now that it did the consequences should be real.

[Karhedron]

Firehowlers should be gone given their destruction at Cadia and a new Great Company should be in their place. I didn’t want the setting/timeline to advance, but now that it did the consequences should be real.

Firstly, fluff should not invalidate rules. There are plenty of characters who are dead in the fluff but still present in rule and model form (Kell for instance). Secondly, it is not uncommon for Wolf Lords to recycle emblems if they suit their personalities. It has been more than a century since the Fall of Cadia, long enough for a new Fire Howlers great Company to have been established to continue the legacy of the old.

[PeteySödes]

BAs and DAs have had specialised formations for longer than Wolves but didn't get separate traits in 8th edition. That doesn't mean that you can't build an effective army with a strong Death Company theme (for example). You take your DC and DC Dreads, lead them with Astorath and Lemartes and then back up with whatever support you feel is suitable.

 

Great Companies only received any differentiation in Warzone Fenris. At the end of the day, do we need deparate traits to make a characterful army? 75% of Eldar armies have suddenly become Alaitoc while several traits do not synergise well with the Craftworlds they are supposed to represent.

 

I do not have strong feelings against Great Company traits. I just think we might be better off with a single, solid Chapter trait and then if you want to run Blackmanes, you take Ragnar and he provides any additional attributes that are suitable. If you want to run Iron Wolves, take a mech-heavy force with an Iron Priest or two. I would rather have a really solid Chapter Trait that everyone can benefit from than a mixed bag that either encourage min-maxing, don't reflect the fluff or three-quarters of them being not worth taking.

 

This 100%. Give some fluffy Great Company strategems but I'd rather have just one really solid "chapter tactic". 

[VIth]

 

Firehowlers should be gone given their destruction at Cadia and a new Great Company should be in their place. I didn’t want the setting/timeline to advance, but now that it did the consequences should be real.

Firstly, fluff should not invalidate rules. There are plenty of characters who are dead in the fluff but still present in rule and model form (Kell for instance). Secondly, it is not uncommon for Wolf Lords to recycle emblems if they suit their personalities. It has been more than a century since the Fall of Cadia, long enough for a new Fire Howlers great Company to have been established to continue the legacy of the old.

Come on dude... they all died gloriously. It’s silly to pretend some random new guy would embrace the same name, same badge, and same tactics of a Great Company he wasn’t a part of. I’m all about having Fire Howler-ish tactics for the “I like to assault with a jump pack on” Great Company, but it should be a new Great Company, not the recycled old one. As far as characters go, 1) I’m fine with them getting rid of dead characters, but 2) an anachronistic character is not the same as an anachronistic chapte, so Codex: Space Marines doesn’t have rules for Luna Wolves, etc.

 

Anyway, I’m sure we’ll have to agree to disagree. I didn’t want the timeline to advance for this reason, but now that it has it would be super lame to reuse Firehowlers, Iron Wolves, etc when the whole fluff behind the Great Companies is that the chapter’s deeply ingrained individualism is such that each new Wolf Lord gets to do his own thing. If they just keep everything the old guy had it totally undoes that narrative.

[The Saint Ragnar]

 

Or if we have the Firehowlers where if they charge, are charged, or heroically intervene they get +1 attack. Maybe the Blackmanes got that and Firehowlers get a fight first rule. I see those two companies as very close.

There are tons of possibilities!

Firehowlers should be gone given their destruction at Cadia and a new Great Company should be in their place. I didn’t want the setting/timeline to advance, but now that it did the consequences should be real.

I forgot the Firehowlers also fell on Cadia. It was used for an example and I agree that the story should if moved forward not claw into the past.

[Guest]

 

Firehowlers should be gone given their destruction at Cadia and a new Great Company should be in their place. I didn’t want the setting/timeline to advance, but now that it did the consequences should be real.

Firstly, fluff should not invalidate rules. There are plenty of characters who are dead in the fluff but still present in rule and model form (Kell for instance). Secondly, it is not uncommon for Wolf Lords to recycle emblems if they suit their personalities. It has been more than a century since the Fall of Cadia, long enough for a new Fire Howlers great Company to have been established to continue the legacy of the old.

It's one thing for a new wolf Lord that rose from the ranks of the company and kept the symbol. However Iron Wolves and Firehowlers were both all wiped out to the man. Their ways have ended and let us hope new roots grow from their ashes.

 

I do not think we will get 13 traits but maybe a few. I feel bad for out BA and DA brothers however I think this is not their true codex. The way is set for their primarchs to return, and on those days we may see more traits for them. On the other hand maybe Russ will reforge us as a legions, yet keep the 13 companies as days past, and have the wolves more uniform across the board. We have fallen from the days of his leaving, let us hope he brings us back to glory.

[Sete]

If SW gets more than 1 CT, that will open not a can of worms but a :cuss can.

 

But hey, re roll charges :D

[Guest Triszin]

If SW gets more than 1 CT, that will open not a can of worms but a can.

 

But hey, re roll charges

I see it one of three options.

 

we either get 2-3 chapter tactics*, 7 static tactics + a D6 random one ,or we get one.

 

Option A.

1. 40k Marine chapter tactic. ( Acute senses, or Counter charge, or always going first in combat)

2. 13th company chapter tactic ( Chapter tactic " The Route", essentially chapter tactic from 30k)

3. Primaris  space wolf chapter tactics ( For the wolf spear, and other successors)

 

Option B. ( similar to the Tau sept tactics and random ones)

1. 7 tactics to show the vareity of the wolves ( covers logans comapny, 13th co, primaris co, death wolves, and other prominent)

2. D6 random roll to for a fairly generic traits

 

Option C.

1. The Route, 1 all encompassing Chapter tactic for all the sons of Russ

[Kasper_Hawser]

Option A is the best choice. I like Option B but please, no more rerolls on warlord traits/chapter traits/psychic powers. I had enough of that randomness back in 7th.

[Guest]

If SW gets more than 1 CT, that will open not a can of worms but a can.

 

But hey, re roll charges

 

 

No matter what GW does with the SW's will cause people to riot. I still remember when GW did Warzone Fenris and people freak that SW's got 2 books. Even though the 1st book was half Daemons half SW, and the 2nd book was half Daemons half 1ksons. Yet still people complained SW's got 2 books of formations. 

[Guest Triszin]

 

If SW gets more than 1 CT, that will open not a can of worms but a can.

 

But hey, re roll charges

 

 

No matter what GW does with the SW's will cause people to riot. I still remember when GW did Warzone Fenris and people freak that SW's got 2 books. Even though the 1st book was half Daemons half SW, and the 2nd book was half Daemons half 1ksons. Yet still people complained SW's got 2 books of formations. 

 

its why space wolves are the best test bed for ideas

[Kasper_Hawser]

 

If SW gets more than 1 CT, that will open not a can of worms but a can.

 

But hey, re roll charges

 

 

No matter what GW does with the SW's will cause people to riot. I still remember when GW did Warzone Fenris and people freak that SW's got 2 books. Even though the 1st book was half Daemons half SW, and the 2nd book was half Daemons half 1ksons. Yet still people complained SW's got 2 books of formations. 

 

 

People freaked? It wasn't even 2 books, it was 1/2 a book. 2 books of formations for Space wolves? Where the heck did those people learn how to read? Never mind that the daemon and CSM portion of the other 1 1/2 books were so ridiculous it wasn't even funny to the Great Packs. I still have nightmares of the Tetrad steamrolling 1850 points of my army, and this was when I still used ThunderwolveS! Which you all know I detest.

[Guest]

 

 

If SW gets more than 1 CT, that will open not a can of worms but a :cuss can.

But hey, re roll charges :D

 

 

 

No matter what GW does with the SW's will cause people to riot. I still remember when GW did Warzone Fenris and people freak that SW's got 2 books. Even though the 1st book was half Daemons half SW, and the 2nd book was half Daemons half 1ksons. Yet still people complained SW's got 2 books of formations.

 

People freaked? It wasn't even 2 books, it was 1/2 a book. 2 books of formations for Space wolves? Where the heck did those people learn how to read? Never mind that the daemon and CSM portion of the other 1 1/2 books were so ridiculous it wasn't even funny to the Great Packs. I still have nightmares of the Tetrad steamrolling 1850 points of my army, and this was when I still used ThunderwolveS! Which you all know I detest.

There was a video of someone setting fire to a warzone fenris book. Yeah...

[Kasper_Hawser]

I vaguely remember that a couple years ago, don't see it on youtube though.

 

I would say get a life, but I think there's only a thin red line between our fanboyism with outright fanaticism.

 

Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad, Think happy thoughts not Tetrad....

 

.... I wish I was kidding but I'm not. I nearly quit 40K after facing that list with CAD.

[M.Redbeard]

I really had a chilling thought about what Chapter Tactic will we have (and I am.in the camp of believing we will have only 1) and seeing how we are treated like an Assault army, we will be getting the trait of advancing and firing guns that aren't Assault as Assault and ignore modfiers on Assault Weapons... which feel thematic amd encourages the movement of SW and may make use of the Wolf Standard in Grey Hunters and it is an established trait... but I don't think it os a very good one. Feels thematic though so I wouldn't be too upset.

[Gherrick]

I'd like a chapter tactic that gives us better chances to assault from outflank (3d6?), and see TWC and fen/cyber wolves get outflank for free (and perhaps not count against the reserve cap in the case of the wolves). And a strategem to prevent a unit from disengaging :)

[Karack Blackstone]

I really had a chilling thought about what Chapter Tactic will we have (and I am.in the camp of believing we will have only 1) and seeing how we are treated like an Assault army, we will be getting the trait of advancing and firing guns that aren't Assault as Assault and ignore modfiers on Assault Weapons... which feel thematic amd encourages the movement of SW and may make use of the Wolf Standard in Grey Hunters and it is an established trait... but I don't think it os a very good one. Feels thematic though so I wouldn't be too upset.

 

While this works, it does however raise a rather interesting question to me: aren't the Wolves more than just a close-in army? I realize this is a thematic thing, however, as much as I hate to type it, some replacement of Acute Senses as it once was, might work as our "Chapter Tactic." the problem to me is that, while the individual Great Company Traits might work, it does seem pretty well closer to what the Wolves might be like, in the 8th Edition Codex.

 

Now, don't get me wrong, I get that a Chapter Trait, Great Company Trait, ATSKNF, and something akin to a proper Acute Senses is pretty beefy in terms of so many options. The problem is, the Imperial Guard have something similar, in a way; the rub is that even if the Wolves do get something similar, there has to be balance if that is the case.

 

I would love a fun, fluffy, and thematic Chapter Trait, something perhaps like keeping Counterattack from previous editions, or even if the above fire non-Assault weapons as if they were Assault, perhaps still with the -1 To Hit penalty, could work well, if done right.

 

I do like the concept of Great Company Traits, the issue is, as per the above, how is it going to be fun, fair, and interesting? I did like the old Saga style set of options, and the fluffy side of trying to fulfill the Saga through some requirement, was a great concept to keep things great. The constant issue is that, no matter what, the Wolves are a close range and stuck in force for the Grey Hunters, the line infantry; the problem is, there's more than just Grey Hunters and Blood Claws in the ranks.

 

Still, if GW is proving one thing with 8th Edition, it is that the fun and fluff are one and the same, as the entirety of all Codex books thus far have been both true to the fluff and provide some very interesting crunch on the table, which is in all cases welcome here.