Guest Triszin Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Just curious as to others thoughts on how to deal with the new knights. they look mighty scary, especially with a character missle Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainman_99 Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 If you can't beat them, join them! As I won´t play my Sisters until they get a codex the new IK(s) will be an excellent addition to my AdMechs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5093621 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melete Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The best thing might be taking a Blood Angels battalion/supreme command and letting a couple of Smashf*ckers do their job. Pure Space Wolves? Eh. I don't really like our options pre-codex, which probably just amounts to spamming Long Fangs. It's hard to charge the flamer Knight, so that leaves Dreads/TWC/Wulfen/characters a bit weaker here. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5093733 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saint Ragnar Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 I think if I came up against one I would use the same tactics for Knights we currently face. Put all my anti-tank into it to cripple it and let my THs finish it off. Or once I cripple it ignore it and play objectives. Until we see the point cost I am not too worried about these guys. A Knight Crusader is 500+ and those new Knights have more guns so anyone fielding one is going to be weak on bodies for objectives. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5093735 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 Maybe 2x shields dreads and murder fang to attempt to murder it? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5093790 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted May 29, 2018 Share Posted May 29, 2018 The big Knights don't actually look particularly scary in melee since they are WS4+ and only have feet to attack with. Massed Thunderhammers on any suitable unit are one option. The only real defense they have against CC is the super-heavy-flamer as 3D6 S7 Ap-2 2D auto-hits on the charge is definitely going to leave a mark. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5093801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasper_Hawser Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 I just look at the Knights and weep. Even their shortest range weapon the Conflagaration cannon, has too many shots and 2 damage, easily enough to skewer anything charging short of full 10 man TH/SS termies and Wulfen. At this stage, the only good way to get a charge is to have a Blood Angels detachment just to get the stupid relic which prevents Overwatch to take the first charge. And we're not even talking about the rest of the Knights ridiculous arsenal. Actually my knee jerk reaction is mainly for the new patterns. the older ones like Paladins, Errant, Crusader and Warden are still somewhat manageable. Armigers are also not to scary. But those new guns, from the Conflagaration to the Volcano cannon: on a chassis like the Dominus which can carry God knows how many guns...... ..... I'm a sad wolf. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5093999 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arentius Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 New nights are easy as full wulfen, -1 them to hit with our tune priests, chuck wulfen in a storm wolf (another -1) keep it out of flamer range then do a 2” charge and shred the knight with str 10 damage 3 hammer attacks Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW1 Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Do you just get over watch on the first unit to charge? Charge with a sacrificial wolf unit then hit it with the TH pack? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094197 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Jbickb Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Now overwatch is possible until a unit makes combat so if said sacrificial unit dies then your next unit can be overmatched. Is the thunderwolf lord character (name is not in my brain pre coffee) still immune to fire? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094202 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanPesci Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Do you just get over watch on the first unit to charge? Charge with a sacrificial wolf unit then hit it with the TH pack? Aye if the first unit survives overwatch and makes its charge...no more overwatch. If its the flamer variant..its going to have to come to you...this works to the advantage of a CC list. I think with our dread/wulfen options we are one of the better SM chapters for dealing with tis thing in combat. Use the axe/shield to eat the overwatch (10-12 wounds on average BEFORE our 3++ inv???)..it should survive. Bjorn could probably eat the overwatch too with his T8, saves, and then FNP rolls. He can then potentially lay down 30 wounds on the sucker (more if wulfen are nearby) Or ram it with a landraider/stormwolf for similar effect (again, it has to come close to your lines to be effective if its taken the flamer/harpoon) Has it been released how many points one of the big knights is yet?? If not i see no cause for complaints yet when it could cost the same as 2-3 axe/shield dreads that would most likely tear it to pieces. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094203 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saint Ragnar Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Now overwatch is possible until a unit makes combat so if said sacrificial unit dies then your next unit can be overmatched. Is the thunderwolf lord character (name is not in my brain pre coffee) still immune to fire? Sadly not anymore but his mantle does give +1 to saving throws against shooting so he has a 2++ against shooting meaning he is your best bet to eat that overwatch. Also, his name is Harald Deathwolf Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094259 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Has it been released how many points one of the big knights is yet??Rumours are just over 600 points. Supposedly they have been priced so you can just squeeze 3 into 1850 points which would work out to about 615 points. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094278 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Has it been released how many points one of the big knights is yet??Rumours are just over 600 points. Supposedly they have been priced so you can just squeeze 3 into 1850 points which would work out to about 615 points. thats cheap, is that naked without weapons, or kitted out? 3 of those on a field would be a nightmare to play Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094286 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Has it been released how many points one of the big knights is yet??Rumours are just over 600 points. Supposedly they have been priced so you can just squeeze 3 into 1850 points which would work out to about 615 points. thats cheap, is that naked without weapons, or kitted out? 3 of those on a field would be a nightmare to play Supposedly that is kitted out but I don't know if that is the cheapest configuration or not. Take with a pinch of salt of course until we actually see the codex for ourselves. Tempest's Wrath is golden against any LOWs since the opportunity to debuff 600+ points with a single power is awesome. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094310 Share on other sites More sharing options...
d@n Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 wait until you get your dex. i think russ will do the trick Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094314 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiguriusX Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Has it been released how many points one of the big knights is yet??Rumours are just over 600 points. Supposedly they have been priced so you can just squeeze 3 into 1850 points which would work out to about 615 points. thats cheap, is that naked without weapons, or kitted out?3 of those on a field would be a nightmare to play Supposedly that is kitted out but I don't know if that is the cheapest configuration or not. Take with a pinch of salt of course until we actually see the codex for ourselves. Tempest's Wrath is golden against any LOWs since the opportunity to debuff 600+ points with a single power is awesome. Brush up on your rules brothers and wield them to your advantage. Tempest Wrath doesn't require LOS Njal (or regular rune priest) can teleport into ruins or something nearby to get the TW on a knight They then keep their head down and can't be retaliated against Play the objectives against knights (that means winning the objective placement phase and being smart...put them in defensible areas with poor LOS) and get your infantry onto them ASAP then dig in like a tick and hold Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094324 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melete Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 wait until you get your dex. i think russ will do the trick Not unlikely that Russ would just get incinerated in Overwatch, lol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5094494 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanPesci Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 Has it been released how many points one of the big knights is yet??Rumours are just over 600 points. Supposedly they have been priced so you can just squeeze 3 into 1850 points which would work out to about 615 points. Cool, so less than running 2x axe shield dreads and murderfang or around the same if swapping out murderfang for bjorn. Shields eat up overwatch. Bjorn/MF in there for overkill. May be slight issues with how easy it explodes/how many mortal wounds get dealt out thogh :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5095080 Share on other sites More sharing options...
greysquigg Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 I second the dreadnaught approach. You can make a whole vanguard detachment for the extra CP. Had a game the other week where Bjorn took down 3 dinged up knights at about 15-19 wounds left, over 3 turns. The -4 ap and re rolling wounds is seriously good against stuff that doesn't have an invun XD. Also - hellblasters coming in from the side due to on the hunt. 20 overcharged plasma shots should do a number on them! They aren't even that expensive in comparison to the dread option. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5095094 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted May 31, 2018 Share Posted May 31, 2018 oh god, some of the relics were revealed. that relic gatling cannon, Heavy 14 str 6 36" ap -2 dam 2, on unmodified rolls to hit of 6, treat that to hit as 2 attacks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5095209 Share on other sites More sharing options...
vigitant Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 Bring a contingent of inquisition with acolytes and an inquisitor. The acolytes can provide landing cushions for your wulfen if their transports explode. The Inquisitor cans cast Terrify to negate overwatch. bonus points if you can 3 point the knight with dreads/TWWL so he's stuck there. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5097567 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Also - hellblasters coming in from the side due to on the hunt. 20 overcharged plasma shots should do a number on them! They aren't even that expensive in comparison to the dread option. Actually I think that Hellblasters will be a lot less effective than Dreads. Knights are T8 so even overcharging Hellblasters will only be wounding on a 4+. Secondly, Knights get an invulnerable save against shooting from their Ion Shields that they do not get in CC. This starts as a 5++ but can be boosted to a 4++ with the stratagem (and you can bet your opponent will spend that CP if you are aiming 20 plasma shots at him). 10 Hellblasters (let's be generous and assume there is a Wolf Lord nearby to mitigate overheats) will get on average 15 hits at close range, that will become 7.5 wounds and 10 damage once their Ion Shield comes into play (or 7.5 if they rotate their Ion Shields). That is quite a bit less than the Dreads, it won't even drop the Knight down to BS/WS 4+ and the Hellblasters will be a lot more vulnerable to the Knight's retaliation. Knights have plenty of Damage 2 and D3 weapons that really mulch Primaris Marines, even just stomping on them in close combat will likely reduce half the squad to a red smear. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5098092 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I think I might be building 2x shield dreadnaughts for future lists Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5098121 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteySödes Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 I for sure am Triszin lol. It’s my main consistent performer on the table. I honestly have no issue saying that probably half my wins this edition wouldn’t happen without either his tanking or brute force. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347740-tactics-dealing-with-the-new-knights/#findComment-5098187 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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