Captain Idaho Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 It's such a tough choice but I'm doing it. I'm moving away from the Sanctic Halo. I was hooked as a 3+ invulnerable is amazing and the Deny the Witch is also great. However, a single Deny the Witch is not going to unbalance games so adding in a Librarian (at cost of course but the utility of Mortal Wounds and perhaps even Psychic Fortress makes worthwhile) covers that. More importantly, I thought about performance and I realised my Captain dies so often anyway, with the invulnerable saves made for him usually being a 4+. I mean, how many times do I really roll a 3 for him! (1 in 6 but who's really counting) So I wanted to try out the other options and I found it liberating! I've modelled a Captain with a huge Chainsword (eviscerator model to be exact) to represent the Teeth of Terra and given him a Mastercrafted Bolter. Love the model and can't wait to try him in a game this weekend. He's taking on a Blood Angels army with a heavy Primaris slant so he should perform exceptionally well. It's only a shame I can't give him the Primarch's Wrath as well! Best of all he is only 77pts! That's Lieutenant territory for quite a dangerous model. What Relics have you guys found yourself using and what sort of success (or failures) have you had? What are your opinions on it? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I think it's a noble idea, but it's such a staple, that I wouldn't be surprised if you eventually flipped back! Using my recent experience, I think an extra Deny is just fantastic especially in an army where it's always possible you'll get that CP back. That being said for changing it up, having some fun with a new model, etc.... I think that's a great choice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5095967 Share on other sites More sharing options...
robofish7591 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 The Sanctic Halo is a great relic (it is usually my go to relic as well!).... but so is the Teeth of Tera, I was planning on creating a captain with the Teeth of Tera using an evicerator and that forge world standard bearer that was sold in GW stores a while back, I just need to get my hands on an evicerator now! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 1, 2018 Author Share Posted June 1, 2018 I very much doubt I'd come away from the Sanctic Halo forever ;) But yes it is very fun making an individual model with rule of cool. And let's not sell the combination short - it's 77pts that gives me reasonable killing power and an HQ slot. Probably won't win any tournaments with it but with the points spare I have just managed to get an Apothecary for funsies. Lastly; it's a bolter and chainsword :d Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096142 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 1, 2018 Author Share Posted June 1, 2018 The Sanctic Halo is a great relic (it is usually my go to relic as well!).... but so is the Teeth of Tera, I was planning on creating a captain with the Teeth of Tera using an evicerator and that forge world standard bearer that was sold in GW stores a while back, I just need to get my hands on an evicerator now! Vanguard set is a goldmine. Weapons, jump packs, Storm Shields, heads and accessories... all in plastic. However, no Eviscerator. There are ornate chainswords but the Teeth of Terra should be HUGE and imposing. :) So if you want a Vanguard squad I recommend 1 box of Assault Marines and Vanguard. Or just ebay it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096159 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I use SoF depending on what I am up against. It is great versus tee shirt save armies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096177 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aothaine Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I would just spend some cp for more relics instead of not having Santic Halo. It is the best relic in the codex imho. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruor Vault Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I also used to use the Sanctic Halo on my captains all the time, but lately I've been using a Bike Captain with the Shield Eternal and a Thunder Hammer instead. He's cheap, fast, and pretty resilient against high damage weapons. I've also taken to equipping my Lieutenant with the Primarch's Wrath. Ultramarines like to be shooting all the time, and having those 2/4 extra D2 shots can really make a difference when my gun line gets attacked by suicide characters! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096260 Share on other sites More sharing options...
robofish7591 Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 The Sanctic Halo is a great relic (it is usually my go to relic as well!).... but so is the Teeth of Tera, I was planning on creating a captain with the Teeth of Tera using an evicerator and that forge world standard bearer that was sold in GW stores a while back, I just need to get my hands on an evicerator now! Vanguard set is a goldmine. Weapons, jump packs, Storm Shields, heads and accessories... all in plastic. However, no Eviscerator. There are ornate chainswords but the Teeth of Terra should be HUGE and imposing. So if you want a Vanguard squad I recommend 1 box of Assault Marines and Vanguard. Or just ebay it. In order to finish off my company I need another assault squad, so I'll have a spare evicerator eventually! But yes, the vanguard vet kit is awesome, it has so many great bits in it! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096289 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 1, 2018 Author Share Posted June 1, 2018 I was thinking of taking multiple relics actually. A Captain tag team with the Teeth of Terra and Relic Blade/Sanctic Halo might just be atrocious to deal with! Of course a Lieutenant alongside the Captain would be more efficient ;) I use SoF depending on what I am up against. It is great versus tee shirt save armies. I can't for the life of me work out what SoF stands for! :d Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096310 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I take ToT on my Techmarine and he is rocking a combi-plasma (BS2). Tiggy casts MoH on him and he tears it up. I was thinking of taking multiple relics actually. A Captain tag team with the Teeth of Terra and Relic Blade/Sanctic Halo might just be atrocious to deal with!Of course a Lieutenant alongside the Captain would be more efficient I use SoF depending on what I am up against. It is great versus tee shirt save armies. I can't for the life of me work out what SoF stands for! Storm of Fire ! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096315 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 1, 2018 Author Share Posted June 1, 2018 Yes I love my Techmarine but I'd prefer the Teeth of Terra up close and personal and my Techmarine likes to fix my armour support. Anyone used the Teeth of Terra on other characters? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096424 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 1, 2018 Share Posted June 1, 2018 I use it for an apothecary from time to time. I do prefer the Techmarine though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096542 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 1, 2018 Author Share Posted June 1, 2018 Lieutenant isn't terrible either to save points but I think most of us would pay 14pts for a Captain for the extra attack, wound and an Iron Halo. Here's a question - is a Lieutenant/Captain assault tag team worth while? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnkyHamHam Posted June 2, 2018 Share Posted June 2, 2018 I prefer ToT and PW relics on Apothecaries and Techmarines respectively. Apothecary with ToT gives some serious combat support. And Techmarines have BS 2+ to make best use of PW. I think these relics make sense on the support characters since Caps and Lts already have access to master crafted bolt guns and pretty much any combat weapons. Hiding the relics on support characters is great in my opinion. No one suspects it. In the same vain, chapter champs get solid use of Burning Blade and company champs the Shield Eternal if you're into that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096614 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 2, 2018 Author Share Posted June 2, 2018 It's a shame the Terminator Captains can't get the Teeth of Terra but to be fair they're cool with Relic Blades. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5096816 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 2, 2018 Share Posted June 2, 2018 I think GW buggered our relic weapons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5097094 Share on other sites More sharing options...
justicarius6 Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 From my experience Codex marines simply can't play "herohammer" realistically against the bigger boys. After a particularly bad drubbing this weekend when I faced upon against a guy with a big gang of heavy hitters I'm going to have to relegate all my HQ's back into what I see as their most useful role as simply force multipliers on a gunline. And for that it means Santic Halo, the storm shield relic and perhaps the Primarch's Wrath. Marine heroes are simply too fragile to be able to push them forth into the fray, which is a real shame. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5097207 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 3, 2018 Author Share Posted June 3, 2018 I don't think I agree with that. Ultramarines have solid shooting but to then follow up with a solid assault is quite decisive. Anecdotal from my "test" game today: 8 Sternguard, an Apothecary (who died before doing anything sadly) a Librarian all jumped out of a Rhino to face down a Death Company Dreadnought and 8 Death Company and that crazy Blood Angel Captain with the Thunder Hammer. They linked up with my Captain with Mastercrafted Bolter and Teeth of Terra and went to town on their opponents. With the help of a Tactical squad I killed the Death Company Dreadnought from shooting, charged the Death Company and took them down over 2 turns. This included a counter charge from Lemartes. I lose the Apothecary, 7 of the Sternguard and 1 wound off the Captain (with rerolls from CP on his save) but tore the heart out of attack force when I fell back let the Tactical squad and Devastators (now available) to finish the characters off. My point being that a solid counter attack with a decent Captain can really put the hurt on opponents. My Captain with the Teeth of Terra killed 7 Death Company in 2 Combat Phases - no mean feat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5097597 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 3, 2018 Share Posted June 3, 2018 I agree - Space Marines can still do the business. /thumbsup Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5097622 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StraightSilver Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Back in 7th I used to almost exclusively run a Space Marine Captain in Artificer Armour and Shield Eternal. The 2+ 3++ was too good not to take.I have been sticking with the Shield Eternal in 8th but losing the ability to equip a standard Captain with Artificer Armour (losing the 2+ save) I think has been a big nerf. The only Captains able to get a 2+ save can't take Storm Shields...The Shield Eternal special rule (half damage rounding up) is also useless against single damage weapons - which is invariably what I fail saves to...So I am looking at ditching the Shield Eternal.I run the relic standard and stick him in with my Devastators and that does OK.I am honestly thinking of saving command points and reducing the number of relics I take - I'll stick with one as it's free.However, I must admit I think Ultramarines are best taking relics capable of shooting as this works best with their ability to withdraw from combat and shoot. So Primarch's Wrath is a good one.Teeth of Terra is also tempting but I agree that Codex Marines are decidedly average in combat these days and I tend to have them at the back helping out shooting. Which feels wrong to be honest. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5098302 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Ed Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Back in 7th I used to almost exclusively run a Space Marine Captain in Artificer Armour and Shield Eternal. The 2+ 3++ was too good not to take. I have been sticking with the Shield Eternal in 8th but losing the ability to equip a standard Captain with Artificer Armour (losing the 2+ save) I think has been a big nerf. The only Captains able to get a 2+ save can't take Storm Shields... The Shield Eternal special rule (half damage rounding up) is also useless against single damage weapons - which is invariably what I fail saves to... So I am looking at ditching the Shield Eternal. I run the relic standard and stick him in with my Devastators and that does OK. I am honestly thinking of saving command points and reducing the number of relics I take - I'll stick with one as it's free. However, I must admit I think Ultramarines are best taking relics capable of shooting as this works best with their ability to withdraw from combat and shoot. So Primarch's Wrath is a good one. Teeth of Terra is also tempting but I agree that Codex Marines are decidedly average in combat these days and I tend to have them at the back helping out shooting. Which feels wrong to be honest. Nothing is stopping you from taking the Armor Indomitus and a storm shield. I also think you're dead wrong about the Shield Eternal. If you're still getting pinged, then you need to practice how he is committed. I get that it's not always possible, but a Shield Eternal captain needs to seek out appropriate threats. Otherwise the Sanctic Halo is strictly better. I put the Shield Eternal on a bike captain with a thunderhammer. The extra mobility and toughness make sure he keeps hunting monsters and thunderhammers are dead killy. Give him the warlord trait for an extra wound and 6+++ for an extra good time. I also disagree about going down to 1 relic. SM stratagems are so bad that buying relics (and upgrading to chapter master) are some of the best uses of CPs available to us. Unless you're running character heavy, the Sanctic Halo, the Armor Indomitus, the Teeth of Terra, and Primarch's Wrath can all fit in with no cost. The Standard of the Emperor Ascendant and the Shield Eternal require specific options, but are outstanding relics. Relics are the only thing in the whole damn book that have aged well. Moving away from them makes zero sense to me. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5098344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruor Vault Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 From my experience Codex marines simply can't play "herohammer" realistically against the bigger boys. After a particularly bad drubbing this weekend when I faced upon against a guy with a big gang of heavy hitters I'm going to have to relegate all my HQ's back into what I see as their most useful role as simply force multipliers on a gunline. And for that it means Santic Halo, the storm shield relic and perhaps the Primarch's Wrath. Marine heroes are simply too fragile to be able to push them forth into the fray, which is a real shame. IMO I think it's less that our guys are too fragile, and more that our guys are too expensive. The bulk of our value is the aura's we're paying for, which provide no extra benefit when duplicating. Nobody is going to look at the stats of a Captain on Bike w/THSS and the be able to deny that Shield Captains on Dawn Eagles aren't vastly superior for only 24pts more! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5098421 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted June 4, 2018 Author Share Posted June 4, 2018 My Teeth of Terra Captain costs 77pts and boosts the effectiveness of my attacking force of Sternguard and Contemptor etc. My Sanctic Halo Captain costs 102pts and has a Relic Blade and plasma pistol. That's affordable. Not to say the Custodes Jetbike rubbish isn't in need of a points increase. *** I think having a 2+ save isn't really needed on a character with a Storm Shield or Sanctic Halo. Being hit by a weapon with a -1 makes it functionally the same. A Cataphractii Captain can fill that niche of course, allowing you to save the Relic for elsewhere. Give him a Relic Blade and combi weapon and job's a good 'un. Then you can use the Relic on that Techmarine at the back with the Primarch's Wrath. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5098478 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted June 4, 2018 Share Posted June 4, 2018 Yeah Vertus Praetors are way undercosted. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347822-moving-away-from-the-sanctic-halo/#findComment-5098511 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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