Rough riders/death riders

[Beams]

Hey, was wondering what the general consensus on rough riders/death riders of Krieg were? I'm thinking of adding some to my army.

[WarriorFish]

General Consensus was retired by the commissariat for insufficient competence We do have several commanders who make use of Death Riders and they consistently report good results from them so, models aside, good reason to add them to your force as a mobile force. I'm sure they'll be along for some detailed help but if you could give a fuller picture to what you have and are hoping to do that would make their contributions easier

[Beams]

I want to try and run either rough riders or death riders alongside my Mechanized sisters of battle Dominions as a mobile assualty unit, or alongside my Mechanized steel legion. Either way, I'm going to be modeling them as Eschers with Lance's on the old Squat motorcycle to give a "space Amazon" feel.

[Beams]

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/gallery/image/236244-amazon-biker/

For the life of me, I can't figure out how to post an image on mobile, so there's a link to what mine look like. That's obvs a work in progress.

[TheTrans]

A spiel I did in the RR thread about Death Riders:
 

Death Riders are very much the bomb compared to their more lightly armed cousins.

I believe one of the fantasy flight RPGS classified them as ‘Heavy Lancers’ which as I will explain, is spot on.

So for 6points more than a rough rider (yes that is over a 50% increase) you get a wealth of better abilities and stats

Stock standard they are now WS 3+ , T4, 2 Attacks (so now you get 2 lance attacks as opposed to one lance and one chain sword) and a 4+ save! So already they are approaching Primaris Marines in basic stats. You also have the generic Krieg ability ‘Cult of Sacrifice’ which allows models in this unit to ignore shooting casualties for morale checks… no more getting shot off the board gang! Finally, and certainly not least, Krieg can issue orders to cavalry as well as infantry (to be covered in a moment).

Next up you have their much-improved mount, which nets the model an extra slew of abilities.
First up we have the Augmented Mount rule, which gives the model essentially a 5+ FnP save against anything s4 and below (FW have not yet FAQ’d what Poison and Mortal Wounds count as). They also ignore any effects of terrain on charging (bit of a moot point given this edition’s rules, but hey) and last but not least is the mounts attacks. Instead of Trampling Hooves (which gives me flash backs to Freddy Got Fingered and the ‘look at my hooves’ bit…) we have Savage Claws..because Krieg Steeds don’t dick about. This nets you another 2 (!) attacks after you’ve attacked with the rider at a whopping S4… quite lethal.

Now the Ridemaster (sarge) is the same as his underlings, except he is rocking an extra attack. He can take upgraded weapons, but sadly the Melee Weapon replaces his Hunting Lance… so be careful on that option.

Now the Death Riders don’t have the outflank ability which is a shame…but then enter the Death Rider Command Squadron!

You pay a 1 point increase on these fellas netting you +1 on both BS and Ld for the unit, they also have the ‘Flanking Manoeuvre” ability, which is the same as the Rough Rider one, but it allows you to bring up to 5 other Death Rider squadrons/characters with you. Only downside is they are a 4 man unit.

Now finally and by far my favourite, is the Death Rider Squadron Commander, for a measly 10point upgrade on a normal AM Company Commander you net a WS3+, BS3+ S3 T4 A3 Ld8 Sv 4+ mounted character. He has the normal officer options available to him, as well as all the benefits of the Krieg Steed. He can take a Demolition Charge for a measly 5 points (the visual imagery of this cavalry officer galloping past a bunker and hurling the charge in is golden!). He is also rocking a refractor field if you’re armour save is being negated, which never hurts. Finally he can issue a single order a turn, which is fantastic, meaning you can have an order-giver up fighting with you flanking Death Rider squadrons.

Now the orders that are available to Krieg are the same as guard, except you swap out Take Arim! for ‘Duty unto Death’ which allows an Inf or Cav unit to make a single attack after being killed in the fight phase (so pretty helpful, especially if they charged this turn) and they also swap out   FRF!SRF! (a damn shame) for ‘Without Mercy’, which gives all las guns and hotshot lasguns the pistol 2 characteristic (not much help for Death Riders). The more interesting orders available are most probably Move! Move! Move! Which could put a unit of Death Riders 20”+2d6 up the board which is amazing! But by far the most interesting and powerful one for the Death Riders would have to be Fix Bayonets… allowing them to get a full fight phase instead of shooting is beyond amazing.. given the amount of attacks they put out, you could probably get another charge off also…

One worthy mention also is the Krieg Company Standard, which gives all Inf and Cav +1 to Ld..but more importantly +1 attack… if you can figure out a way to keep a company command squad up with your Death Rider advance, they will make for a murderous unit indeed!!

They will happily go toe to toe with a lot of the enemy’s melee infantry and certainly take their toll! If they go against softer targets (Basic Marines, Guard, Eldar etc) they will absolutely murder them. Factor in orders as well as a Company Banner, a single Death Rider could put out a whopping 10 attacks in a single player turn which is nothing to sniff out.

A full unit of charging Death Riders with Company Standard support put out a terrifying 31 Lance attacks and 20 S4 attacks hitting on a 3+… for a whopping 193 points (10 riders + company command with banner)… people should be very afraid…

So all in all, and I think you’ll agree, that Death Riders deserve the title of Heavy Lancers…

[Spyboy]

TheTrans has some very valid points, however I have a very different use for my rough riders, not the dkok variant. I load mine up with plasma guns and come in near a prime target, hopefully score a wound with some other weapon, then use overlapping fields of fire for plasma guns with no overheating :)

[WarriorFish]

Looks good, the pose works surprisingly well as a rider! I've added the image into the post for you :tu:

[MrZakalwe]

I've had some success running a couple of 5 man units of rough riders completely barebones. 100 points isn't too heavy an investment and they are reasonably good for the cost. 

 

Rough riders can't take orders and get little benefit from most regimental traits but they are actually quite good for linebreaker/ tying up tanks/support squads/arty in CC and occasionally they kill something. The lack of any synergies means you have no real positioning limitations which is actually quite a nice bit of freedom in the Guard. 

 

Don't expect much from the lances, they look decent on paper but the lack of attacks and buffs makes them a bit rubbish though once in a blue moon you will get very lucky and their very high damage potential will just wipe something.

[ProminusIV]

Normal rough riders:

On the tabletop i haven't had any real success with them (probably because i charge them into stuff that turns around and murders them). 

But the hobby project alone is worth making/including them into an army. And they're super fluffy! 

[Beams]

So, the consensus seems to be that if I want them to charge something and be melee focused, go Krieg, otherwise if I want special weapon support, go Rough Riders?

[Halfpint100]

If you do tournaments that require official models you might have to shell out for death riders instead of making your own. Rough riders are easier to kitbash

[Beams]

The tournaments that I play in mostly just require the model to be broadly recognizable, stand out from the rest of your army and have the required weapons. They also should be mostly GW parts.

 

I feel like my Escher above fits and is different than the rest of the army, and is 100% GW, so it's really up to whether I'd like to run them as.

[Kinstryfe]

Haven't played with them, but have a local Kreig player I've played against several times and watched play several times, and his cavalry are one of the scariest close combat things I've seen in a guard army. They've highly mobile, durable, murder machines. Highly recommend them.

[librisrouge]

I love both but sadly am probably looking into selling my Death Riders soon (anybody desire them, message me.)

 

Death Riders are a pure CC unit. You take them to run things down on the charge and do bad things to the enemy. They're very tough, fast, and hard hitting for their points. That being said, don't expect them to take down Mortarion just because you got the jump on him. They're still guardsmen, after all.

 

Rough Riders are a harassment unit. Native outflank and the ability to snag two special weapons means a five man squad with two plasma or melta is fairly cheap and has to be addressed, just in case your dice are hot.

 

I wish I could find a nice steampunk horse or somesuch model to use.

[walter h]

The old fantasy warhammer had an engineer with a clockwork horse, if I remember correctly. Check to see if they still have it,maybe e_bay.

[librisrouge]

The old fantasy warhammer had an engineer with a clockwork horse, if I remember correctly. Check to see if they still have it,maybe e_bay.

I have, and you can sometimes find them. The problem is that I'd want 35 or so...FW is massively cheaper and that says something.

[Cap'm Heckus]

Plastic pistoleer/outrider kit from the fantasy line is my go too. They mesh well with Cadian bits and have lots of great extra bits on the sprue for other conversions. Got some photos of mine in the gallery.

[LT_CLAWS]

They preform okay from game to game for me, but the modeling opportunities are limitless! Here are my dino riders for my Ad Mech support force.

 

 

 

 

[Tallarn Commander]

Beams,

 

In my experience, yes, rough riders are worth it. In 10 of my 8th edition games I've taken rough riders. I usuallt take a squad of 10 with a flamer. In 7 of my 10 games I killed something and, as has been noted, they sometimes warn me linebreaker.

 

In short, after 17 years of being a subpar unit, they are now a par unit.

 

Here is the record of my Desert Dogs squad in 8th:

 

2018

July: killed war walker (win)

July: killed fire warrior squad (draw)

August: killed SW Dev squad (win)

October: seriously damaged Dunestrider (win)

November: lilled termagaunt squad (loss)

December: killed zilch (win)

December: killed zilch (loss)

December: killed BA character (loss)

 

2019

January: killed Tac squad (win)

March: killed zilch (loss)

[H311fi5h]

This thread made me order 15 Pistoliers 

How would you equip them fore competitive play? Full plasma? Plasma pistol and 2 meltaguns? Or just lances?

[Halfpint100]

I would say lances. 150 points of pure annoyance!

[Harrowmaster]

This thread made order 15 Pistoliers 

How would you equip them fore competitive play? Full plasma? Plasma pistol and 2 meltaguns? Or just lances?

 

Pictures would be greatly appreciated :). Any idea where you're getting the lances from?

[H311fi5h]

I think I'll build the lances from scratch. My idea was to simply drill through some closed fists, using 1 mm brass wire and green stuff for the explosive tip (which will look somewhat like an RPG warhead).

[H311fi5h]

Little update for anyone interested.

The pistol arms on the sergeants and the plasma guns are magnetized to allow for various loadouts. 

 

 

 

 

[Bjorn Firewalker]

H311fi5h's kitbashing skills are excellent. I hope to see his models painted soon.