Homebrew 8E Sisters Codex

[Servant of Dante]

Hi! As some of you might remember (or maybe that's wishful thinking on my part), I did a "rewrite" of the 7E codex a year or 2 ago. Well, late last year I wrote a 8E Sisters codex, but I did it by hand (smart decision, right?). I have recently typed it all up (as well as tweaked a few things and fixed a few typos), and here it is in PDF form. Yes, I know our real codex is coming, that's partly why I wanted to get this posted

 

Codex: Adeptus Ministorum (8th Edition)

 

Things I'm worried about:

AoFs per turn: this isn't really something that's easy to balance, but it shouldn't be hard to change some numbers.

Relative power of AoFs: I'm afraid some are too powerful or weak

Relative power of Stratagems: ditto

Relative Power of Saint's Legacies ("chapter tactics"): ditto

Usefullness of non-militant sisters: I'm worried I've not done enough to make the Diologus and Hospitaller worth using or even interesting. Also the Sabine Faulous and Pronatus.

Morale Mitigation: The codex has a lot of morale mitigation (not immunity) because I like the idea conceptually and it makes for some neat rules. There are probably too many auras to track but I'm going with it anyway. My concern is that with the prevalence of MSU none of it is relevant.

Jacobus: is he worth playing? are any of the HQ priests worth playing?

Typos: They're out there . . . somewhere . . . hiding in the darkness

 

Things I think are cool:

Boosted morale for large BSSs as well as enhanced faith generation at all unit sizes (more or less) to make them more appetizing.

2E characters are back (same as last edition's codex)

Anestasia and the Devout Sisters (from their Inquisitor incarnations) are in the codex as named characters in the Elites section!

2E relics

Order-specific AoFs, Relics, Stratagems, and Warlord Traits

The AoF system, a blend of my favorite system (from the WH codex) and the current index

Support for non-Sororitas mono-Ministorum armies! (well, a bit) we have the Frateris Clergy and a generic HQ choice on top of what already exists, and a unique relic and stratagem available to only mono-faction armies that don't use Sisters (they are intentionally quite powerful).

Repentia blobs and rules ala their WH incarnation

Buffed Seraphim

And a bunch of other odds and ends

 

Formatting: My own blend of the 5E BA codex I started 40K with, more recent formatting choices, and what I thought looked good

 

Also, there is no Celestine. There is also nowarlord trait made with her in mind. I will not be writing rules for her

 

And I haven't touched point values or power levels yet. Sorry

 

Comments and criticism appreciated! Anything that shows someone actually gave this a serious look

[Montford]

I have always envisioned the sarissa as a bayonet, so it should always grant its modifiers in melee, not just on the charge, etc.

[Servant of Dante]

I have always envisioned the sarissa as a bayonet, so it should always grant its modifiers in melee, not just on the charge, etc.

I have too, because that's how Witch Hunters described them. The same codex also made them charge-only. I don't think it'd be a huge deal to make then all the time, but they'd need a higher point cost

 

Historically a Sarissa was a long spear (4-6 meters), which could explain the charge-only flavor.

[Atrus]

Very nice! But still no love for the exorcist?

[Commander Dawnstar]

I'll be going over this in full later when I have time to read through it all, but one thing I caught at a glance is that you have the Order of Our Martyred Lady down as the Order of the Sacred Rose on the Saint's Legacies page, meaning Sacred Rose is actually listed twice.

[taikishi]

The initial part of your Act of Faith rule is too complex for really any edition of 40K, especially 8E, and hurts any list that brings hordes, transports (because transports don't have AoF) or Ministorum units. Points-based scaling would be better than X unit-based.

 

The Emperor's Deliverance is too strong, as is probably Holy Fusillade.

 

SoF results in the same problem as your AoF rule on Deny the Witch (bonus for every X models in unit).

 

I'm actually fine with our current Martyrdom letting you use an AoF for a CP.

 

Are there any rules atm that force you to roll two or more dice for a Morale test? Outside of what you've done with Imagifiers, which I disagree with.

 

Strength of Tradition: should be re-roll 1s for consistency with other such abilities and is almost too restrictive.

 

Skimming because too much to read while at work but On Wings of Vengeance might be too strong simply because it lets you ignore max range on your inferno pistols AND lets you fire them as if they were in half range, even at 2CP.

 

Imagifiers: are heavily stepping on the feet of the Dialogous my modifying Leadership.

 

Marine Rhinos don't have self repair, so why do ours?

[Servant of Dante]

Very nice! But still no love for the exorcist?

Well, I wasn't really sure what to do with it, I didn't want to change it too much. I did give it an anti-FLY stratagem and I changed the Exorcist missile launcher to D3+3 shots, but I am of course open to other ideas for making it worth playing.

 

 

I'll be going over this in full later when I have time to read through it all, but one thing I caught at a glance is that you have the Order of Our Martyred Lady down as the Order of the Sacred Rose on the Saint's Legacies page, meaning Sacred Rose is actually listed twice.

Suffer not the heretic, witch, mutant or typo to live! Corrected, thanks!

 

 

The initial part of your Act of Faith rule is too complex for really any edition of 40K, especially 8E, and hurts any list that brings hordes, transports (because transports don't have AoF) or Ministorum units. Points-based scaling would be better than X unit-based.

I disagree that this is too complex for any edition of 40k (see 7th edition Psychic phase or the AoF system of counting up and spending points in 3E), though it is likely too complex for 8th edition. Fortunately, I'm not writing an official codex, so I'm not super worried about that. I considered point scaling, but the count per unit lets me do a lot more with the rule: for instance, Imagifiers still contribute to AoFs since they have Acts of Faith (3), BSSs are encouraged by being 2 points per 5 models rather than 1 point per five models. I don't see how this hurts hoards, since larger units generate more points, and Helena's Sacred Rites army wide bonus is represented by her Acts of Faith (5). All of that would be lost with simple point scaling, which would be a shame imo.

 

The Emperor's Deliverance is too strong, as is probably Holy Fusillade.

Those were 2 I was worried about, thanks for the confirmation. 

 

SoF results in the same problem as your AoF rule on Deny the Witch (bonus for every X models in unit).

This is really not that complicated, and is reminiscent of the bonus AoS Orks receive to cast psychic powers, or the bonus 40K orks get to Leadership for squad size. Besides, with the prevalence of MSU, this might encourage a larger squad or 2 to make the denies relevant.

 

I'm actually fine with our current Martyrdom letting you use an AoF for a CP.

Well . .  . I prefer the one I wrote here? The current one is OK too I guess.

 

Are there any rules atm that force you to roll two or more dice for a Morale test? Outside of what you've done with Imagifiers, which I disagree with.

Would you care to say why you disagree? Is it fluff or something else? If you're talking about the note in the Army Abilities section, the Harlequins have a Masque that makes units roll 2 dice for morale and discard the highest result, which is why I had to add that rule clarifying that interaction.

 

Strength of Tradition: should be re-roll 1s for consistency with other such abilities and is almost too restrictive.

I made it 2s so that the Canoness and Palatine auras aren't redundant with it. I think as-is it's not too restrictive since between it and a canoness you get to re-roll all hit rolls (might be overpowered actually)

 

Skimming because too much to read while at work but On Wings of Vengeance might be too strong simply because it lets you ignore max range on your inferno pistols AND lets you fire them as if they were in half range, even at 2CP.

Agreed, I'll change it to 3 CP. I was thinking that with the beta rules DS Seraphim are hardly optimal, so this would be a boon to players who choose to do that.

 

Imagifiers: are heavily stepping on the feet of the Dialogous my modifying Leadership.

Yes, I'm not especially happy with the implementation of the Diologus and Laud Hailers. I wanted to keep the + to allies and - to enemies from C:WH but it's almost irrelevant with Simulacrums and similar rules. I'll need to think on an alternative.

 

Marine Rhinos don't have self repair, so why do ours?

Really? Both SM and Sisters rhinos had self-repair in the Index, did the Marine Codex remove the rule? If so I will remove it from this codex.

replies in gold above

 

Changes made:

The Emperor's Deliverance AoF changed to +3 bonus on deny in next enemy Psychic phase (from auto-deny).

Holy Fusillade AoF changed to Overwatch on 5+ (from 4+).

On Wings of Vengance Stratagem increased to 3CP (from 2).

 

Things to look at:

OML Saint's Legacy Ability

Diologus and Laud Hailers relevance

Rhino Self-Repair Ability

 

Link in OP updated

[taikishi]

* Self-repair: I checked. It's there, just never seen it before. Also somehow when I first read it on your document, my eyes read "d3 wounds" otherwise it wouldn't have registered with me at all. Sorry about that.

 

* Why I disagree with what you did with Imagifiers is covered later -- they're stepping on the feet of the Dialogus. If anything, AoF on a 2+ might be a better fit given what they used to do with the Similacrum Imperialis (though it might also be OP). That or let them be a 4+ like they are now but work like Lieutenants in a Marine army (units of 0-2 that act independently for one choice.)

 

* Martyrdom: at this point the CP for an AoF has much more to do with flow of game and how most abilities that interrupt the flow of the game is a unique ability.

 

* Comparing your AoF rules to 7E psychics: those weren't complicated, especially as someone who played 40K going all the way back to 2E and Fantasy going back to 4E.

 

It's also confusing because, at a glance, someone can see AoF(2) and think the unit gets two AoF in a turn. Scaling based off of total army points spend on units with the Acts of Faith would be a better idea; it still lets people splash Sisters for 1-2 AoF a turn and lets dedicated Sisters armies or armies that are majority Sisters take more.

 

* Strength in Tradition is a different Grim Resolve and it also makes the auras slightly redundant. One just requires a friendly non-Character Infantry unit within 6", the other requires you to not move.

 

* Stoic Valor might as well be Ultramarines/Mordian trait for Ld (+1 Ld and another perk), it's honestly better than "re-rolling a 5+".

 

* Dutiful Cadence either needs an additional requirement or changed (probably both). All of the other Overwatch doctrines/chapter tactics/etc that I can find have a requirement like "not moving" (Grim Resolve) and still only let you re-roll 1s OR it's an ability that gives you +1 to-hit on Overwatch

 

* Fiery Heart might be too weak but that's fine to an extent.

 

* It may be flavorful but Eternal Penance screams "trap, do not take" to me.

 

* Furious Assault could just be re-roll failed charges, though I personally like +2" because of how stupidly re-rolls work this edition. Might need a name change, though, because I think Furious Assault is the name of another CT-like ability. Not 100% sure

[Purifying Tempest]

A lot of things in there were a bit more complicated than most things I've seen in 8th edition.  I think 8th allows the fanbase to embrace simplicity.  Warlord Traits, Order Traits, Acts of Faith... make them all simple.  Keep the pace of the game up by making the "out of the ordinary" things easier to parse through during the game.  Acts of Faith, as written, a very strong, very flavorful, very unique, and very simple.  I honestly think the Acts of Faith are pretty good as is.  Keep them hard to attain.  To get an Act, currently, you need a 2+, very reliable.  You can bring a pillar of faith (a freaking Living Saint who makes basically exudes purity and miracles are almost mundane) for 200 points.  Other than that... you get iffy returns... you could say fate is fickle, and these girls can bend it a little with the power of their will (faith).

 

If you want to add flavor to Acts of Faith, add a couple of Stratagems that improve them.  "Grace of the Emperor (1 CP): Use this stratagem when a unit would perform an Act of Faith.  The unit does not perform a normal Act of Faith, but gains a 3+ Shield of Faith save until the beginning of your next turn instead."

 

And even add ways to perform Acts for CP, "Blood of Martyrs (3 CP): Use this stratagem when your Army would normally perform Acts of Faith.  Select a unit, that unit can immediately perform an Act of Faith if it could normally perform them."

 

Add a relic to add +1 to the d6 roll to see if an Imagifier grants an extra AoF.

 

Use clever placement of Stratagems, Relics, and traits to increase an army's access to faith-based powers instead of a system that seems to linearly scale based on points.  Some orders may be more pious than others (I know, blasphemous, right?  They're all paragons of piety!), some more be more militant.  Try to find very simple ways to do these.  Like maybe an entire Order is devoted to faith, thus all their Imagifier's get +1 to that roll.  Very narrow trait, but very powerful that can shape an army.  Another Order trait that rerolls failed charges, or grants +1 attack when they assault, are assaulted, or heroically intervene.

 

The going trend in the codex seems to be VERY simple dataslates, recognizable weapon profiles, the same old blah just copied and pasted into your codex... with a host of flavor from traits, stratagems, and relics to add personality.  And for me, that approach works.  I don't have to memorize a ton of stipulations, profiles, or stuff, instead I have to memorize things that affect the army as a whole... or stratagems that I know my army is tailored to use.

 

I do like the effort, it is a pretty good work   But I also felt the need to say: embrace simplicity!

 

Edit: found a redundant word and purified it with fire...

[Montford]

I agree with Purifying Tempest. If we were using a previous edition of WH40K this homebrew would fit much better. In 8th this has far too many special rules. And as I am having far more fun in 8th edition than I have ever had since I first bought GW minis in '92 I think the guys that brought us 8th ed are definitely on to something.

[dracpanzer]

I also like Purifying Tempests idea that we should be able to buy additional AoF with CP but still get them through Celestine, Imagifers, and being Sisters. Though I still prefer +1 per detachment in a 2+ rather than just the entire army.

[Servant of Dante]

Thanks for the replies everyone :D

* Self-repair: I checked. It's there, just never seen it before. Also somehow when I first read it on your document, my eyes read "d3 wounds" otherwise it wouldn't have registered with me at all. Sorry about that.

 

* Why I disagree with what you did with Imagifiers is covered later -- they're stepping on the feet of the Dialogus. If anything, AoF on a 2+ might be a better fit given what they used to do with the Similacrum Imperialis (though it might also be OP). That or let them be a 4+ like they are now but work like Lieutenants in a Marine army (units of 0-2 that act independently for one choice.)

I'd rather change the Diologus than the Imagifier to fix that issue.

 

* Martyrdom: at this point the CP for an AoF has much more to do with flow of game and how most abilities that interrupt the flow of the game is a unique ability.

 

* Comparing your AoF rules to 7E psychics: those weren't complicated, especially as someone who played 40K going all the way back to 2E and Fantasy going back to 4E.

I disagree that counting up the numbers and dividing by 5 once, then picking that many units each turn is any more complicated than adding up warp charges each turn then spending them on various powers. Even if it is, I really like the system here, a simple AoF system isn't compelling to me, so for me homebrew codex I will use a more complex system.

 

It's also confusing because, at a glance, someone can see AoF(2) and think the unit gets two AoF in a turn. Scaling based off of total army points spend on units with the Acts of Faith would be a better idea; it still lets people splash Sisters for 1-2 AoF a turn and lets dedicated Sisters armies or armies that are majority Sisters take more.

You could also read FnP(5+) in 7E and assume that it meant it ignored any wounds in excess of 4, but in both cases a simple reading of the rule in question will tell you that this is not the case. Honestly, I'm not overly worried if splashing Sisters isn't viable. The more flexible system I'm using adds a lot to the codex, I think, and I have no interest in removing it. I'm not saying you're wrong, you're probably right. Just that in this case that's not how I want AoFs to play.

 

* Strength in Tradition is a different Grim Resolve and it also makes the auras slightly redundant. One just requires a friendly non-Character Infantry unit within 6", the other requires you to not move.

It doesn't overlap with any auras, it re-rolls 2s, the auras re-roll 1s. 

 

* Stoic Valor might as well be Ultramarines/Mordian trait for Ld (+1 Ld and another perk), it's honestly better than "re-rolling a 5+".

That is something to look at.

 

* Dutiful Cadence either needs an additional requirement or changed (probably both). All of the other Overwatch doctrines/chapter tactics/etc that I can find have a requirement like "not moving" (Grim Resolve) and still only let you re-roll 1s OR it's an ability that gives you +1 to-hit on Overwatch

a +1 to hit is the same effect as hitting on a 5+, but I can change it to a +1 on Overwatch if you think it would read better for some reason.

 

* Fiery Heart might be too weak but that's fine to an extent.

 

* It may be flavorful but Eternal Penance screams "trap, do not take" to me.

I struggled to find something flavorful for OVH. I'd be willing to change it, but only if I can find a suitable replacement. The Saint's Legacy Abilities don't have to be powerful.

 

* Furious Assault could just be re-roll failed charges, though I personally like +2" because of how stupidly re-rolls work this edition. Might need a name change, though, because I think Furious Assault is the name of another CT-like ability. Not 100% sure

Hum. Thanks for pointing that out.

Replies above again :D

 

 

~snip~

I think you raise a lot of good points about Acts of Faith, however, I find the current system bland and uninteresting. I also wanted a unique AoF for each order, so I needed them to be more flexible than "do a whole third of your turn for free." I agree simplicity is the order of 8E, and if I were hoping to get this used by people widely I'd simplify things. As it stands, I'm writing primarily for myself, and this is the level of complexity I want, so it's what I'm going with.

 

 

I agree with Purifying Tempest. If we were using a previous edition of WH40K this homebrew would fit much better. In 8th this has far too many special rules. And as I am having far more fun in 8th edition than I have ever had since I first bought GW minis in '92 I think the guys that brought us 8th ed are definitely on to something.

 

I also like Purifying Tempests idea that we should be able to buy additional AoF with CP but still get them through Celestine, Imagifers, and being Sisters. Though I still prefer +1 per detachment in a 2+ rather than just the entire army.

I'll just add that I agree with all of you, but I just wasn't interested in writing that kind of codex. A more simple codex may well be more fun to play, but this is what I wanted to write :D

 

To be clear, it's not like I'm discarding ideas out of hand, but I also don't want to lose what made this codex compelling to write for me in the name of fitting in with the official codices, especially with the confirmation we have of an official codex coming next year.

[Purifying Tempest]

Thanks for the replies everyone

 

To be clear, it's not like I'm discarding ideas out of hand, but I also don't want to lose what made this codex compelling to write for me in the name of fitting in with the official codices, especially with the confirmation we have of an official codex coming next year.

 

I'll believe it when they produce a book, hehe.  Just kidding... but playing on the skepticism that is rampant in the Sororitas community when GW promises them something.

 

If the rules are for you in fun games with friends, go for it :)  Like I said, it looks good.  I just read through it and found myself "tuning out" at points and skipping stuff because it was a long read or wordy or just... complex :)  Probably a lot easier for you to not have that problem with your own work!  So long as your club doesn't get bogged down by interpretations or references, too.  I think that drains a lot of fun out of the game, and was probably a big part of the 7th edition debacle.

[Servant of Dante]

Ah, and if you’re referring to Helena and Praxedes in particular, they are wordy because I was porting their 2nd edition rules in excruciating detail over to 8th :P (same with the 3 Priest named characters but they were less wordy)

 

I certainly want to play the game right, and if there’s a rule in my codex that’s unclear I certainly want to make it clear (but not necessarily change the functionality, though I will do some of that for balance and so on).

 

I also don’t want people to think I don’t want to improve what I’ve written, I just accept that what I think is more fun in a Codex isn’t necessarily what others think is more fun in a Codex in terms of complexity or jenky little rules. Since this is a homebrew, I take the liberty of leaning toward what I find fun, interesting and flavorful, while still maintaining balance and overall support for the faction.

[taikishi]

I'm getting ready for bed, but I want to address this one point now while it's fresh in my mind.

 

 

* Strength in Tradition is a different Grim Resolve and it also makes the auras slightly redundant. One just requires a friendly non-Character Infantry unit within 6", the other requires you to not move.

It doesn't overlap with any auras, it re-rolls 2s, the auras re-roll 1s. 

 

 

That's actually the point I'm making. Grim resolve and Captain/Chapter Master auras overlap. Other "re-roll 1s" chapter tactics/regiment doctrines/whatever also overlap. The consistent thing is for it to re-roll 1s. But then again, the Canoness re-roll 1s would apply to your Exorcists/Repressors/Rhinos if they're within 6" of her (and she's actually on the table, not embarked in a transport). This ldoesn't based on your (clearly intentional) wording. It also means your canoness can be off fighting elsewhere and the squad still gets to re-roll 1s as long as there's a friendly non-Character infantry unit within 6".

[taikishi]

One other thing to keep in mind: 1s always fail, 2s don't always fail even though the only units you have that hit on a 2+ aren't eligible.

 

If I can make a suggestion if you really don't want overlap: have the Order ability give +1 to hit in the shooting phase while within 6" of a friendly Infantry unit that isn't a Character. Still means if you're within 6" of a Canoness you re-roll 1s and can also act as a counter against some of those -1 to-hit armies/units.

[Servant of Dante]

I like that idea :D

[synthaside]

I like most of what you have done here, but I must admit I cringe when I see las weapons ... in a sisters army ,  I would much rather see novice sisters with auto guns rather than Las-guns otherwise we are basically talking female Guardsmen with shield of faith .  My suggestion perhaps issue them with bolt pistols or maybe shotguns, (they aren't trusted with their holy Bolt gun until they become full sisters)  plus its a really interesting dichotomy with them having short range but being impossible to target unless they are the closest unit.

I would like to see a bit more made of the seraphim too ... to me this is a really iconic sisters unit that's always felt a bit lacklustre i'd want like to see them as a bit more of a close operation specialist ... not assault troops so no much better in combat  but giving them something unique which makes them work in close quartes  Eg,  Seraphim with bolt pistols hit their on overwatch at -1 BS or -2BS ( tunable for how balanced this feels)  after all the weapon can be fired in combat  and seraphim jump in close and personal, l they wouldbe expecting to be charged and they would train for it.

[ValourousHeart]

One idea I'm hoping will get revitalized is Holy Rage and the units that used to have it.

Arco Flagellants used to be really fast, moving 6"+D6" per turn and charging when most units only moved 6" and charging.

Same with Repentia and Penitent Engines.

 

Plus Arco Flagellants used to be T5, have power weapons and 4++ inv saves.

 

I remember cocky Nid players losing full squads of Stealers because they didn't know what a unit of Arcos could do.

 

The current rules for them just don't make them scary like they used to be.

[Servant of Dante]

I like most of what you have done here, but I must admit I cringe when I see las weapons ... in a sisters army , I would much rather see novice sisters with auto guns rather than Las-guns otherwise we are basically talking female Guardsmen with shield of faith . My suggestion perhaps issue them with bolt pistols or maybe shotguns, (they aren't trusted with their holy Bolt gun until they become full sisters) plus its a really interesting dichotomy with them having short range but being impossible to target unless they are the closest unit.

 

I would like to see a bit more made of the seraphim too ... to me this is a really iconic sisters unit that's always felt a bit lacklustre i'd want like to see them as a bit more of a close operation specialist ... not assault troops so no much better in combat but giving them something unique which makes them work in close quartes Eg, Seraphim with bolt pistols hit their on overwatch at -1 BS or -2BS ( tunable for how balanced this feels) after all the weapon can be fired in combat and seraphim jump in close and personal, l they wouldbe expecting to be charged and they would train for it.

I’ce already buffed the Seraphim statline to be in line with Celestians, as it should be. They have angelic visage and the Seraphim Superior as an HQ choice now. I like the idea of the penalty to overwatch fired against them, they would cost a point or 2 more then probably but it’s a neat rule.

 

I’ve always loved Seraphim’s models and the fluff but their rules have always been lackluster I agree.

 

As for lasgun novices, they’re the exact same stats as autoguns, and in the Imperium professional military don’t use auto weapons. I could see the change to auto, but I’m not giving them pistols. That would be terrible training for using a bolt gun :P

[Servant of Dante]

One idea I'm hoping will get revitalized is Holy Rage and the units that used to have it.

Arco Flagellants used to be really fast, moving 6"+D6" per turn and charging when most units only moved 6" and charging.

Same with Repentia and Penitent Engines.

 

Plus Arco Flagellants used to be T5, have power weapons and 4++ inv saves.

 

I remember cocky Nid players losing full squads of Stealers because they didn't know what a unit of Arcos could do.

 

The current rules for them just don't make them scary like they used to be.

That was in the Witch Hunters codex (as I’m sure you know). I did look over their rules when writing mine, but I wasn’t sure I could justify T5, with humans being T3 baseline. The extra move would be interesting, maybe I could make their stratagem modal? So instead of just anelgisic overdose the ge one or 2 other options based on what the priest has injected into them any give turn :P note that they already have a stratagem to get 3+ FnP

[ValourousHeart]

 

One idea I'm hoping will get revitalized is Holy Rage and the units that used to have it.

Arco Flagellants used to be really fast, moving 6"+D6" per turn and charging when most units only moved 6" and charging.

Same with Repentia and Penitent Engines.

 

Plus Arco Flagellants used to be T5, have power weapons and 4++ inv saves.

 

I remember cocky Nid players losing full squads of Stealers because they didn't know what a unit of Arcos could do.

 

The current rules for them just don't make them scary like they used to be.

That was in the Witch Hunters codex (as I’m sure you know). I did look over their rules when writing mine, but I wasn’t sure I could justify T5, with humans being T3 baseline. The extra move would be interesting, maybe I could make their stratagem modal? So instead of just anelgisic overdose the ge one or 2 other options based on what the priest has injected into them any give turn note that they already have a stratagem to get 3+ FnP

 

Arco Flagellants according to the fluff are drugged up on stimulants, and the masks are constantly feeding them images to agitate them even more.  Marines get extra wounds just by putting on a little extra armor or extra wounds and toughness just by jumping on a bike.  And there are plenty of examples across other armies where something is slightly tougher even though it is roughly the same size as the army's basic unit.

 

When GW changed Arco's from the Witchhunter version to the next version, they took away the toughness of the model and added strength.  Most other units with some basic weapon didn't get flipped around like that... if they were S4 before, they were S4 afterward.  Arco's, on the other hand, were S4/T5 w/ 4+/4++ and switched to S5/T3  -/FNP.

 

Honestly if you want to playtest it, just take the Arco unit directly from Codex Witchhunters and drop it right into 8th with no changes.  The arcoflail would probably work with a -1 AP and no need for a strength bonus.  I have a feeling that the unit will play well without being OP.

 

On a side note, I want to get away from is having to rely on CP to make armies work the way they are supposed to work according to the fluff.  Imagine your reaction if Space Marines had to spend a CP to use ATSKNF or their chapter tactic, TDA units had to spend a CP in order to Deep Strike, or Librarians had to spend a CP in order to cast a psychic power or dispel one.

 

I've only just started looking at your rules so you may have already addressed the how do we deal with psychic powers issue that my CP complaint is aimed at.

 

As for minor typos I saw on my first glance... The Arco models are currently sold in sets of the 3, and the unit in the index is 3-9 models, where you have it as 2-10.  That was probably a copy paste error because both the Deathcult and the Crusader are sold in sets of 2, and the index has them as 2-10 models.

[Servant of Dante]

I’ll look at moving their rules closer to their Witch Hunters incarnation. They’ll still have a stratagem, since I want all the non-sisters units to have one.

 

When denying using SoF you roll 1d6 and add 1 for every 3 models in the unit. So large units can deny stuff.

 

The Arco unit size was intentional, I don’t care what number they’re sold in they should have the same unit size as the Crusaders and DCA. 3-9 is a terrible size range.