Scribe Posted October 2, 2020 Share Posted October 2, 2020 Yeah, Praetorian. French checks a lot of boxes for me in his work. This one didn't grip me, and so it took a bit but it's just a really solid work I think. I love the windows into the brutality that is the aspirant process. I enjoyed the presentation of both Legions. I am not deeply invested in either, but one of my metrics is 'did this make me look up models' and it was a yes for both. I do have an issue that I believe French being or have had been on the FW team solidified. He is clearly in the 'geneseed makes the marine' camp. He pushes that again here, and even considering his association with FW Black Books, I can't help but assume it's the party line. Legions were crafted for a purpose. Ways and methods were predetermined, even to the point of Terran recruits. Like it or hate it, it is what it is. I love the call out to Old Night stuff. To various aspects of humanity driven to extinction..but have they? Or that within the margins ships come and go, floating through the abyss. I found the central premise of the novel well done. No major issues really. It was fun, it was good, and it was proper in all the right ways. Brother Lunkhead, Roomsky, Ingo Pech and 4 others 7 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5610437 Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerOrders Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) An interesting stance Scribe and one I think we can actually discuss alot about different 40k philosophies by drawing from. GW and BL (along with its multitude of authors) have fluctuated alot on the nature of Gene-Seed over the years and I think that to a degree it is also the conversation about what Astartes themselves are or at least what you want them to be. If we push a little harder there I think the conversation even goes into what aspects of this weird blend of a setting you prefer. Is Gene-Seed just a set of fancy organ implants that make your Sci-Fi Supersoldier? Or is Gene-Seed the set of ritually shaped demigod flesh used to make terrible angels from humans? I think the default answer is sort of both, with the setting starting out firmly in the former and gradually sliding more and more into the latter and people have different reactions to this. I think early 40k and even early 'Space Marines are angels' started out as a sort of joke meant to display how debased humans in 40k are, so deluded that they can't even understand that they are dealing with roided up brainwashed grunts. But overtime they have sort of started becoming something that actually is at the very least a bit practically inhuman and maybe even something that is a bit divine. Its something I actually think a few authors capitalize on very well. Reynolds (ironic given his infamous 'Stormcast v. Astartes comment), French and ADB come to mind as writers that actually do rather tend to make Astartes live up to their hype, they are not something that is really human and it is often to the suffering of human PoVs to make the mistake of thinking they are. For me personally I really do dig this. I like the fact the idea that Astartes have the aesthetics of being the bog-standard space marines of most any Sci-Fi franchise but in truth being these angels/demons that have been cut and molded by a certain golden tyrant to fit the conceptions he wanted for his perfect atheist empire. Its why I like those rare moments in books where you see humans actually break down seeing what Astartes are when the fiction of 'brutes in power armor' breaks down and the horror of what the Emperor unleashed on the galaxy actually come into full realization. I know folks don't much like the Ferrus novel but for me the single most effective case of this is the PoV of that human doctor/general throughout the course of the novel as his comforting misconception of Astartes created by the UM gradually gets shredded by the Iron Hands. Its especially effective to me because he starts the book almost like a parody of a 'Astartes as standard Space Marine' fan, doing armchair diagnosis of their indoctrination and brutish appearance only to gradually realize he was wrong. The culmination at the end when he sees what a full Legion planetary Assault under an angry Primarch looks like and just dismisses the idea that they are anything human during his breakdown really stuck with me. But I think that alot of folks, especially those that are really dug into the sci-fi aspects of the setting as opposed to the fantasy ones, really dislike this direction. Although I do think that there is a certain specter hanging over marines in general due to their favoritism by GW, it tends to make folks perceive anything about them about eight times more negatively as the default (its why I as a player usually hope that the factions I like dont actually get very strong rules, it tends to be asking for folks to form grudges). I don't think its a right or wrong sort of deal, its more about the sort of aesthetics you like (to be a bit tongue-in-cheek, most action movie heroes have a relationship with physics worthy of a greek god, but its treated as run of the mill). Thats a bit of where Gene-Seed falls really, its irksome that it is this weird metaphysical thing if you want something more sci-fi while it does add up if you see it as the flesh of a (lower case) god stitched into a human to symbolize their adoption by said creature. It would actually be a bit interesting to try and measure how each series' cast fall under in this divide actually in their behaviour, abilities and treatment by the author. To give an example, the Consortium always struck me as this really twisted pantheon despite being lead by the supposed arch-atheist of Chaos and the Blood Angels from Haley do feel like, well, angels. Meanwhile, for all of their over-the-top actions, I have always had a hard time buying Kyme's Salamanders as superhuman along the lines of a western comic, much less something divine (ironically Retribution actually succeeded in making the Salamanders feel much more awesome in the classical sense). And the SoH seem to be more or less cursed regardless of writer to feel more like a collective of troubled teenagers than fallen angels (although Horus Rising and ADB's work did do a valiant effort). Edited October 3, 2020 by StrangerOrders Ingo Pech, Kelborn and Roomsky 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5610622 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeLeto69 Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 In my head cannon: The Primarchs are most definitely created to be Arch Angels (to match Greater Daemons) and Astartes are Angels (to match lesser Daemons) so “good daemons if you like! Astartes are neither male or female. They are literally “transhuman” regardless of the gender of original recruit. The geneseed process etc renders it impossible for them to procreate (good lore reasons as could create new species to supplant std humans). They are literally “other” Roomsky and Kelborn 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5610636 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 Its not that I have an issue with it either way, but I remark on it as there was more ambiguity before. I feel FW (and French by association) pushes the genetic link, while others (ADB) push the thematic/training type link. Nature vs Nurture, and all that. Neither are wrong, just different, its less nurture though now though since the Black Books, all imo of course. I read something on the nature of memory a while back, and some experiment showed that its in the cells of some creatures. There is nothing inherently less sci-fi, when we are talking 40K sci-fi, in having the geneseed determine temperment, and tactical preference. My issue (and of course I have one) is just HOW MUCH, they leaned into it. First it was Primarch driven. Then it was Geneseed, because of Primarch. Then it was Primarch, Geneseed, and Home World. Then it was 'Emperor had a plan'. Then it was 'We recruited out of Terra to match the Home World of the Primarch, and the Legion temperment/goal of the Emperor, oh and yeah Geneseed!' I lean more towards Angels of Wrath. Angels of Destruction. They are not angelic. They are crude, brutish, tortured children, forced into bodies that are not meant to exist, and rewired (genetically and mentally) for a singular purpose. They are decidedly male however they are certainly divorced from the modern concept of Human, at least when written how I prefer them. Primarchs as 'Emperors Greater Daemons' and Astartes as Lesser Daemons was an old Warseer debate. Conceptually its ok. It falls down at the Marine level imo. Primarchs are certainly Warp Touched however, if not outright Warp Entities pushed into and grafted to flesh. Roomsky and DukeLeto69 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5610638 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 (edited) Chamberlain quoting Shakespeare (Hamlet) : “What a piece of work is a man. In action, how like an Angel!” Chamberlain’s father: “Well, boy, if he’s an angel he’s sure a murderin’ angel.” The Killer Angels by Michael Shaara ********************* I’ve always thought of the influence on Astartes as multi part. -Genetic (gene seed) -Environmental/Homeworld -Tactical Disciplines -Strategic Doctrines Put that all together and you have the weird flavorful amalgamations we all know and mostly love. Edited October 3, 2020 by Indefragable Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5610975 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fedor Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Anyone finished with Crusade that could do a more thorough review of the lore? Some of the spoilers i've read on here make it sound an interesting take on the Dark Angels, but other stuff elsewhere makes it seem like it's creeping towards the worst of Ward's/GW pushing of the Ultramarines back in the day. It seems there's a straight reversal account of ADB's Savage Weapons fight in it too. Talk about throwing all subtlety of the earlier "we might not have all the facts" unreliable narrator approach right out the window. Roomsky 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeLeto69 Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 @Scribe that “memory in the cells” idea was explored by Frank Herbert for the Dune books. He invented Gholas which are clones that retain the memories of their original primogenitor up to the point the DNA/cells are extracted that get released by a traumatic experience. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkimaskMohawk Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Sounds more like the Selenites than the marines tbh. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611381 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fedor Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 (edited) Ok, i just remembered the Age of Darkness section is a thing and read through the lore thread on Crusade there. Some very interesting posts, though the overall image i ended up with was one of someone coming up with a nice unification wars to heresy arc for the DA, getting the first half of it down on paper, then some suit reading it and going " what the is this son, 90% casualties, falling from grace..overtaken in some aspects by other legions....now look this isn't no Raven Guardians or Iron Warrior Fists where you can just do what you want, these king arthur mother:cussers make us lots of money so you better sort this out. " Outcome...hilarious garbage like the 10 Dark Angels terminators killing hundreds of Sons of Horus thing. Really made me reluctant to get it. Edited October 4, 2020 by Fedor StrangerOrders and Roomsky 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611457 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 @Scribe that “memory in the cells” idea was explored by Frank Herbert for the Dune books. He invented Gholas which are clones that retain the memories of their original primogenitor up to the point the DNA/cells are extracted that get released by a traumatic experience. This was in real life though. I cant remember what the organism was, but it was a simple one that both could respond to pain stimulus, and regenerate. What the scientist found was that they could cut off parts of the organism, they would regrow into a new copy, and still respond to the stimuli as trained. Essentially meaning, memory in this creature was distributed across the cells/neurons. Pretty wild to me, when I considered memory, a brain thing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611543 Share on other sites More sharing options...
byrd9999 Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 @Scribe that “memory in the cells” idea was explored by Frank Herbert for the Dune books. He invented Gholas which are clones that retain the memories of their original primogenitor up to the point the DNA/cells are extracted that get released by a traumatic experience. This was in real life though. I cant remember what the organism was, but it was a simple one that both could respond to pain stimulus, and regenerate. What the scientist found was that they could cut off parts of the organism, they would regrow into a new copy, and still respond to the stimuli as trained. Essentially meaning, memory in this creature was distributed across the cells/neurons. Pretty wild to me, when I considered memory, a brain thing. The planarium flatworm, a fascinating creature :) Scribe, Loquille and Indefragable 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611646 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 (edited) @Scribe that “memory in the cells” idea was explored by Frank Herbert for the Dune books. He invented Gholas which are clones that retain the memories of their original primogenitor up to the point the DNA/cells are extracted that get released by a traumatic experience. This was in real life though. I cant remember what the organism was, but it was a simple one that both could respond to pain stimulus, and regenerate. What the scientist found was that they could cut off parts of the organism, they would regrow into a new copy, and still respond to the stimuli as trained. Essentially meaning, memory in this creature was distributed across the cells/neurons. Pretty wild to me, when I considered memory, a brain thing. The planarium flatworm, a fascinating creature <imagines this knowledge being imparted one late night at the pub and some fellas with more than a few in them deciding to test out the theory on themselves.... > Edited October 5, 2020 by Indefragable Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611957 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Ok, i just remembered the Age of Darkness section is a thing and read through the lore thread on Crusade there. Some very interesting posts, though the overall image i ended up with was one of someone coming up with a nice unification wars to heresy arc for the DA, getting the first half of it down on paper, then some suit reading it and going " what the is this son, 90% casualties, falling from grace..overtaken in some aspects by other legions....now look this isn't no Raven Guardians or Iron Warrior Fists where you can just do what you want, these king arthur mother:cussers make us lots of money so you better sort this out. " Outcome...hilarious garbage like the 10 Dark Angels terminators killing hundreds of Sons of Horus thing. Really made me reluctant to get it. I have a few more Exemplar Battles for the DA and the NL @ Thramas sections to go, otherwise I've finished it. There's definitely a bone (or four) thrown to the DA in it. One could wonder if it's almost a bouquet of roses of sorts to the DA for waiting 10ish years to get their moment in the spotlight. That being said, I can understand kinda sorta what they were aiming for with it: setting up the DA as being perhaps the single most powerful Legion and/or (non Custodian, non AdMech) element in the Imperium...but their personality holds them back. I.e. their pride is so great it lets them do more than anyone else, but also gets them into trouble and/or keeps them far away from anyone else in a bad way. The Lion's own character only increases this. The narrative part of me thinks FW is really priming them for the Fall of Caliban. From a real world perspective, the current HH team (Anuj and Neil) have been patching together what's left of Alan Blighe's notes (like a ghostwriter working off a partially complete manuscript of passed-on author). Hence the....difference....between books 1-6 and then 7, 8, and now 9. I think book 10+ will really show us their ideas and what they can do, come what may. Fedor, Petitioner's City and Taliesin 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611965 Share on other sites More sharing options...
byrd9999 Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Vaults of Obsidian - Blackstone Fortress Anthology I'm a big fan of the Blackstone Fortress setting, and these short stories do a great job of giving character and personality to the miniatures. All the main characters, except psyker Espern Locarno, get a feature, so there is a great variety of p-o-vs: aeldari, drukhari, ratlings, Kroot, human, and even what it's like to be a Negavolt Cultist. None of the stories were bad, and all were fun to read. A special mention for Denny Flowers, one of BL's newer open-window recruits, who wrote a great Drukhari story with a twist, that also re-appears in a later story in the anthology, so props to BL authors & editors if this was intentional. Nick Kyme's ratlings were fun, but the constant gratuitous swearing was a little grating. It seems to be a trait of Nick Kyme's writing, as this also annoyed me about his short in No Good Men. ":cussting saints", "Pissing throne", "Emperor's hairy arse". It got really cringey after a while and reminded me not so much of battle hardened ratlings in the trenches but more a teenager who has discovered using swear words at every opportunity to try to impress his mates. I would have liked more Ambull in Darius Hinks' 'The Beast Inside'. A missed opportunity, but Dayakh Grekh was awesome. And, my favourite, UR-025 was the star of the book. He got two stories, from Guy Haley and Josh Reynolds, (although very similar plots) and a scene-stealing cameo elsewhere. It's probably more fun if you like the board-game, but for me a solid 7/10. Roomsky, Red_Shift and StrangerOrders 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5611983 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roomsky Posted October 10, 2020 Author Share Posted October 10, 2020 The Gav Thorpe Review Special Master of Sanctity and The Unforgiven Reviewing these together because neither works as a standalone. Confession time: I never got more than 50 pages into Ravenwing, nor Purging of Kallidus for that matter. But after a re-read of Angels of Caliban that I quite enjoyed, I wanted to give Thorpe’s other Dark Angels stuff a fair a shot. It was a very strange experience. That said, it generally made sense without that first entry. This is going to sound pretty negative, so bear in mind I considered it a net positive. These books are not well written. The prose is incredibly uneven and ends up being engaging dialogue at its best and Cypher snickered secretively before secreting himself into another room and enjoying his secret stash of Snickers at worst. Flashbacks appear at random, and whole passages are copied and pasted in italics instead of anything interesting being done with them. The plot is bananas, with characters and story beats appearing and disappearing as Thorpe requires them without any consideration of ideas like act structure, or even the idea of a protagonist. The books are a huge mess, so it’s a wonder they still sort of work. Thorpe’s marines are interesting. They’re extremely myopic and often petty; I don’t really believe they’re monastic warriors with hundreds of years of experience, but I absolutely believe they’re hypno-indoctrinated child soldiers thrust into a command structure that’s as opaque as possible. I don’t intend that as a backhanded compliment either, The Imperium is populated by crazy people and these guys are no exception. They’re just a bit off-brand compared to the more modern, stoic space marine work, perhaps it’s an artefact of earlier editions? As is I’m not sure how I feel about it. It’s a trend I have no issue with in his Heresy writing, as marines were almost allowed to be people back then, but I tend toward 40k being less forgiving of such traits. Master of Sanctity is the better of the two. Asmodai and Sapphon act as the protagonists from beginning to end, and they’re both fascinating characters. Telemenus has an interesting journey as a major supporting character, and Astelan is generally utilized well. I’m sure I’d care more about Annael if I’d read Ravenwing, but he barely features here and is a complete non-character. All the mental sparring with Astelan makes for exciting reading and the novel’s big action set piece on the plague planet is really fun; Thorpe makes what I assumed would be trite into something genuinely grotesque. The climax is definitely the weakest part but of course ends with a good hook for the next entry. The Unforgiven is 75% an interesting book. The first quarter is complete ass, alternating between Annael (no character) and Belial (no character) fighting enemies with no character. The 50% in the middle seems like a proper sequel to Master of Sanctity, more mind games and Fallen shenanigans, and Annael actually becomes interesting during his penance. The last quarter is fine due to the subject matter but Thorpe has no talent for writing grand-scale warfare, or if this book were all I had to go on, conclusions. Atop that, Asmodai and Sapphon vanish from the plot part way through, Astelan never reappears (why did you give him a body double if he’s not going to show up again?), Typhus has about a page worth of screen time despite being the primary antagonist, Telemenus’ plotline goes nowhere, and then it’s all wrapped up in a 3 page epilogue. Azrael just drops into the plot and for some reason absorbs the screentime better deserved by the characters we’ve already been following. The events described are all that carried this series’ finale, and it reads like the publisher mistook Thorpe’s first draft for the final product and just published it as is. All that said, the ideas are neat and Thorpe does have some skill at telling a long-form and grand scale story, it just tends to be at the expense of everything else (at this time in his writing). I consider both of these books real page turners despite all their problems, so long as intrigue is the focus. I’ve never been one to get tired of the Fallen angle, and as someone who wants to enjoy the legion it was serviceable enough. 5 or 6 / 10 depending on the day. Probably Dark Angel diehards only. Jain Zar: The Storm of Silence Wow, look at this, a narrative that functions properly. I can see why Thorpe’s Eldar work has fans. There are some awesome ideas on display here, and the distant-past timeframe makes for a very different feel compared to most 40k works. Jain Zar’s journey with Asurmen after the fall is a straightforward adventure plot that is all the same brimming with cool concepts and characters. The plot set further into the future works as well, thanks again to the adventurous tone. My favourite part (besides both examples of an Eldar with several bodies) is by far young Eldrad, who gave me young Thrawn vibes in all the best ways, wrapped in a thick layer of smarm. My issues with this are mostly personal. 1: I dislike that so little effort is made to have the Eldar appear more alien. They largely come across as another empire of humans but with pointy ears, and oftentimes spout human colloquialisms. It’s for the same reason I’ve never been able to get into either Path series, no one seems especially interested in trying to explore a truly alien mindset, held by nigh-immortal beings. 2: I just dislike books who use tabletop characters as the protagonists, as besides the plot armour it generally stymies character development. I would have much preferred a companion of Jain Zar’s to be the POV in the “present” timeline, to contrast the unknowable, eternal force Jain Zar has become compared to her flashbacks with Asurmen. All in all a fun read though, certainly some of the best Eldar POV I’ve read despite my issues. 6.5/10 To Taste Oh and I tried to re-read Corax: Soulforge. It’s astoundingly bad and no one should read it. Bobss, byrd9999, 1ncarnadine and 1 other 4 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5615424 Share on other sites More sharing options...
byrd9999 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Ruinstorm - David Annandale (Horus Heresy Book 46). I feel I need to say it first, but I have generally liked Annandale's writing. Admittedly, I haven't read a huge amount, and most of it is recent, but I enjoyed Damnation of Pythos, far more than I was expecting. But this was boooooring. So dull. For the last 100 pages or so I was begging for it to end. Annandale does psychology well. The bits I enjoy most in his books are where characters are standing around and talking or thinking things through. And it is the same in this book. It can't be easy having three (or 4) Primarchs as the main characters. Previous installments in Imperium Secundus tended to focus on one Primarch, while the others are reduced to stereotypes or supporting characters. But Annandale deserves credit for adding some meat to the bones of what is admittedly a protracted and dull arc within the Heresy. This book also does a good job of bringing together a lot of strands from previous Heresy books, and setting up the 3 (or 4) Primarchs for the final stage of the Heresy. And all this would make a great novella. But where the book suffers is from the battle scenes and warp shenanigans. They are too abstract, too vague, and they go on for too long. I know the warp is abstract, and how can you even possibly write about the impossible? but to be confronted with the warp should be a visceral experience, a punch in the gut, an instant migraine, a living nightmare, and none of that came through in the writing. It was bland and inconsequential, and that's ultimately the root problem with this book, that it is pretty inconsequential. If the best bits of this book were combined with Angels of Caliban, it would be a great End Scene for the Imperium Secundus. But as it is, it was just a chore. It's not a bad book, it just becomes so dull. 5/10 Roomsky and StrangerOrders 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5621042 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roomsky Posted October 23, 2020 Author Share Posted October 23, 2020 I absolutely despised Ruinstorm on a first go. Expectations can be a horrible thing, and I wanted so much for it to be another slow burn introspective book like Pythos. Since then I've revisited it more than once, I think Annandale does a really good job once you know what to expect. In my opinion it gives us the best look at Sanguinius so far, each primarch has an arc with good setup and payoff, and it really does deliver on the introspective element if you can develop a tolerance for Annandale's narrative-through-violence. Also Madail is a good antagonist and ends up being a better nemesis for Sangy than Ka'Bandha. Somehow, I enjoy it the most out of the 4 main Imperium Secundus novels. JH79, StrangerOrders, byrd9999 and 2 others 5 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5621345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
byrd9999 Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 I absolutely despised Ruinstorm on a first go. Expectations can be a horrible thing, and I wanted so much for it to be another slow burn introspective book like Pythos. Since then I've revisited it more than once, I think Annandale does a really good job once you know what to expect. In my opinion it gives us the best look at Sanguinius so far, each primarch has an arc with good setup and payoff, and it really does deliver on the introspective element if you can develop a tolerance for Annandale's narrative-through-violence. Also Madail is a good antagonist and ends up being a better nemesis for Sangy than Ka'Bandha. Somehow, I enjoy it the most out of the 4 main Imperium Secundus novels. Yeah, what Annandale does well, he does very well. This is probably the best look into Sanguinius so far in the Heresy (chronologically speaking). It's the first time in the Imperium Secundus arc where he isn't moping around like a sad emo goth angel, and he actually has some agency. And Annandale does well to tie up elements from Fear to Tread, Pythos and the IS arc in general. Having said that, it's my least favourite book of the IS arc, but each to their own :) Roomsky 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5621443 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Ruinstorm = Apocalypse Now Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5622035 Share on other sites More sharing options...
byrd9999 Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 Ruinstorm = Apocalypse Now I can't see it myself. Care to elaborate? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5622647 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeLeto69 Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 Ruinstorm = Apocalypse Now Actually Firecaste by Peter Fehervari = Apocalypse Now (or more accurately Heart of Darkness) DarkChaplain, Fire Golem, aa.logan and 3 others 6 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5622667 Share on other sites More sharing options...
byrd9999 Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 Ruinstorm = Apocalypse Now Actually Firecaste by Peter Fehervari = Apocalypse Now (or more accurately Heart of Darkness) yes, I got AN/HoD vibes from Fire Caste. The slow progress through a jungle toward an entrenched enemy that you don't understand, and in fact you're not even sure why you're fighting or why you're even there in the first place, all topped off with insane leadership. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5622677 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelborn Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Apocalypse by Josh Reynolds Where to begin? You know, Josh really grew on me for bringing me into AoS, Lukas the Trickster and numerous other great things he has written thus far. Apocalypse wasn't on my schedule at first but after listening to Fulgrim, which I surprisingly (and I say surprisingly as I dislike the ECs so much) enjoyed. Not Fulgrim per se but the themes and deeper thoughts Josh has woven into it. Also those little pre-Primarch snippets were good (I'm usually more of a Pre Primarch Legion fan in terms of some Legions). But back again to Apocalypse. It's part of the "meh to yeah, it was decent" Space Marine Conquest series, which surprisingly lacks a continuation.... It's about Almace, a cardinal prime world of the Ecclisiarchy, with a big secret to hide, at the brink of a Word Bearer invasion. The local defenders are supported by elements of the Imperial Fists, Raven Guard and White Scars. That's basically the crux. Nothing breathtaking, eh? Another bolterporn entry. Well my friend. I was proven wrong. Don't even know where to start. ^^" As much as I distaste the Ecclisiarchy (that's me being not really fond of religion in general), I have to admit that Almace and Aman (if I spelled him correctly) somewhat grew on me, especially the latter. The three very different chapters were really well handed. The White Scars felt like Chris himself had laid his hands on them, the Raven Guard were like Raven Guards are supposed to be (cudos to Richard Reed, who did a phenomenal job here, more to that later on, for giving me some heavy Batman vibes when doing them :D) and the Imperial Fists or rather the overall commander in charge, Calder, was likeable and well written. But where this novel shines, is on the opposite frontline: the Word Bearers. Ho boy, the WB chapters were pure gold. Not only did he reference previous work like the First Heretic or Anthony Reynolds Word Bearers, NO, he created some pretty awesome and deep characters himself. I'm not sure about the spelling, so bare with me but Amagnon is by far my most favorite Word Bearer. He's not a zealot. He's not a fanatic. He's just himself, a commander, who wants to unify the Legion again. One pulling aces which leave his greatest rival speechless. And all the same is he a more humble, yet freethinking one. His quest, which is reaveled in the middle of the book, caught me offguard for sure. Especially when the target of his quest was revealed. I never expected a fresh, new and very different take on a chaos Legion including THAT twist/ revelation in a Conquest novel. Even a "mere" Sargeant develops into a schemer and leader in the end. Truth be told, I haven't read one of them but I expected a newly labeled continuation of the Space Marine Battles series. Josh did create a very good conflict, which didn't felt like bolter porn AT ALL. Only at the end of the novel do we have action scenes, which were a natural conclusion of the building conflict. If you want to give the Conquest series a try: read this one! Great set-up. Good action scenes + void battles. Three different chapters done well. Excellent Word Bearers. (seriously, it renewed my interest in the sons of Lorgar, especially what the revelation might mean for the Imperium and the Legion itself). It's great example of what Josh is capable off, especially when you think about the fact that he somewhat "dislikes" Astartes und was assigned to write it. It's also a great example of what we could have gotten in the future. Sadly that will (please proove me wrong, BL) never happen. And if that's not enough, Richard Reed is the icing on the cake. He's now my favorite narrator and dethroned John Banks (sorry pal). His performance lies within the details. A small giggle here, a harrumphin there, all such little details which I haven't head to that extent in a BL audiobook thus far. Really dragged me in and made it more realistic to me. And he was that good that I sometimes had the impression that he's not the only voice actor here. Those are just my two cents. ;) Rating (novel): 9.5/10 Rating (narrator): 10/10 Ingo Pech, Brother Lunkhead, Dumah and 7 others 10 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5629692 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH79 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Great review Kelborn! I really wanted to enjoy this novel, but it just felt like a meandering mess that really needed extra work and refinement, it's certainly no Helsreach... BUT, given the 4 week turnaround that Reynolds achieved, I'd happily classify this as a literary masterpiece! Out of curiosity what was your take on the WB Dreadnought turned preacher of the God Emperors divinity? His identity wasn't confirmed other than a few titbits such as him being witness to the Word Bearers fall during the Heresy and that he fought to save his Legions soul. I immediately thought that he could only be Nick Kymes, Barthusa Narek... no idea if that was made official or not, BUT given his disappearance from the Heresy following Oldearth, I would love this to be a sign of things to come for that character! Roomsky, Dumah, Kelborn and 1 other 4 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5629787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Listened to the audiobook/drama Red and Black about the Adepta Sororitas, by James Swallow. I think I got this as part of a Humble Bundle deal a few years ago, and had forgotten about it until now. At ~1hr its a wonderful short hop to listen to while doing dishes or such (as I did). As someone just getting into the SoB, I thought it was pretty good overall. I am sure future hindsight will call it "meh," but it was not bad. Just the right about of context and descriptiveness around the SoB themselves, how they function, etc.... The core storyline A world lost to the Imperium for 2000 years is run by "replicants" made by a lost wing of the AdMech; the artificial humans are more human than the humans, especially in their devotion to the god-emperor... ...is ok. It's an interesting idea, but does feel a bit out of place in 40k in general, not due to the concept itself, but rather characters' reactions to it. Something like that would seem to warrant a much bigger response from the Imperium in general, instead of "send one squad of SoB to investigate." But if you see it as a macguffin to propel a short tale of SoB and how they function, it's perfectly serviceable, as is the grimdark conclusion which is just barely unexpected enough from where it's being set up to go that it gets a Pass on a Pass/Fail grading system. In short, going in blind with 0 expectations whatsoever, it's a fun little romp. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/349680-rate-what-you-read-or-the-fight-against-necromancy/page/27/#findComment-5629794 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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