Your Preferred Horus Heresy Reading List/Organisation

[b1soul]

Talking HH full novels only...

 

Which novels would you skip altogether, and of the remainder, what would be your personally preferred reading order? Or perhaps you would separate the novels into groups, e.g. legion-specific sub-series with a reading order within each?

[Scribe]

I..would have to look over a list. It would be 'anything that was a an actual event that mattered' + all of Wraight, some (most?) of French, all of ADB, and A Thousand Sons.

 

Thats my 'short list' I'm not sure what that covers. After that, I regret reading anything Abnett. I would purge it from the records if I could honestly I loathe Prospero Burns and what it added to the setting, but I did enjoy the Ad Mech sections of Know no Fear...but that was a fraction of the book...

[Roomsky]

I'll put some thought into this one. It sort of depends on just how savage you'd want me to be with cutting the fat/questionable quality. Also I haven't read Mcneill's early entries in ages, and I'm skeptical they'll be as good as I remember. I'll start with the most controversial of all opinions and say Horus Rising probably makes the list.

[Scribe]

My 'merciless' list, but I'm not even sure I need the first 3 books its been literally forever since I've read them.

 

1 Horus Rising

2 False Gods

3 Galaxy in Flames

9 Mechanicum

10 Tales of Heresy for After Desh'ea by Matthew Farrer.

12 A Thousand Sons

14 The First Heretic

16 Age of Darkness for Savage Weapons by Aaron Dembski-Bowden. The Last Remembrancer by John French

22 Shadows of Treachery for Prince of Crows by Aaron Dembski-Bowden.

23 Angel Exterminatus

24 Betrayer

28 Scars

29 Vengeful Spirit

36 The Path of Heaven

39 Praetorian of Dorn

41 The Master of Mankind

 

EDIT: Major yikes, thats 16 books. So much wasted ink...

[Vykes]

That's a tough one... really tough.  I guess I'll make a bit of a list based on books I actively remember (some were mind numbing, some I know I read and for one reason or another, totally blanked.  And none of them are compilations which really bloats the list).  And yes, I listened to the audibooks of the first five in the past 2-3 months and still enjoyed them. 

 

Simple Legend

Gold=YES!

White = 'S okay

Cyan = Optional / or definitely not among my favourites.

Red = Battle for the Abyss... seriously, it's its own category.

 

First set, the start of it all and really should be read in order. 

• Horus Rising, False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Flight of the Eisenstein, Fulgrim

Then I tend to just lump some together, you can more or less read these sets in any order though that's more or less my rough grouping.

• First Heretic, Betrayer, Outcast Dead, Mechanicum, Master of Mankind.
• Thousand Sons, Prospero Burns
• Angels Exterminatus
• Deliverance Lost, Corax
• Scars, Path of Heaven
• Battle for the Abyss. 
• Fear to Tred
• Know no Fear, Unremembered Empire, Pharos, The Ruinstorm
• Descent of Angels, Fallen Angels, Angels of Caliban

​Last Set.

• ​​​Legion, Praetorian of Dorn,Slaves to Darkness

 

That's about it.  

I know I read at least the first of the Vulkan books but don't remember it and never got the rest of the series, Nemesis was something I remember I blanked (pun not totally intended), I don't recall getting more than a chapter or two into any of the Knights Errant books I borrowed.  Vengeful Spirit, totally honest here, I remember very little and I have a bad feeling I stopped halfway through.  Wolfsbane I've yet to read. 

 

Post Scriptum: I guess I should explain the separate category for Battle for the Abyss for those lucky sort that haven't read it. This might be a bit of a shock, but it is a massive guilty pleasure. I mean, it's one of my favourite worst books I've ever read in my entire life (I've got an English lit minor, I've read a fair number of awful books). I loath it, I hate so much of it, but oh dear lord does it feel like a typical D&D style book and not 30K, with a

Space tavern, streotypical player character party, I swear it was a D&D game that got turned into a weak paperback novel, then reskinned 30K

But the World Eaters Skraal ... I love him.  He steals every scene he's in, I remember so much of Battle of the Abyss just because of what the World Eaters do that I think I've talked about it more than almost any other single novel with me mates.  They're the only remotely redeeming part of that book, and every time they're 'on screen' they're fabulous.

[Orwell84]

Myself, going from memory and impulse, would render such a list of 'includes' and 'excludes' as follows:

 

Green - loved it and/or has events and characters that actually contribute to the series

Blue - didn't particularly enjoy it but felt it contributed to the overall setting

Yellow - liked it even if its impact was peripheral to the overall series

Purple - some redeeming elements but wouldn't have been missed

Red - felt this one was a waste of Black Library's time, effort and the Emperor's bolt shells

 

Horus Rising, Flight of the Eisenstein, The First Heretic, Prospero Burns, Know No Fear, Betrayer, Unremembered Empire, Scars, The Path of Heaven, Praetorian of Dorn, The Master of Mankind, Wolfsbane, Slaves to Darkness

 

False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Fulgrim, Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons, The Crimson King, Ruinstorm, Old Earth

 

Legion, Nemesis, Deliverance Lost, Vengeful Spirit, Pharos, Angels of Caliban, Corax, Tallarn

 

The Outcast Dead, Fear to Tread, Angel Exterminatus, Vulkan Lives, Deathfire, Garro

 

Descent of Angels, Battle for the Abyss, Fallen Angels, The Damnation of Pythos

 

So, all up, 13 great books out of 39 novels(*), another 8 that were fun to read, and 8 more that at least added to the setting - and only four real duds.

 

*technically, Corax, Garro and Tallarn are anthologies, but I'm treating them as novels for this list.

[DukeLeto69]

Myself, going from memory and impulse, would render such a list of 'includes' and 'excludes' as follows:

 

Green - loved it and/or has events and characters that actually contribute to the series

Blue - didn't particularly enjoy it but felt it contributed to the overall setting

Yellow - liked it even if its impact was peripheral to the overall series

Purple - some redeeming elements but wouldn't have been missed

Red - felt this one was a waste of Black Library's time, effort and the Emperor's bolt shells

 

Horus Rising, Flight of the Eisenstein, The First Heretic, Prospero Burns, Know No Fear, Betrayer, Unremembered Empire, Scars, The Path of Heaven, Praetorian of Dorn, The Master of Mankind, Wolfsbane, Slaves to Darkness

 

False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Fulgrim, Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons, The Crimson King, Ruinstorm, Old Earth

 

Legion, Nemesis, Deliverance Lost, Vengeful Spirit, Pharos, Angels of Caliban, Corax, Tallarn

 

The Outcast Dead, Fear to Tread, Angel Exterminatus, Vulkan Lives, Deathfire, Garro

 

Descent of Angels, Battle for the Abyss, Fallen Angels, The Damnation of Pythos

 

So, all up, 13 great books out of 39 novels(*), another 8 that were fun to read, and 8 more that at least added to the setting - and only four real duds.

 

*technically, Corax, Garro and Tallarn are anthologies, but I'm treating them as novels for this list.

On iPad so not going to do the funky colour thang but pretty much agree with @orwell84 list with a few small changes...

 

Galaxy In Flames, Fulgrim, Mechanicum and Thousand Sons move into green category for me. So too does Angels of Caliban.

 

The Unremembered Empire moves to blue.

 

Angel Exterminatus and Vulkan Lives move to red.

[Manchu warlord]

(Parentheses) means option.

 

Season I:  Horus Rising, False Gods, Fulgrim, Galaxy in Flames, (The Flight of the Eisenstein,) Legion, Mechanicum.

 

Season II:  A Thousnd Sons, (Prospero Burns,) The First Heretic, Know No Fear, Fear to Tread, The Crimson Fist novella.

 

Season III:  (Angel Exterminatus,) Betrayer, Scars, Vengeful Spirit, Praetorian of Dorn, The Path of Heaven.

 

Season IV:  The Crimson King, Wolfsbane, (Weregeld novella) Titandeath , Slaves to Darknes, The Buried Dagger.

 

I honestly think the Imperium Secundus books are skippable, as the events that take place there are, well... unremembered. 

And also, there is the part in Wolfsbane where Sanguinius gives his account on breaching the Ruinstorm, and telling his brothers (and through them, us readers) how he was able to make it to Terra, while Guilliman and the Lion didn't.  It also briefly tells us what their plans are, which we get to see in more detail in Slaves to Darkness, albeit from the opposing POV.

[TheRealMcCagh]

Myself, going from memory and impulse, would render such a list of 'includes' and 'excludes' as follows:

 

Green - loved it and/or has events and characters that actually contribute to the series

Blue - didn't particularly enjoy it but felt it contributed to the overall setting

Yellow - liked it even if its impact was peripheral to the overall series

Purple - some redeeming elements but wouldn't have been missed

Red - felt this one was a waste of Black Library's time, effort and the Emperor's bolt shells

 

Horus Rising, Flight of the Eisenstein, The First Heretic, Prospero Burns, Know No Fear, Betrayer, Unremembered Empire, Scars, The Path of Heaven, Praetorian of Dorn, The Master of Mankind, Wolfsbane, Slaves to Darkness

 

False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Fulgrim, Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons, The Crimson King, Ruinstorm, Old Earth

 

Legion, Nemesis, Deliverance Lost, Vengeful Spirit, Pharos, Angels of Caliban, Corax, Tallarn

 

The Outcast Dead, Fear to Tread, Angel Exterminatus, Vulkan Lives, Deathfire, Garro

 

Descent of Angels, Battle for the Abyss, Fallen Angels, The Damnation of Pythos

 

So, all up, 13 great books out of 39 novels(*), another 8 that were fun to read, and 8 more that at least added to the setting - and only four real duds.

 

*technically, Corax, Garro and Tallarn are anthologies, but I'm treating them as novels for this list.

 

I like this list a lot, but shouldn't Vengeful Spirit be moved to green? Seems like a pretty plot heavy book. I also would probably Vulkan Lives to blue since it gives us Vulkan's story and timeline. Deathfire was pretty forgettable though

[Scribe]

I didnt like Vengeful Spirit much, but I did include it in my list as it has some pretty major moments that are relevant to the actual Heresy.

 

Vulkan Lives, and that whole arc, on the other hand...whats the word I'm looking for. Self Indulgent? Its like if someone created a freaking Chapter, and then wrote them into the setting as if they mattered. Thats what I feel when I look at that whole arc. 

[Orwell84]

 

Myself, going from memory and impulse, would render such a list of 'includes' and 'excludes' as follows:

 

Green - loved it and/or has events and characters that actually contribute to the series

Blue - didn't particularly enjoy it but felt it contributed to the overall setting

Yellow - liked it even if its impact was peripheral to the overall series

Purple - some redeeming elements but wouldn't have been missed

Red - felt this one was a waste of Black Library's time, effort and the Emperor's bolt shells

 

Horus Rising, Flight of the Eisenstein, The First Heretic, Prospero Burns, Know No Fear, Betrayer, Unremembered Empire, Scars, The Path of Heaven, Praetorian of Dorn, The Master of Mankind, Wolfsbane, Slaves to Darkness

 

False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Fulgrim, Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons, The Crimson King, Ruinstorm, Old Earth

 

Legion, Nemesis, Deliverance Lost, Vengeful Spirit, Pharos, Angels of Caliban, Corax, Tallarn

 

The Outcast Dead, Fear to Tread, Angel Exterminatus, Vulkan Lives, Deathfire, Garro

 

Descent of Angels, Battle for the Abyss, Fallen Angels, The Damnation of Pythos

 

So, all up, 13 great books out of 39 novels(*), another 8 that were fun to read, and 8 more that at least added to the setting - and only four real duds.

 

*technically, Corax, Garro and Tallarn are anthologies, but I'm treating them as novels for this list.

 

I like this list a lot, but shouldn't Vengeful Spirit be moved to green? Seems like a pretty plot heavy book. I also would probably Vulkan Lives to blue since it gives us Vulkan's story and timeline. Deathfire was pretty forgettable though

 

 

Actually, in retrospect, I would put Vengeful Spirit into the green. Think I was influenced by the bad press it gets, though I found it a decent read rather than excremental.

 

Vulkan Lives / Old Earth - I suspect this can be chalked up to reader preference. I didn't really enjoy the Salamanders / Vulkan arc; only Numeon's suicidal sacrifice had any emotional impact to rank with the White Scars books, Betrayer, First Heretic and some of French's work. Echoing Scribe's comments above, it does feel a little like it was shoehorned in rather than being significant for its own sake.

[Roomsky]

Once The Buried Dagger drops, I'll probably begin a full series re-read. Much as I love it, I've read most entries only once, and my preferences were much different back when I began compared to where they are now. I've actually re-read the poor books more often than the good ones, to see if I had missed anything. I was pleased to find that some drastically improved on a second go-about (Weregeld, Ruinstorm), while others were not so lucky (Vengeful Spirit). The stuff I feel is tripe will be omitted, obviously.

 

Here's my somewhat modified reading list based on release order. Those entries in bold are ones I consider the best of the best and a must-read, while the others are simply enjoyable: 

 

Crusade's end and Isstvan

Horus Rising, False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Flight of the Eisenstein, Fulgrim

 

Dramatis Personae: Traitors

Legion, Mechanicum, A Thousand Sons, Prospero Burns, The First Heretic

 

Dramatis Personae: Loyalists

Deliverance Lost, Know no Fear, Fear to Tread, The Damnation of Pythos

 

The Age of Darkness

Shadows of Treachery, Angel Exterminatus, Betrayer, Scars, Tallarn

 

Imperium Secundus

The Unremembered Empire, Pharos, Angels of Caliban

 

The Mustering at Terra

Path of Heaven, Praetorian of Dorn, The Master of Mankind, The Crimson King, Ruinstorm

 

Beta-Garmon

Corax, Wolfsbane, Slaves to Darkness

 

Shadows of Treachery is included, because anyone who skips it is doing themselves a tremendous disservice, both in terms of quality and by story beats. Obviously the category headers aren't perfect, but I feel they've each got a nice flow. In regards to the other anthologies, I'll probably have to find a rough chronology for them as well and fit them between categories, I enjoyed almost all of them. Titandeath and The Buried Dagger will likely bookend Slaves to Darkness, but I'll wait for the first pass to decide.

[DukeLeto69]

@roomsky interesting groupings. Some make sense to me but others I am not so sure. Perhaps I am not quite grasping what you are going for?

 

Personally if I was to split thematically or by story arc I would not separate the Shadow Crusade stuff from the Imperium Secundus stuff, so, for example, Battle for the Abyss (urgh) + Betrayer + Know No Fear need to be read back-to-back followed by IS stuff interlaced with Mark of Calth anthology.

[Preliminary Bombardment]

That's a tough one... really tough. I guess I'll make a bit of a list based on books I actively remember (some were mind numbing, some I know I read and for one reason or another, totally blanked. And none of them are compilations which really bloats the list). And yes, I listened to the audibooks of the first five in the past 2-3 months and still enjoyed them.

 

Simple Legend

Gold=YES!

White = 'S okay

Cyan = Optional / or definitely not among my favourites.

Red = Battle for the Abyss... seriously, it's its own category.

 

First set, the start of it all and really should be read in order.

• Horus Rising, False Gods, Galaxy in Flames, Flight of the Eisenstein, Fulgrim

Then I tend to just lump some together, you can more or less read these sets in any order though that's more or less my rough grouping.

• First Heretic, Betrayer, Outcast Dead, Mechanicum, Master of Mankind.
• Thousand Sons, Prospero Burns
• Angels Exterminatus
• Deliverance Lost, Corax
• Scars, Path of Heaven
• Battle for the Abyss.
• Fear to Tred
• Know no Fear, Unremembered Empire, Pharos, The Ruinstorm
• Descent of Angels, Fallen Angels, Angels of Caliban

​Last Set.

• ​​​Legion, Praetorian of Dorn,Slaves to Darkness

That's about it.

I know I read at least the first of the Vulkan books but don't remember it and never got the rest of the series, Nemesis was something I remember I blanked (pun not totally intended), I don't recall getting more than a chapter or two into any of the Knights Errant books I borrowed. Vengeful Spirit, totally honest here, I remember very little and I have a bad feeling I stopped halfway through. Wolfsbane I've yet to read.

 

Post Scriptum: I guess I should explain the separate category for Battle for the Abyss for those lucky sort that haven't read it. This might be a bit of a shock, but it is a massive guilty pleasure. I mean, it's one of my favourite worst books I've ever read in my entire life (I've got an English lit minor, I've read a fair number of awful books). I loath it, I hate so much of it, but oh dear lord does it feel like a typical D&D style book and not 30K, with a

Space tavern, streotypical player character party, I swear it was a D&D game that got turned into a weak paperback novel, then reskinned 30K

But the World Eaters Skraal ... I love him. He steals every scene he's in, I remember so much of Battle of the Abyss just because of what the World Eaters do that I think I've talked about it more than almost any other single novel with me mates. They're the only remotely redeeming part of that book, and every time they're 'on screen' they're fabulous.

What's wrong? Too real for you Ultramarine?!

 

Love Skraal.

[Roomsky]

@roomsky interesting groupings. Some make sense to me but others I am not so sure. Perhaps I am not quite grasping what you are going for?

 

Personally if I was to split thematically or by story arc I would not separate the Shadow Crusade stuff from the Imperium Secundus stuff, so, for example, Battle for the Abyss (urgh) + Betrayer + Know No Fear need to be read back-to-back followed by IS stuff interlaced with Mark of Calth anthology.

 

A fair question. I have no rule for it, but depending on the series I believe its either better to consume in release order, or chronological order, but I normally lean towards the former. I think the Horus Heresy is one such series that is... slanted towards release order. The development of the setting was clearly not planned out in exacting detail beforehand, there are some cases where reading in a chronology wouldn't jive all that well.

 

As for my reluctance to make hard subject groupings, I had considered that, but again, the series was not published in such a way. For example, I think Path of Heaven would lose much of its impact if read back-to-back with Scars. The whole point is that the Vth have been worn down by the war, an out of universe gap serves this much better than immediate adjacency. While they don't all fall into the same exact reasoning, I believe that in all cases the gaps create a greater sense of scope for the macro-narrative.

 

I also like to mix up my authors, their flaws tend to stand out the more you read in a single stretch, which would be the case for making, for example, Mcneill's arcs go back-to-back.

 

Essentially, I'm just trying to correct the issue that Phoebus has raised many times in the past: some things are collected or published far later than they should have been. Tallarn has no business being read in release order, because the individual pieces were published far earlier. While neither of them make the cut for my list, Garro and Vengeful Spirit would get massive rearrangements from release order for this very reason.

[Vykes]

 

SKRAAL SKRAAL SKRAAL!

What's wrong? Too real for you Ultramarine?!

 

Love Skraal.

 

Skaal's only failure is that he's not enough loyalty to the True Emperor of mankind, Horus Lupercal!  When the Warmaster calls, he always calls collect!  (I had to make a line as bad as some of the ones in that blasted bloody book!) 

 

-laughs- I've also started reading Abyss again as part of the intro to rereading the Calth story arc. Lets see if it ages any better in the long slog. 

[Fedor]

Abyss has some really entertaining characters. Skraal, Mhotep a good early look at a 30k Thousand Son and Brynngar was unintentially hilarious most of the time....the scenes where he's drunk in his cabin, mistakenly butchered all the bloodclaws etc Then the big sacrifice at the end where he imagines he's fishing on Fenris. Counter dialled the old King style Space Wolves lore up to 11, and even though he was a ridiculous cliche he's more memorable to me than any SW character since then.

 

I remember the Word Bearers characters getting a lot of criticism for already being too villainous, chaosy and betrayal happy and agreeing, but then everyone else portrayed them like that as well by the Calth timeline so that has probably aged well at least.

 

 

 

Sometimes i wonder if the reception to that book put Counter off the series or actually got him taken off the heresy. He was one BL's biggest, most prolific 40k writers before it with series like the Grey knights and Soul Drinkers then didn't do anything much for a while after it.

[Vykes]

Aye, that's kinda the thing about Abyss isn't it?  Skaal, Mhotep (and as much as I just loath Space Wolves in 30K, thank you oh so much, Wyrdmake.  Though the Wulfen in Raptor were fun) you're right on Brynn, were all quite decent in their own right, but you still have more or less the static storyline which really does the characters a disservice.  I can't tell if that's Counter's fault or if it was just the whole set up that was given being stretched.  

 

Aye, the Word Bearers have this weird duality where they're either shown as they were in First Heretic/Betrayer or in Abyss.  The only one that I can think of that really straddles the line well was the short story The Purge which did a lot of things right for them.  The Word Bearers really do hit that Saturday morning cartoon villain status and get foiled just as easily.  I mean, I'll even take the line in... was it First Heretic, that said it was Lorgar's second purge to get rid of the most eager and self serving members of the legion.   

[Kilofix]

Btw, is there somewhere with an ordered list including the short stories / novella (not within Anthologies). Like a list that correctly sequences the various novella with the main books?

[Roomsky]

Btw, is there somewhere with an ordered list including the short stories / novella (not within Anthologies). Like a list that correctly sequences the various novella with the main books?

 

Have a gander at Tymell's list: https://rateyourmusic.com/list/Tymell/the-horus-heresy-series-a-chronological-reading-guide/1/

 

Pretty easy chronology, if that's how you want to read it.

[DukeLeto69]

 

Btw, is there somewhere with an ordered list including the short stories / novella (not within Anthologies). Like a list that correctly sequences the various novella with the main books?

 

 

Have a gander at Tymell's list: https://rateyourmusic.com/list/Tymell/the-horus-heresy-series-a-chronological-reading-guide/1/

 

Pretty easy chronology, if that's how you want to read it.

Never seen that list before. What an amazing piece of work!

[Roomsky]

This one isn't quite up to date, but is grouped by loose subject as well as chronology: https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4669/39091367535_b5085d46b2_o.jpg