Thunder Hammer caddies

[M.Redbeard]

 

 

 

1. True. I think I mentioned it, but unless you gwt a very good charge it will be hard to completely surround him, because if not surrounded he can still Fall Back and shoot.

 

No, the knight special rule only applies to infantry and swarms. They cannot fall back and shoot from cavalry.

O'd suggest a re-read.

 

From the Codex.

 

"Super-heavy Walker: This model can Fall Back in the movement phase and still shoot and/or charge in the same turn. When this models Falls Back, it can move over enemy INFANTRY and SWARM models, though it must end its move more than 1" from enemy units."

 

The redaction for me is pretty clear. The model may Fall back and shoot from any unit. But it can walk ovwr Infantry amd Swarma, while it can't over Cavalry

My mistake! I had heard it only worked on infantry and swarms. Thanks for the correction.

No problem! Cavalry can still be used to tie them up, I think two squads form.different angle can make a charge where the Knight is unable to walk away, but it requires a bit of strategy and luck.

[rgr_maddog]

I don't think they'll end up killing Knights, but I'm leaning twords adding Wolf Guard Pack Leaders with cheap hammers and shields to Grey Hunter and Claw packs. Could be cheap and plentiful and potential to take advantage of the Lone Wolf stratagem.

[Karhedron]

I don't think they'll end up killing Knights, but I'm leaning twords adding Wolf Guard Pack Leaders with cheap hammers and shields to Grey Hunter and Claw packs. Could be cheap and plentiful and potential to take advantage of the Lone Wolf stratagem.

 

Many small sources of damage can work just as well. Although they may be harder to co-ordinate against a single target, they are also harder for the enemy to wipe out.

 

The idea of a lone survivor bringing down a powerful foe is just so thematic and..... wolfy! :D

[greysquigg]

 

I don't think they'll end up killing Knights, but I'm leaning twords adding Wolf Guard Pack Leaders with cheap hammers and shields to Grey Hunter and Claw packs. Could be cheap and plentiful and potential to take advantage of the Lone Wolf stratagem.

 

Many small sources of damage can work just as well. Although they may be harder to co-ordinate against a single target, they are also harder for the enemy to wipe out.

 

The idea of a lone survivor bringing down a powerful foe is just so thematic and..... wolfy!

 

 

I'll be doing exactly this tomorrow for my game... Because presumably the WGPL still retains the blood claw rules when it is the last man standing? 

 

Keep the WGPL in terminator armour out of LOS and the BC's in LOS. So it only has to take one volley of shooting...

 

3 attacks on the charge and re rolling all fails yes please. Add any of our +1 attack buffs and you're laughing as you're murdering. Also 4 wounds and character key word to boot. I like it a lot!

[Diagramdude]

Yeah I came here to say this, since most lists will need at least three troop squads, I think it's a no-brainer to stick a Wolf Guard Terminator with Thunderhammer/Storm Shield into a bare bones Blood Claws unit for 112 points total. Negates the Headstrong disability and gives you tactical flexbiility to either tank incoming damage onto the storm shield or position the Terminator to be the last survivor and use the stratagem. Now he is a 4W character with 3 attacks on the charge with full rerolls.

 

This tactic turns the troop "tax" into it's own fun and situationally powerful element of the list.

[greysquigg]

Yeah I came here to say this, since most lists will need at least three troop squads, I think it's a no-brainer to stick a Wolf Guard Terminator with Thunderhammer/Storm Shield into a bare bones Blood Claws unit for 112 points total. Negates the Headstrong disability and gives you tactical flexbiility to either tank incoming damage onto the storm shield or position the Terminator to be the last survivor and use the stratagem. Now he is a 4W character with 3 attacks on the charge with full rerolls.

 

This tactic turns the troop "tax" into it's own fun and situationally powerful element of the list.

 

The one that gets me the most excited is the skyclaw PL with the TH SS. The speed it has + the heroic intervene/charge makes it insanely annoying and not trivial to deal with.

[Anarnii]

 

 

Yeah I came here to say this, since most lists will need at least three troop squads, I think it's a no-brainer to stick a Wolf Guard Terminator with Thunderhammer/Storm Shield into a bare bones Blood Claws unit for 112 points total. Negates the Headstrong disability and gives you tactical flexbiility to either tank incoming damage onto the storm shield or position the Terminator to be the last survivor and use the stratagem. Now he is a 4W character with 3 attacks on the charge with full rerolls.

 

This tactic turns the troop "tax" into it's own fun and situationally powerful element of the list.

The one that gets me the most excited is the skyclaw PL with the TH SS. The speed it has + the heroic intervene/charge makes it insanely annoying and not trivial to deal with.

With 3 attacks on the charge before buffs, who doesn’t like a free smash battle leader?

[jerrys]

FWIW, I have a(n incomplete and possibly buggy) simulation that suggests that the most efficient things to damage knights in combat are:

 

Bjorn - kills 104% of his points per turn

Murderfang - 93%

hammer wulfen - 93%

hammer/pistol PA WG - 62%

hammer/pistol jump PA WG - 54%

venerable dreadnought - 49% (he doesn't have the axe, just the stock dreadnought ccw: A4 Sx2 -3 3)

Logan on sled 2-handing - 47%

hammer/shield jump PA WG - 47%

Arjac - 47%

dreadnought - 45% (again the stock dread ccw)

Logan on foot 2-handing - 45%

jump lord with hammer/shield - 42%

hammer/SS TDA WG - 40%

TWC with th/ss - 37%

TW lord with hammer/shield - 37%

skyclaws with fist + wgpl with hammer + wgbl with hammer - 34%

TW wgbl with hammer/shield - 27%

jump wgbl with hammer/shield - 24% (this doesn't immediately appear to be a bug -- apparently the wolf attacks are worth the cost on the 3A battle leader)

 

And at optimal shooting range:

lascannon long fangs x6 - 39%

lascannon long fangs x5 - 36%

stormwolf with twin multi-meltas - 28%

krak missile long fangs x6 - 27%

stormwolf with twin heavy bolters - 22%

land raider - 18%

10 GHs with wgpl, 2 meltas and a combi-melta - 15%

land raider crusader (with multimelta) - 9%

vindicator - 7%

lascannon razorback - 6%

 

Those numbers are assuming the knight isn't fighting back.

If the knight is fighting back, it depends on the unit size and everything, but it seems that the only units who can reliably take him out solo are:

the hammer wulfen (win 99% in an avg of 1.9 turns)

bjorn (66%, 1.7 turns)

 

These answers might change as you stack additional overlapping auras, gang up with multiple units, step out of combat and shoot, etc.

 

I guess the useful summary is: you're mostly right, but don't forget about your heroes and your long fangs (and storm wolf)!

(And maybe those wolf cav are not so good. Though yes, this neglects the speed/transport consideration.)

[rgr_maddog]

Agreed greysquigg, I ordered a few more jump packs today!

[thymidine]

I'm so happy that Bjorn is a beast this edition.