Dual Ravens - gunships/transports or both?

[Paulochromis]

Points & troops means I'm now looking to use my Ravens as out-and-out gunboats, supporting on the board screened jump-pack HQ/elites choices.

Just curious as to whether boatloads of librarian-led sternguard or even devastators is worth considering.

Am eschewing Primaris (don't own any) and Terminators (they're all in my DA army) for now.

[Ornithologist]

I can't seem to afford to put more than one (or Zero!) in any list im running right now. 

 

But I have always had the best experiences with them in 8th as Gunboats.

[Indefragable]

Using them as both gunboats and transports is viable....just as long as you don't do both at the exact same time.....if that makes any sense.

 

I am in almost the opposite corner as @Ornithologist at the moment, where I find it hard not to take a Stormraven in almost every list. 

 

Yes, they are pricey, but there's a few reasons I find a SR hard to pass up:

 

A. Distraction Carnifex. It's a big scary plane. Enough said.

B. +3" disembark movement. All the sweeter for a faction that loves its jump packs...

C. Ignores Terrain...because it has Fly. It will never be tarpitted (unless D below)

D. It can Hover. Should it miraculously survive past Turn 2 somehow, you can move it 70 (!!) inches across the board and then plop it down in Hover on an OBJ later.

E. Power of the Machine Spirit. Enough said.

F. -1 To Hit....which as we all know, makes things much more survivable. When that thing is a T7 14W 3+ beast that is scary, it is so much sweeter. Refer back to A above

 

 

...and that's not even discussing the Transport capability!

 

So what I mean by "not both at the same time" is that if you're not planning to have your SR shot to pieces in Turn 1 and 2, then its your first time putting one on the table. It will draw fire, it's just a matter of where in your opponent's targeting queue it ranks. He will either want to blast it apart to get rid of its guns or to hamstring the cargo inside. If you give it big scary guns AND put big scary units inside, then he will target it first and since it's 8th edition, he will find a way to have it dead by his second Shooting turn.

 

So have a plan for it and viciously execute said plan as early as possible.

 

3 main ways to equip a SR, in my opinion:

 

1. Dakka boat: twin heavy bolter, twin assault cannons, 2x hurricane bolters

The beauty of this build is that it is an excellent bully unit. Going all guns means it is amazing for wiping out enemy infantry units anywhere on the board. It has the maneuverability to get wherever you want it to and the firepower to put a hurt on any infantry unit. Your missiles are basically free spits in the eye of your opponent's tanks. It is one of the cheaper SR builds, especially considering what you get for it (6x S5 AP-1 D:1 + 12x S6 AP-1 D:1 + Rapid Fire 12 S4 AP0 D:1 + 72" S8 AP-3 D;3). This has been one of my go-to units of late for its ability to murderize any infantry and draw so much fire from the opponent, opening up other units to slip in.

 

2. Tank hunter: Typhoon missile launcher, twin lascannon

Keep it back, preferably at the periphery of its 48" weapon range. Enjoy a -1 To Hit tank that ignores terrain while moving.

 

3. All-Purpose: twin multi-melta, twin assault cannon, 2x hurricane bolters

This combines some of the ideas of the two above, opting for 2x AT options (MM + missiles) and 2x dakka options (AC + hurricanes). This one of the more expensive builds, however, and people tend to freak out about MM regardless of their effectiveness. Really goes down hard so you pretty much need to plan it as a suicide unit.

 

 

Now as for the question of bringing TWO Stormravens....well, even an aficionado like myself has to hesitate at the prospect. I like the idea, but I think a solid, all-purpose army in 8th edition just needs a bit more than two big scary flyers the pull ahead. I think there's a Prime number of units to be able to field in a 2000pt game and two Stormravens just eats into that too much to be reliable. I think it's possible if you stuffed a bunch of Scouts in there, but you're still scrimping on other stuff.

[Paulochromis]

Thanks Orni & Indy.

Was planning a Battalion plus Supreme Command, might have to stick to just the Battalion to get enough "also-rans", but scared I won't have enough CP.

Will do some more thinking.

[Ornithologist]

Don't get me wrong, Storm Ravens are my favorite Flyers. I have 2, One with the Bullet set-up that Indefragable has, one with Multi-meltas Lascannons and Hurricane bolters. 

 

I always put the hurricane bolters on it, as they always work for me.

 

Unfortunatly, my current list runs 2 Razor backs - 1 Assautl cannon/one Las , one Twin Lass Dread, one twin las Chaplian Dread as my fire base. I like it because it puts several targets on the table to force people to chose targets. Also, At least one twin las will survive from character protection. 

 

I'd rather do 2 storm ravens, but I haven't had good luck with them competivitly. 

[Panzer]

Well the Stormraven is essentially a slightly less durable Repulsor (-1T -2W with more firepower that, if you decide to, can cross the map in one go, immune to charges from non-FLY units and a native -1 to-hit.

So if lists with Repulsors work then lists with Stormraven work as well. Just make sure you offer your opponent enough targets for his anti-tank so he can't focus everything he has on your single Stormraven. I won't call it Distraction Carnifex since a Distraction Carnifex is a unit that looks more dangerously than it actually is so it draws more attention than it's worth ... the Stormraven actually IS dangerous. ;)

[Karhedron]

Just make sure you offer your opponent enough targets for his anti-tank so he can't focus everything he has on your single Stormraven.

Spot on. This applies to pretty much any big vehicles. A single target can almost always be focussed down by anyone who really want it dead. Very few units are tough enough to take any entire army's firepower.

 

It has been a sad truth for several editions that "balanced" or "mixed" armies struggle competitively. You either need to spam infantry or mech up everything and field as many tough targets as possible.

[tychobi]

BOTH. Storm ravens can fill any role outside of objective capping. To get full utility make your sternguard mobile and take advantage of big movement #s. Charge blocking footsloggers is a mean but effective tactic. I have had some awesome storm raven basilisk/devastator slap fights in back corners of maps shutting down vital fire support. Such a versatile weapon

[CaptainHelion]

I'm torn on Ravens. I feel like the old adage of "One is None, but Two is a Few" really applies. But two Ravens is VERY expensive.