question: Long fangs, Terminator wolfguard

[Guest Triszin]

it states he can replace his power sword with a stormsheild or terminator melee weapon

 

and it states he can replace his storm bolter with a special weapon or a terminator heavy weapon.

 

in the faq, it states that if the wolfgaurd chooses a Cyclone missile launcher, they can then choose to again, replace the storm bolter.

 

however the faq was only related to the wolf guard terminator squad, and thus had restrictions on heavy weapons, while the long fangs didn't.

 

 

 

question:

 

Can a wolf guard terminator in a long fang pack do the following

 

replace the storm bolter for a

- cyclone missile launcher and storm bolter

 

and then replace the storm bolter for a

- Assault cannon

[HvitrValdyr]

2nd edition here we come!

 

Interested to see the responses here.

[TiguriusX]

this is why we cant have nice things...

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

 

question:

 

Can a wolf guard terminator in a long fang pack do the following

 

replace the storm bolter for a

- cyclone missile launcher and storm bolter

 

and then replace the storm bolter for a

- Assault cannon

 

(EDIT: Sorry, just noticed this was a two-part question and not two different questions).

 

I think doing so would be within the letter of the rules, but against the spirit. Seems like it's technically legal right now, but I would bet that it will be clarified and eliminated as a possibility in a future FAQ. Just from a game logic perspective, it doesn't make sense for even a Terminator model to be walking around with two different heavy weapons.

[Jackalwolf]

I wouldn't do so but for me the perfect loadout anyways is hammer, shield and cyclone. Perfect against alpha strike, great at shooting and just imagine what a beast of character if he gets lone wolfed.

[M.Redbeard]

It seems pretty clear the RAI of this.

 

1)Yes it can

 

2)No you can only replace it for a Combi or Melee weapon

[Kallas]

2)No you can only replace it for a Combi or Melee weapon

Why? If you can replace it with Combi/Melee, the same logic applies to the Heavy option.

 

RAI is all well and good, but we do see a similar logic in the regular TDAWG entry. Yes, they're different bullet points (because there are more eligible models in the TDAWG unit vs the single TDAWGPL in the Long Fang unit), but the logic is that the once-replaced Storm Bolter can be repeatedly replaced. Your logic follows that but then caps it with no other precedent that would indicate that kind of exception/limitation; which has no basis in RAI other than pure speculation.

[Quixus]

I think doing so would be within the letter of the rules, but against the spirit. Seems like it's technically legal right now, but I would bet that it will be clarified and eliminated as a possibility in a future FAQ. Just from a game logic perspective, it doesn't make sense for even a Terminator model to be walking around with two different heavy weapons.

I don't see why this is against the spirit of the rules. Scarab Occult Terminators can also have a Hellfyre Missile Rack and a Soulreaper Cannon on the same terminator.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

 

I think doing so would be within the letter of the rules, but against the spirit. Seems like it's technically legal right now, but I would bet that it will be clarified and eliminated as a possibility in a future FAQ. Just from a game logic perspective, it doesn't make sense for even a Terminator model to be walking around with two different heavy weapons.

I don't see why this is against the spirit of the rules. Scarab Occult Terminators can also have a Hellfyre Missile Rack and a Soulreaper Cannon on the same terminator.

 

 

Is the Hellfyre Missile Rack a Terminator Heavy Weapon, though? Everything I see indicates it's the baby brother of missile racks. It doesn't even cost half as much as a Cyclone.

[Kallas]

Is the Hellfyre Missile Rack a Terminator Heavy Weapon, though? Everything I see indicates it's the baby brother of missile racks. It doesn't even cost half as much as a Cyclone.

It's much cheaper because it's only Heavy 2 8/-2/d3 and doesn't have the Frag option. Yes, it's a different weapon; but it's functionally the same sort of weapon. And they don't have the same wargear sections as C:SW, because they are very different forces, not in the least because Scarabs are just dust now. TDAWG have their individualist streak, being Space Wolves, so they have far more options for what wargear they can match.

 

Scarab Occults basically have:

• Inferno Combi Bolter/Soulreaper Cannon/(Whatever their Heavy Flamer variant is called)
• Power Sword
• Optional Hellfyre Missile Rack

TDA WG have:

• Storm Bolter/Assault Cannon/Heavy Flamer; Power Sword/Axe/Maul/Fist; Frost Sword/Axe; Wolf Claw/Lightning Claw; Chainfist; Thunder Hammer
• Storm Shield; Power Sword/Axe/Maul/Fist; Frost Sword/Axe; Wolf Claw/Lightning Claw; Chainfist; Thunder Hammer
• Storm Bolter and Cyclone Missile Launcher (FAQ says can switch this Storm Bolter)

There's much more variety in what Wolf Guard can have over the options available to Scarab Occult Terminators.

 

Anyway, point being:

You can switch a Storm Bolter for a Storm Bolter and Cyclone Missile Launcher; the FAQ says that TDA WG can then switch out the Storm Bolter in that option further. The extrapolation is that TDA WG Pack Leaders, which aren't part of the exact squad mentioned, have functionally very similar wargear options, but they're worded differently because only they can take Terminator options in their squads (ie, they're leading non-TDA squads, so allowing 'any member' to have X weapon would be a little odd, as regular Power Armoured troops don't get access to Assault Cannons; so the same wording as the TDA WG datasheet would create strange loadouts that shouldn't be [and aren't] available).

[CaptainStabby]

The WG TDA Pack Leader entries in those two packs are different units, they have different stat lines.

 

So, there's that, but GW needs to clarify if that response applies to the regular WGTDA UNIT entry, or ANY Wolf Guard in TDA.

 

RAW, in my opinion the answer is probably yes, RAI it feels like an oversight and will get fixed, just like Deathwatch in 7E rocking bolters and shotguns at the same time.

 

The precedent for combi weapon/melee only is literally 2nd edition when GW was like, "no, you cant have 2 heavy weapons on the same model" and continued to allow us the shooty/smashy option in the right hand and thats carried through on every single edition until now with a poorly thought through FAQ response. That's what the fix will be.

 

Also that's like a 100+ point model with 4 toughness and 2 wounds. Have fun I guess?

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

If you do it I recommend magnets in case it gets stomped on later

[M.Redbeard]

The RAI is pretty simple, because if not you could technically stac CML on a single model at infinitum. You replace the SB for SB amd CML, then you replace the new storm bolter for a SB and CML, thrn you replace the SB with a SB amd CML, etc. until you want to. The RAI is pretry obvious for me. There are no models in the Wolf Guard with two Heavy Weapons. And yes the Sacarab Occult can do it, but they cannot have a combiplasma SS with CML. Different units different rules

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

I'm actually not sure the FAQ allows this. The FAQ states:

 

Q: If I replace a Wolf Guard Terminator’s storm bolter with a

cyclone missile launcher and storm bolter from the Terminator

Heavy Weapons list (as per the third bullet point), can I

subsequently replace the new storm bolter with an item from the

Combi-weapons or Terminator Melee Weapons list (as per

the second bullet point)?

A: Yes.

 

The second bullet point does not address swapping in a new heavy weapon at all, simply combi or melee weapon. So I'm not exactly sure this allows what the OP is suggesting.

[Guest Triszin]

I'm actually not sure the FAQ allows this. The FAQ states:

 

Q: If I replace a Wolf Guard Terminator’s storm bolter with a

cyclone missile launcher and storm bolter from the Terminator

Heavy Weapons list (as per the third bullet point), can I

subsequently replace the new storm bolter with an item from the

Combi-weapons or Terminator Melee Weapons list (as per

the second bullet point)?

A: Yes.

 

The second bullet point does not address swapping in a new heavy weapon at all, simply combi or melee weapon. So I'm not exactly sure this allows what the OP is suggesting.

the question arises from, this. Wolfguard terminator squads have a limit on heavy weapons, whereas longfangs dont. 

 

I'm not trying to break the rules, and dont plan on building a dual heavy weapon termi, I just noticed some wording that could be interpreted in this manner.

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

 

 

I'm actually not sure the FAQ allows this. The FAQ states:

 

Q: If I replace a Wolf Guard Terminator’s storm bolter with a

cyclone missile launcher and storm bolter from the Terminator

Heavy Weapons list (as per the third bullet point), can I

subsequently replace the new storm bolter with an item from the

Combi-weapons or Terminator Melee Weapons list (as per

the second bullet point)?

A: Yes.

 

The second bullet point does not address swapping in a new heavy weapon at all, simply combi or melee weapon. So I'm not exactly sure this allows what the OP is suggesting.

the question arises from, this. Wolfguard terminator squads have a limit on heavy weapons, whereas longfangs dont.

 

I'm not trying to break the rules, and dont plan on building a dual heavy weapon termi, I just noticed some wording that could be interpreted in this manner.

This I understand, I just dont see how the FAQ could be interpreted that way as it clearly states the stormbolter could be replaced with a combi or melee weaponafter buying the CML, not could be replaced with a heavy weapon. If you make the leap that you could then replace with a heavy weapon again you are deviating from the question in the FAQ. So while I understand the longfang tda pack leaders have no specific restriction on number of heavy weapons, I don't understand how this FAQ could be interpreted to allow multiple heavy weapons.

[CaptainStabby]

That's actually a great catch. It does specifically ask about combi weapon/melee and not mention a second heavy swap at all. *highfive*

[PeteySödes]

This is why we cant have nice things.

[CaptainStabby]

This is why we cant have nice things.

 

We can have nice things. Combi Weapons and Melee weapons are CLEARLY nice things.

[Knightsword]

Being able to use the Lone Wolf stratagem on a WGPL in TDA with a CML, TH and SS is a very amusing idea (even if the model would cost 97 points)

[PeteySödes]

Being able to use the Lone Wolf stratagem on a WGPL in TDA with a CML, TH and SS is a very amusing idea (even if the model would cost 97 points)

 

I dropped the SS in the leader to save points for that reason. A character in the back with full rerolls with a cyclone is awesome. No more tanking duty for him.

[One Two Wolf]

I'm finishing two LF squads and am trying to find a pic someone put up of theirs, dark weapons, no colour on the plasma, which was inspiring. If anyone remembers this (last few month), please direct me there!

 

And the TDA WG are getting cyclones, just to reduce the off topic nature, sorry.