Wolf Guard Pack Leaders - How much Bark for your Buck?

[Karhedron]

I am currently looking at my Troop choices as I would like to switch to running a double-Battalion list. With all those juicy stratagems available to us, the CPs from my old single Battalion list tend to run out too soon. If I want to run more Troops, I need to cut back elsewhere and this has led me to rethink my WGPLs.

 

My Grey Hunters are the mainstay of my army and I don't plan to change this but I might change how I field them. Currently I tend to run 3 packs as follows.

 

2 x 5 Hunters with melta gun, Banner and a power axe on the Pack Leader. WGBL with combi-melta and power fist. Asscannon Razorback.

 

9 Hunters with 2 plasma guns, Pack leader with power sword and plasma pistol, WGPL with TDA, combi-plas and frost axe.

 

My WGPLs are pretty tooled-up as you can see and I am struggling to decide if they are worth the points. They weigh in around 50 points each meaning that if I dropped them, I could almost afford 3 more bare-bones GH squads. The ability to take a combi-weapon to double up the special weapons fire of the squad is nice, as is the addition of a decent melee weapon to the squad's damage output.

 

But I am not sure I get enough mileage out of them. The melta packs tend to spend the first turn or 2 in their Razorbacks until the time is right to jump out. The Plasma squad tends to go for Objectives either in or near my deployment zone. I am trying to decide if I would get a better return with more boys and fewer toys.

 

Having every pack with something to theaten larger targets is nice but I don't use the ability that often. More often the extra melta shot or power fist attacks just add overkill to the squad's current target or are not enough on their own to seriously threaten a large target unless I get very lucky with my rolls.

 

Do I strip out the WGPLs to afford more troops? The TDA pack leader in particular is a lot of points spent for little regular return. The combi-melta dudes at least tend to be more likely ot get into range to use their expensive wargear. I love the flexibility that Hunters have in terms of loadout but I wonder if I am falling into a trap by loading up too many situational upgrades and would do better with more boots on the ground. What do other people think?

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

I would strip the melee weapons off the wgpl,and turn the TDA into a power armor wgpl. I would also strip the banners as I have personally found them to be of minimal use.

 

Another place to find more troops is to make your 10 man plasma 2 5 man plasmas.

 

I forget if you like primaris, but I have found intercessors to be a strong back field holder an they dont nerf a transport.

[PeteySödes]

Yea im with jbickb about stripping the banners. That adds up fast in an MSU style list. Especially since your kitting for both shooting and CC from the looks of it.

 

I def like to keep my WGPLs beefier but i try to double down on whatever I want the squad to do. If its ITC where you can hide them in first level runes for obj then the CC is really good. I also dont sleep on the TDA options either, both visually and tactically its just too awesome :D

[Karhedron]

Good advice on all points. That leads towards 6 troop units looking something like this.

 

5 GH, melta and power axe

5 GH, melta and power axe

5 GH, plasma

5 GH, plasma

5 Intercessors with AGL

5 Intercessors with AGL

 

That is my 6 Troop units covered for just over 500 points. A bit more than I am spending currently but I can probably find some other points to spare elsewhere. I can always add in PA WGPLs to boost the special weapons fire if the points allow. That sounds promising. Any other suggestions?

[PeteySödes]

No I like it! Those Intercessors are great for backfield. If you find the points too you can add the WGPL with combi-X to increase the potency. Power axe is a good choice too since they'll likely be danger close too.

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

I also like it and 500 points isn't too bad. Depending on your hq choices you may be able to fill 2 battalions for around 1000. Sounds decent

[thymidine]

I've run this combo a couple of times and it has been surprisingly good - MSU with a TDA WGPL really makes those little squads annoying to deal with, gives them tons of punch in melee, and turns your army into a scary lone wolf factory.

 

 

5 Grey Hunters, Plasma, THSS WGBL

5 Grey Hunters, Plasma, THSS WGBL

5 Grey Hunters, Plasma, THSS WGBL

5 Grey Hunters, Plasma, THSS WGBL

5 Intercessors

5 Intercessors

 

This unlocks a lot of CP and at aonly 680 points, leaves room for a lot of other threats. The 2+/3++ tank in each squad means that they can shrug off a lot of small arms fire and even things like plasma get a lot less scary.

[Kallas]

Is the Thunder Hammer worth it, for a predominantly tanking model? Would it not be more efficient to go Storm Bolter/Storm Shield?

 

I've not really run many WGPL at all, let alone TDAWGPLs, so genuine question!

[thymidine]

The way I see it, a plasma squad is going to be up in my opponent's face. Giving the WGPL a TH means he's a legitimately scary dude in melee (unlike vanilla Grey Hunters). It also means I don't pay points for a power weapon on the GH pack leader. I've found it to be really good, but it could just be me.

 

He also operates a lot better as a lone wolf with the TH. Rerolling all hits and all wounds with that thing makes the model a nice heat-seeking missile in my opponent's back lines when the rest of the squad is gone. I alternate between using him as a tank and making him the last man standing, depending on what I'm facing. I like that flexibility.

[PeteySödes]

Is the Thunder Hammer worth it, for a predominantly tanking model? Would it not be more efficient to go Storm Bolter/Storm Shield?

 

I've not really run many WGPL at all, let alone TDAWGPLs, so genuine question!

Not if you’re tanking, but if your shooting for lone wolves it’s ace. I stick take the SS/TH but let the squad fall around the leader then spend the CP on the lone wolf.

 

If you just want to tank it’s still valuable to take TDA and the SS but if I was shaving points I’d lose the TH. Most times I’ll take a combi and a SS if he’s tanking.

[Axilleas]

I've also been having fun with msu squads with th/ss WGPL (I also have one with dual wolf claw, just for rule of cool).

 

I had a really successful game with Logan on sled & Arjac (I'm pretty sure the WGPL benefit from their auras, please correct me if I'm wrong). Logan's morale immunity bubble helps guarantee Lonewolf stratagem and Arjac helps make them even more scary in combat, whether or not they are Lonewolves.

 

I've become quite a fan of placing TDA WGPL in my msu squad, even though it eliminates the ability to use a transport.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

I feel that in order for wolf guard pack leaders to feel worth it drop pods would need a sizable point decrease. Because the special weapon premium makes sense with a unit you can reliably alpha strike with.

[PeteySödes]

I feel that in order for wolf guard pack leaders to feel worth it drop pods would need a sizable point decrease. Because the special weapon premium makes sense with a unit you can reliably alpha strike with.

Arming them to the teeth and outflanking is basically this.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

Out flanking is a lot more conditional than a drop pods though. You need them to have something important close to an edge, nothing screening for it, and have to judge if the hunters can handle it. I think you can make it work but I wouldn't set up all your units for it.

[PeteySödes]

Out flanking is a lot more conditional than a drop pods though. You need them to have something important close to an edge, nothing screening for it, and have to judge if the hunters can handle it. I think you can make it work but I wouldn't set up all your units for it.

I’d never advocate overdoing it but I’ll almost always do one at the very least. You force them to move and deploy differently than they likely want which is the name of the game. If they do a good job screening or blocking you out they most likely played pretty reserved and you got yourself a late game obj holder at full str.