Vigilus Detachments

[librisrouge]

 

Related - this article on updated Chapter Approved mentions adjustment of points for at least one Forgeworld Knight - Knight Magaera- not sure if it is related to Cyraxus or not though...

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/12/03/3rd-dec-chapter-approved-matched-playgw-homepage-post-1/

 

It's probably more due to the fact that the points for the Magaera and Styrix were set somewhat proportionate to the 320 points that all the then-existing Questoris Knights started out 8th edition as. With those units dropping to 285, it makes sense for the Magaera to take a haircut as well.

 

That and the magaera was vastly overcosted compared to the styx and other questoris chassis knights even then. I wouldn't be surprised if it dropped a 100ish points or so.

[Emicus]

Will this detachment put fistellans into 'i might take these for a laugh' territory, rather than the firm 'nope' they currently inhabit?

 

What about dakkastellans? Bit of extra shimmy before plonking down worth 2 cp? I'm not convinced.

 

High hopes for kataphron formation or this book will get 2 mechadendrite out of 9 STC and one sad magos

[Tiger9gamer]

I kind of like the Heavy to Assault strat for our dakkabots. It opens up a little more options to our giant robotic friends... and now that I think about it, makes Lucius a little more terrifying...

 

1CP to put a squad of dakkabots into reserve... Turn 2, drop them down. End of Movement, pull Binharic Override to switch them to dakka mode. Shooting phase, pop the Heavy to Assault strat... costs 3CP total, but you essentially have a bomb tucked away safe from turn 1 shooting ready to drop on your opponent at any time.

 

Another thought, if you're willing to keep spending CP and sacrifice some of your shooting, this lets you keep your bots in Aegis mode and still firing at full BS. Again, a lot less shots going down the board, and it costs more CP. But it'll keep them alive longer.

 

The Warlord trait... yeah, I'll just stick with Necromechanic paired up with the Arkhan Land relic. Guaranteed 2 wounds healed with a rerollable chance for 4 wounds every turn, instead of a one-shot 1 to 6 wounds. I'm curious what the relic will be though...

Honestly that may be more worthy than the fisticuff drop others are talking about. Especially considering I only have two fist bots and four dakka bots. You can also figure out where the best line of fire will be / where the heck you the enemy assault is going by then, and plant them out of the way to open fire across the field. Give a dominus the solar flare and teleport behind them freely to get that sweet re-rolls to ones and you have a surprisingly mobile fire base.

 

Then again, I guess if you are devoting so many CP's to deep striking bots, you may as well go big if your going with fist bots. Zap them down to earth and ensure turn 2 is the re-rolling ones to hit, change the protocol to punching mode, increase the charge range and create a wall of hate with your bots... or dont change the protocol, and have these boys tarpit something juicy with 2+ saves. Onagers about to get charged by a bunch of orcs? Sure you would lose some bots in the end but hit them with the charging robots in the rear of the squad and pray to nuffle that T7 and 2+ saves will let you survive for a turn or two while you can prepare your tanks better. Stuff like that may be interesting...

 

Are there not extra rules we get with these detachments, or am I insane? Like, I remember the swift riders are able to charge after retreating as another trait? And, I hope the relics are nice as well...

[DeStinyFiSh]

Well it gives some more flexibility with the Robots, but nothing realy game changing... which is a good thing I guess, I dont like "auto include options".

 

I like the fist bots with Lucius and I like both variants with Graia WLT.

Cybernetica WLT is rubish. Lets hope for a good relic.

 

All in all I think with these formations (especially with a limited amount of units that profit from it) the trick is to keep the balance.

How many bots do you need to make the CPs spent worth it?

How many bots are to much to make your army onesided?

 

(Hope this makes sense, no native english speaker )

[Gaz1858]

Best I can figure for the Bots Stratagem is fistellans with flamers in Graia. You can charge an extra 3 inches, then in your shooting phase flame everything youre in combat with (as theyre now assault weapons) and if you destroy them you can charge again at plus 3 inches

 

Getting them there could be the issue so worth a playtest over Stygies/Lucius. Until Stygies changes ofcourse.

[DeStinyFiSh]

Best I can figure for the Bots Stratagem is fistellans with flamers in Graia. You can charge an extra 3 inches, then in your shooting phase flame everything youre in combat with (as theyre now assault weapons) and if you destroy them you can charge again at plus 3 inches

 

Getting them there could be the issue so worth a playtest over Stygies/Lucius. Until Stygies changes ofcourse.

 

The thing is, you want to change to CC protocol via Stratagem and then you are not allowed to shoot anymore. Guess it depends on the opponent outfront whether you pay CP for Binaric Overide to smash faces with your fists or to fire the flammers in CC. A combination will not be efficient most of the time since fists want to target something else than flamers.

[Emicus]

Best I can figure for the Bots Stratagem is fistellans with flamers in Graia. You can charge an extra 3 inches, then in your shooting phase flame everything youre in combat with (as theyre now assault weapons) and if you destroy them you can charge again at plus 3 inches

 

Getting them there could be the issue so worth a playtest over Stygies/Lucius. Until Stygies changes ofcourse.

Can't shoot assault weapons on melee mate. You're thinking pistols.

 

Assault let's you shoot at -1 to hit after advancing

[Gaz1858]

 

Best I can figure for the Bots Stratagem is fistellans with flamers in Graia. You can charge an extra 3 inches, then in your shooting phase flame everything youre in combat with (as theyre now assault weapons) and if you destroy them you can charge again at plus 3 inches

 

Getting them there could be the issue so worth a playtest over Stygies/Lucius. Until Stygies changes ofcourse.

Can't shoot assault weapons on melee mate. You're thinking pistols.

 

Assault let's you shoot at -1 to hit after advancing

Its the graia warlord trait

[Emicus]

 

 

Best I can figure for the Bots Stratagem is fistellans with flamers in Graia. You can charge an extra 3 inches, then in your shooting phase flame everything youre in combat with (as theyre now assault weapons) and if you destroy them you can charge again at plus 3 inches

 

Getting them there could be the issue so worth a playtest over Stygies/Lucius. Until Stygies changes ofcourse.

Can't shoot assault weapons on melee mate. You're thinking pistols.

 

Assault let's you shoot at -1 to hit after advancing

Its the graia warlord trait

gotcha! Sweet combo

[Tokugawa]

AS GW nerf sty8, they really need to add something new, to not make Mars the only tournament playable forgeworld.

[Tiger9gamer]

You know, I think robots got a stealth buff... Considering how ALL the stealthy tactics got nerfed into cover, and our dakka bots ignores cover... oh boy that makes them even more appealing.

[MajorNese]

You know, I think robots got a stealth buff... Considering how ALL the stealthy tactics got nerfed into cover, and our dakka bots ignores cover... oh boy that makes them even more appealing.

Considering how they usually lose 1/3 of their output against all those -1 armies - this makes them a lot better. No need to take specialist detachments and spend CP on them to get that advantage.

[DeStinyFiSh]

Cybernetica cohort is as we know. Plus a relic that allows Bots to change protocol of within 6 of character. This makes datasmith redundant and potentially binaric overide depending on when the change takes effect. I may use this if the change is immediate otherwise its a bit meh overall

 

Servitor Maniple is breachers/destroyers/servitors/dominus.

Warlord trait is pick a unit of servitors within 6 of dominus and breachers/destroyers also within 6. Breachers/destroyers regain d3 wounds or, if no wounded models a slain model returns with 1 wound. A servitor is killed. So cool! And the returned kataphron can then have wounds repaired by dominus remember

 

The relic is an axe so a bit meh. The stratagems are 1cp to give a unit 5++ before the game so this can be used multiple times. The other is 1cp to give +1 to hit so thats nice to.

 

I can see myself taking a unit of servitors cheap as and then feeding them to a unit of destroyers who have a 5++. Destroyers probably with plasma for +1 to hit negating overheat

 

I am not sure whether I like this Servitor formation.

They should have dumped the regular Servitors or provide proper models for them instead of making rules that are clearly supposed to push the basic Servitors back to the tabletop.

On the other hand I like the idea, really fluffy, and the 5++ strat looks good as well.

The axe deals D3 MWs on a wound roll of 6 if I am correct, don't think you will see it that often.

 

In addition Servitors should not be Elite units but the most dispensable unit available.

[Charlo]

So the Servitor Detachment ability is (if I'm correct):

 

• Pay a CP to get the Keyword
• Get a Warlord trait that lets you heal a Kataphron Unit for D3/ Return a model to life with 1W by removing a little servitor from that unit? Is this once per turn? So you can get double repairs on them?
• Extra CP on a unit to give a 5++
• Extra CP to give BS3+

Not bad, and with the LOGICAL 17 being even cheaper it means we can afford more Trakkies. Pretty good buff to the Cawl Wall - me gusta!

[Gaz1858]

So the Servitor Detachment ability is (if I'm correct):

 

• Pay a CP to get the Keyword
• Get a Warlord trait that lets you heal a Kataphron Unit for D3/ Return a model to life with 1W by removing a little servitor from that unit? Is this once per turn? So you can get double repairs on them?
• Extra CP on a unit to give a 5++
• Extra CP to give BS3+

Not bad, and with the LOGICAL 17 being even cheaper it means we can afford more Trakkies. Pretty good buff to the Cawl Wall - me gusta!

Yes once per turn at end of movement phase. This means if you have lost a model from the unit you can either repair them normally so that theyre all on full wounds THEN regenerate a slain model. Or if already on full wounds you can bring one back to life and then increase his wounds to.

[Vel'Cona]

Not a huge fan of any of these specialist detachments.  There's neat abilities in there but it's not enough to make up for the CP tax IMO.  I'm sure we'll have a few better reports going forward, but my early response is a resounding "meh"

[MajorNese]

Not a huge fan of any of these specialist detachments.  There's neat abilities in there but it's not enough to make up for the CP tax IMO.  I'm sure we'll have a few better reports going forward, but my early response is a resounding "meh"

To be honest, it sounds alright to me. Contrary to 7th edition detachments and formations, this actually costs CP instead of cash and doesn't make the units broken beyond measure. There are still some thematic lists to build with them, but they're not auto-include tournament-grade cheese.

[Xisor]

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

 

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

[DeStinyFiSh]

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

 

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

 

Yeah, Ryza might be pretty cool with a bunch of Plasma Servitors and a few cheap CC Ruststalkers

 

But at the moment I am more leaning towards Lucius and Fist Bots plus a nice castle of Dakka-Bots !

[banis]

 

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

 

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

 

Yeah, Ryza might be pretty cool with a bunch of Plasma Servitors and a few cheap CC Ruststalkers

 

But at the moment I am more leaning towards Lucius and Fist Bots plus a nice castle of Dakka-Bots !

 

The Lucius fisty bots trick cost round 5cp(6 if you need to reroll a dice on charge). I am not sure it is worth it. 

[Tiger9gamer]

 

 

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

 

Yeah, Ryza might be pretty cool with a bunch of Plasma Servitors and a few cheap CC Ruststalkers B)

 

But at the moment I am more leaning towards Lucius and Fist Bots plus a nice castle of Dakka-Bots !

The Lucius fisty bots trick cost round 5cp(6 if you need to reroll a dice on charge). I am not sure it is worth it.

Would it be worth it with a max squad of bots? :D it sounds fun at any rate!

[DeStinyFiSh]

 

 

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

 

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

 

Yeah, Ryza might be pretty cool with a bunch of Plasma Servitors and a few cheap CC Ruststalkers

 

But at the moment I am more leaning towards Lucius and Fist Bots plus a nice castle of Dakka-Bots !

 

The Lucius fisty bots trick cost round 5cp(6 if you need to reroll a dice on charge). I am not sure it is worth it. 

 

 

My idea costs just 3 CP (4 with reroll). A Bloodletter Bomb is more expensive.

1 CP for the Cohort

1 CP for teleporting the Bots

1 CP for +3 charge

 

The Datasmith that is needed for the trick can use the Solar Flare since there is no other Relic that is really needed. This way he can be used to change the floppy disk on a few Dakka Bots turn 1 maybe.

 

Besides that I am leaning toward a Brigade anyway with the lower point costs thanks to CA, so CP should not be an issue.

 

Lets wait for Battlescribe to catch up, then I can see what I come up with. I am to lazy counting things together myself

[Charlo]

 

 

 

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

 

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

 

Yeah, Ryza might be pretty cool with a bunch of Plasma Servitors and a few cheap CC Ruststalkers

 

But at the moment I am more leaning towards Lucius and Fist Bots plus a nice castle of Dakka-Bots !

 

The Lucius fisty bots trick cost round 5cp(6 if you need to reroll a dice on charge). I am not sure it is worth it. 

 

 

My idea costs just 3 CP (4 with reroll). A Bloodletter Bomb is more expensive.

1 CP for the Cohort

1 CP for teleporting the Bots

1 CP for +3 charge

 

The Datasmith that is needed for the trick can use the Solar Flare since there is no other Relic that is really needed. This way he can be used to change the floppy disk on a few Dakka Bots turn 1 maybe.

 

Besides that I am leaning toward a Brigade anyway with the lower point costs thanks to CA, so CP should not be an issue.

 

Lets wait for Battlescribe to catch up, then I can see what I come up with. I am to lazy counting things together myself

 

Protocols are changed at the beginning of the Move Phase and the Teleport from the SF is done at the end, so you can't change protocols in the same turn I'm afraid.

[DeStinyFiSh]

 

 

 

 

I'm looking forward to experimenting with my Fistellans.

 

I think I'm almost entirely sold on my switch from Graia to Ryza too.

 

Yeah, Ryza might be pretty cool with a bunch of Plasma Servitors and a few cheap CC Ruststalkers

 

But at the moment I am more leaning towards Lucius and Fist Bots plus a nice castle of Dakka-Bots !

 

The Lucius fisty bots trick cost round 5cp(6 if you need to reroll a dice on charge). I am not sure it is worth it. 

 

 

My idea costs just 3 CP (4 with reroll). A Bloodletter Bomb is more expensive.

1 CP for the Cohort

1 CP for teleporting the Bots

1 CP for +3 charge

 

The Datasmith that is needed for the trick can use the Solar Flare since there is no other Relic that is really needed. This way he can be used to change the floppy disk on a few Dakka Bots turn 1 maybe.

 

Besides that I am leaning toward a Brigade anyway with the lower point costs thanks to CA, so CP should not be an issue.

 

Lets wait for Battlescribe to catch up, then I can see what I come up with. I am to lazy counting things together myself

 

Protocols are changed at the beginning of the Move Phase and the Teleport from the SF is done at the end, so you can't change protocols in the same turn I'm afraid.

 

 

I don't want to change the protocols for Fist Bots with a Datasmith ever, I want them to shoot before they charge, so I will always use Binaric Override on them.

 

But I need the Smith within 6 of them in the charge phase for the +3 charge range.

[Vel'Cona]

So after a quick peek, I have slightly adjusted my initial reaction to the AdMech Specialist Detachments.  Summarized below:

 

Cybernetica Cohort: Dominus, Enginseers, Datasmiths and Kastelans (oh my!).  The WT is once per battle and still very random, so it's a hard pass for me.  Relic is ok assuming you don't want to take Datasmiths (or just want to expand their range), but since the Datasmith dropped in cost a bit in CA2018 they're not as bad a tax as before.

 

The cash money are the Stratagems, which give your Robots +3" Charge (if within 3" of a Datasmith) and/or make their weapons (read: HPB) Assault instead of Heavy, as long as they're under Aegis Protocol.  The former makes Fistbots much more mobile than before, though they'll still get outpaced by Knights and Bikes (to name a few).  The latter is a bit more interesting as the Robot's biggest issue traditionally is their lack of accuracy if going mobile, and this helps to overcome that.

 

Overall:  B-, not necessary but certainly nicer to get your robots moving a bit better, and if you're investing in 4 or more of them (not units, models) is probably a no-brainer.

 

Servitor Maniple: Dominus, Enginseers, Breachers, Destroyers and Servitors (!).  I'll admit, I didn't read this one well enough on first pass.  The WT allows you to sacrifice a Servitor within 6" of a unit of Kataphrons and your Warlord to heal a Kataphron for D3 wounds or return 1 slain model to the unit with a single wound.  At first this doesn't seem like a big deal until you realize a few things: 1. Servitors just dropped to 4 ppm in CA2018.  2.  Kataphrons are much better thanks to this SD (more on that to follow).  3.  You can stack this with MoM to heal 2D3 wounds on any Kataphron unit(s) per turn OR return a slain Kataphron and heal D3 wounds to it.  Trading a 4 point model to return and (on average dice) heal a Kataphron back to full every turn is nothing to scoff at.  The Relic is melee-based, and therefore doesn't thrill me, so it's probably a pass.

 

Once again, the Stratagems sell this SD.  The first lets you spend a CP to give a unit of Kataphrons 5+ Invul.  This is a pretty nice boost for Destroyers and is certainly appreciated on Breachers too, though probably not to the same extent since they already have a nice 3+ Save.  The second Stratagem is absolute gold: for 1CP, you can add 1 to hit rolls for a unit of Kataphrons within 6" of a Dominus (has to have the same keyword, so no shenanigans).  Note that this doesn't specify melee or shooting, so it's useful for both your Destroyers spamming Plasma or Grav as well as your Torsion Cannon/Hydraulic Claw Breachers.

 

Overall:  B+, this is a very good SD to make Kataphron considerably more interesting than before, and combined with the huge points drops in CA2019 the whole setup feels a bit more in-line with what we'd expect.