Any reason why GW haven’t moved on to dropper bottles yet?

[Axineton]

I had this thought while in the shower earlier and just wondered why they hadn’t moved onto droppers especially with their range of airbrush paints. Obviously their range of texture and dry paints can’t be put into droppers but why not their base, layer and technical paints?

 

I also didn’t know which forum to put this question in so thought the pca would be best.

[Daigo Cannon]

So they are that unique snowflake and sell you custom paint trays like they just did wit their last release 

[Arkhanist]

So they can get away with 12ml pots that don't look so miserly compared to the 17-20ml standard for other companies?

 

Slightly less sarcastically, from yeeeears ago in the fliptop era - when wet palettes were definitely not a thing, a ceramic tile was an 'optional tool' and drybrushing was how you highlighted - it was so novices could paint (far less detailed) models straight from the pot. Thus for many in the 90's/00s 'starter models' looked like they'd been painted with a trowel.*

 

Unlike today, where after a dozen youtube videos people's first models depressingly often look like the best I can do now after a couple of decades.

 

 

_{* You do not want me to retrieve my RTB01 Blood Angels from the loft to prove this - drybrushed with Blood Angel orange on goblin green bases, as was the fashion at the time. Washes? Are they like inks?}

[Kalamadea]

Doesn't make any financial sense for them to do so. They already have the infrastructure to manufacture, bottle, box, ship and display the flip-top bottles. Their paint racks (that the FLGS has to purchase themselves unless they buy over a certain amount of paints upfront) are already built for flip-tops. GW is surely aware that the flip-tops are prone to drying out and therefore replacement more often than droppers. GW COULD switch over, but the amount of gamers that would return to GW paints after switching to 3rd party (if many did, since vallejo and other brands are every bit as good or better) would not offset the costs of re-purposing all that equipment and infrastructure.

 

People will buy the GW paints because they are GW paints, they're official and easy to get ahold of even in independant FLGSs. Anecdotally, when I worked for an FLGS that sold both GW, Reaper and Vallejo paints (including thier GW colormatched series) there were always people that would buy the GW paints anyways because they were GW. You'd point out that Vallejo was larger bottles for less money, but they'd STILL buy the GW. We carried Kneadatite in 3 foot rolls and GW Green Stuff in 8 inch blisters for about the same price, and people would STILL buy the GW Green Stuff even after you pointed out that it was literally the same thing just rebranded with a GW label. GW branded things will always sell simply BECAUSE they're official even if better options are available, and GW banks on that.

[Rik Lightstar]

I suspect they have an X year deal with their current paint supplier, which includes the pot design. Once that expires the following range which has likely already been negotiated will be in a different (hopefully dropper) form factor.

 

Airbrushing has picked up massively in the last few years, it's more accessible, prices have improved and there are loads of tutorials out there.

 

I would put a proper financial bet on GW partnering with a known Airbrush brand and selling them within 5 years.

 

Rik

[Razblood]

Planned obselecence and minmaxing profits.

 

The design of the pots pretty much guarantees that if you don't use the paint in a timely manner it will dry out necessitating you to buy replacements, while at the same time selling less paint for more money.

[Rik Lightstar]

Planned obselecence and minmaxing profits.

 

The design of the pots pretty much guarantees that if you don't use the paint in a timely manner it will dry out necessitating you to buy replacements, while at the same time selling less paint for more money.

That's some next level cynicism there.

 

The GW painting "method" is designed for new painters who haven't even started mixing their paints yet, and this is what the pots are aimed at.

 

Buy your Base, Layer, Shade and Edge. Use them straight from the pot. Get presentable, tabletop ready results quickly and without much struggle.

 

Next level, get a pallete, watch some Duncan videos (two thin coats, recess shading, occasionally mixing colours) and use the products you're familiar with.

 

Beyond this, you're likely shopping at an FLGS and have found other paint ranges. You'll get the ones that suit you.

 

Right now, Flip-top Lids are the right thing for the product they're selling. We just aren't the target market. It's like complaining about the easy to build figures lacking options.

 

Rik

[Wayniac]

I'm pretty sure it's by design so the paint dries faster. There is zero reason why they charge more and give less in most cases than literally every other company's paints.

[Rik Lightstar]

I'm pretty sure it's by design so the paint dries faster. There is zero reason why they charge more and give less in most cases than literally every other company's paints.

You can't use droppers without some form of palette or an airbrush. It's like I gave a detailed and reasoned response to your precise complaint in the post immediately above yours.

 

Rik

[Fajita Fan]

While that was probably part of the initial design of GW's bottles I'm sure part of their reasoning to not moving to dropper bottles is because paint dries out so quickly and needs to be replaced. $$$$$$$$$$$$

 

 

Now to be fair you can absolutely rebottle your paint in dropper bottles, I bought a bunch of these and some plastic beads for agitators but I have yet to actually sit down and do the whole process.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B016B34H2G/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Razblood]

 

Planned obselecence and minmaxing profits.

 

The design of the pots pretty much guarantees that if you don't use the paint in a timely manner it will dry out necessitating you to buy replacements, while at the same time selling less paint for more money.

That's some next level cynicism there.

 

The GW painting "method" is designed for new painters who haven't even started mixing their paints yet, and this is what the pots are aimed at.

 

Buy your Base, Layer, Shade and Edge. Use them straight from the pot. Get presentable, tabletop ready results quickly and without much struggle.

 

Next level, get a pallete, watch some Duncan videos (two thin coats, recess shading, occasionally mixing colours) and use the products you're familiar with.

 

Beyond this, you're likely shopping at an FLGS and have found other paint ranges. You'll get the ones that suit you.

 

Right now, Flip-top Lids are the right thing for the product they're selling. We just aren't the target market. It's like complaining about the easy to build figures lacking options.

 

Rik

I have no problem with fliptop paint pots, old gw and P3 pots are excellent at keeping the paint liquid, unlike the current design.

 

As for cynicism, well if the shoe fits

[Razblood]

While that was probably part of the initial design of GW's bottles I'm sure part of their reasoning to not moving to dropper bottles is because paint dries out so quickly and needs to be replaced. $$$$$$$$$$$$

 

 

Now to be fair you can absolutely rebottle your paint in dropper bottles, I bought a bunch of these and some plastic beads for agitators but I have yet to actually sit down and do the whole process.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B016B34H2G/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

When it comes to transferring I would recommend you add a couple of drops of flowaid/water mix and the agitator you'll be using for that colour to the pot and shaking the hell out of it to get the paint off the sides and bottom, maximize your yield.

[Aarik]

I don't think the explanation is as cynical as some people believe. I think it's just that it's easiest for beginning painters to paint straight out of the flip top pots. And GW's whole paint system is designed to break down the painting process into simple, easy to follow steps (base, wash highlight, etc.), which is complicated a lot by having to use a wet palette.

 

I do agree that the airbrush range should be in dropper bottles. But that would also separate them from the rest of GW's range, which they may not be keen on doing..

[Tyberos the Red Wake]

So they can get away with 12ml pots that don't look so miserly compared to the 17-20ml standard for other companies?

 

Nah, they got those 24 mL spills-waiting-to-happen.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

I mean, it's not like Apple stealth installing apps on older phones to intentionally drain the batteries faster would make anyone cynical enough to think GW would design bottles to dry the paint out faster and force you buy more of their overpriced product. Not at all. 

[Cryptix]

And that's why Androids are superior, but that's besides the point.

[Fajita Fan]

I don't think the explanation is as cynical as some people believe. I think it's just that it's easiest for beginning painters to paint straight out of the flip top pots. And GW's whole paint system is designed to break down the painting process into simple, easy to follow steps (base, wash highlight, etc.), which is complicated a lot by having to use a wet palette.I do agree that the airbrush range should be in dropper bottles. But that would also separate them from the rest of GW's range, which they may not be keen on doing..

Duncan has been recommending a palatte for years so I think the cynical reason is absolutely valid for why they wouldn’t invest in changing their bottles.

[Rik Lightstar]

 

I don't think the explanation is as cynical as some people believe. I think it's just that it's easiest for beginning painters to paint straight out of the flip top pots. And GW's whole paint system is designed to break down the painting process into simple, easy to follow steps (base, wash highlight, etc.), which is complicated a lot by having to use a wet palette.I do agree that the airbrush range should be in dropper bottles. But that would also separate them from the rest of GW's range, which they may not be keen on doing..

Duncan has been recommending a palatte for years so I think the cynical reason is absolutely valid for why they wouldn’t invest in changing their bottles.

And Duncan is stage 2, which is after beginners. Seriously the paint is by far the lowest cost part of the product, after shipping, the pot and the label.

 

Rik

[Imren]

GW chose a flip top pot on the newer lines of paint of recent years (the last line and the ones before with bullet shaped pots beginning of 00's) that provenly dries the paint out faster than the old GW pots (same as present day P3 and Coat d'Arms), so that adds up to the conclusion that they do have a planned obsolescence design so that they have a higher throughput of paint on the market.

 

My bullet shaped GW pots have been all binned since they all dried out, the recent GW pots dries out too, but I still have my 90's GW pots going strong after 20+ years of storage and use. I'm gradually moving over to P3 and a few Coat d'Arms, Vallejo paints seperates way fast on wet palettes although they air ranges are very practical for airbrushing being dropper bottles with almost ready thinned paint, but that is besides the point.

[Arkhanist]

I still have most of my original GW flip tops, i.e. the same pot as P3/foundry/coat d'arms (which I also have some of each). Yes, they stay liquid as long as the lid stays intact - but several of the pots died well before the paint ran out because the lid was compromised. Paint dries around the rim and in the lid seal, the lid sticks and you risk damaging it to lever it off; a lot of mine have lost their little tags when they broke off from fatigue making them harder to open. Plus I get quite often get paint on my hand when I open the fliptop from wet paint on the rim (just had it on a pot of P3 sanguine base, in fact). You can clean out dried paint from the rim and lid of regularly used pots, done that many times, but it's still messy and irritating.

 

The screwtop hex ones were definitely terribad, I think 99% of them have dried out, even ones that didn't get gunked to hell around the thread. The current GW fliptop pots aren't that bad, as long as you ensure you close them at the back - they have a habit of closing at an angle allowing paint to dry near the hinge, which does allow them to dry out. I have some pots from the previous range when they first switched to the current 'bolter' pot and they're still trucking fine. They do open better at the front due to the built in notch.

 

I've had some dropper failures too; some have a looser seal at the top, so you end up with a 'collar' of paint around the nozzle which dries. You can split nozzles from trying to clear blocked nozzles. None fatal to the paint, but I've had to decant or replace the nozzle a couple of times. But overall, they're much easier to get the amount of paint you want.

 

GW do do their own plastic-paper palette now, it's not actually that bad - no idea how it works, but paint definitely stays liquid longer than on my ceramic tile (I prefer to do metallics and drybrushing from a dry palette). So I wish they did dropper bottles, particularly for the air line, but as I said at the beginning of the thread, I can understand why they didn't to assist beginners without a palette. And since GW is the big beast that people will buy just because it's the 'proper paint', a unique pot does make the brand stand out in a FLGS.