Most painful Thousand Son's lesson

[antique_nova]

So, I was competing at the Warhammer World Nottingham GT heat 3 that finished yesterday and my record was. 3W 2L. I lost my first game in Game 2, when I faced off against another TS player who managed to DMC me with his own tzaangor blob into the back line of 6/9 obliterators in his first turn and before my oblits managed to get a single shot off. Mostly because of that, it cost me the game. Otherwise I could won quite comfortably.

 

What's worse however, is that I then left a knight with 4 wounds remaining (after my tzaangor blob failed to kill it in 1 turn from full health after a first turn charge due to a lack of buffs), then ran at Ahriman and 2 sorcerers (one was my warlord) and slapped them back into the warp in one round of fighting. I won that game comfortably, but that mistake make me far more nervous than it should have been.

 

You'd think that after letting my opponent (due to forgetfulness) charge my most important units turn 1 that I'd learn from it right? But no, I repeated pretty much the same mistake the next game! But it didn't cost me the game.

 

However, in my final game, I went in with 3 wins and 1 loss under my beat. I kept my oblits and most of my tzaangors in reserve as eldar would get first turn i predicted and they did. They killed almost everything else with dark reapers and shining spears and since I only had 3 sorcerers left and I had YET to start my turn 1. I had to concede with barely 20 minutes played. It was the quickest and most embarrassing game I've ever played. Am I angry? Heck no, Am I annoyed? Hell yes.

 

Because what i should have done was deployed every unit I had, except one squad of oblits to counter his second dark reaper squad in reserve. I won't go into specifics, but I've now written out a detailed plan now that basically guarantees that I win, regardless of whether I go first or second against that list again or anything similar. Since we talked at depth about counters etc once that game had finished and I know that with my new plan, there is no way that he can counter it. I can only lose is the dice gods are against me.

 

Oh and quite possibly, the hardest lesson to learn was.

 

Trying to suddenly play in a GT, where I'm used to playing small elite armies (like 10x single man units) and then suddenly heading into the opposite direction by playing a super technical army where I had to keep track of 15 units, 4 stratagems and 10 spells EVERY SINGLE TURN. While I pretty much memorised everything, I had never played with said army until the day of the GT. Even for a vet like me, who knows every codex extremely well. Making that sudden switch was incredibly difficult and extremely taxing. I barely got past turn 3 in my first game and barely finished turn 2 in my second game. The other games, I managed to get to turn 5 (except the one where I got tabled ofc). My list had changed, but only by a little, because with the new chapter approved changes and I had more than enough points left over to grab another unit of horrors. So, I did!

 

But now, I've gotten the hang of my army and can play at proper speeds, not super fast though as should be expected from GT winners.

 

So, what's your most painful lesson as a TS player?

[Prot]

I think mine is a simple lesson and it happens to me quite frequently. Often I’ll set up a turn thinking well in advance of all the Psychic things I have to have pass in order to have a successful turn. Quite often I spread it too thin and don’t overlap units and strategies enough to compensate for my typical turn of passing almost no Psychic tests. You’d think I’d learn by now.

 

I’m not sure how you resolve your Eldar issue by deploying more units but it sounds like you have it figured out. It sometimes mds like you had some good games though. Congratulations on the wins.

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

My most painful lesson is realizing, after a 5+ hour game, that this army requires a lot of admin if you're not VERY practised and don't keep good notes.

[antique_nova]

My most painful lesson is realizing, after a 5+ hour game, that this army requires a lot of admin if you're not VERY practised and don't keep good notes.

I'm not sure if I understand what you mean. Do you mean that it requires a lot of paperwork to remember everything? Because I had to keep track of all my notes on 3 pieces of paper simultaneously XD.

 

I think mine is a simple lesson and it happens to me quite frequently. Often I’ll set up a turn thinking well in advance of all the Psychic things I have to have pass in order to have a successful turn. Quite often I spread it too thin and don’t overlap units and strategies enough to compensate for my typical turn of passing almost no Psychic tests. You’d think I’d learn by now.

 

I’m not sure how you resolve your Eldar issue by deploying more units but it sounds like you have it figured out. It sometimes mds like you had some good games though. Congratulations on the wins.

 

Thank you!

 

What do you mean by "mds"?

 

In short, everyone knows that Eldar are a glass cannon army. And since the guy only had rangers, spears and dark reapers. He must hit hard and fast, but if I deploy most of my army on the table. Then there's no way that he can kill enough, before he's wiped out. Especially with the number of units that I'm able to comfortably sacrifice, as he barely managed to just kill to just kill them all. (About 420 pts worth).

 

If he holds back, then he knows that I will pretty much destroy him first turn since I can pretty much reach him anywhere on the board and that he can't afford to hang back. So he must attack, but he doesn't possess anywhere near the amount of destructive potential he needs to wipe out enough of my army, if I deploy like 90% of it on the table. (I deployed barely 40% in our game, which was my mistake, because I had to survive 2 full turns facing 90% of his army, before my reinforcements would turn up) 

 

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

 

My most painful lesson is realizing, after a 5+ hour game, that this army requires a lot of admin if you're not VERY practised and don't keep good notes.

I'm not sure if I understand what you mean. Do you mean that it requires a lot of paperwork to remember everything? Because I had to keep track of all my notes on 3 pieces of paper simultaneously XD.

 

More that you have to constantly re-check and look up so many things if you don't keep your notes up to the minute. :)

[MillionsSons]

What was your list? I’m curious about the oblits, you have a specific Tzeentch non-Thousand Sons detachment?

[antique_nova]

 

 

My most painful lesson is realizing, after a 5+ hour game, that this army requires a lot of admin if you're not VERY practised and don't keep good notes.

I'm not sure if I understand what you mean. Do you mean that it requires a lot of paperwork to remember everything? Because I had to keep track of all my notes on 3 pieces of paper simultaneously XD.

 

More that you have to constantly re-check and look up so many things if you don't keep your notes up to the minute.

 

Haha. I feel that. XD It took me 3 full GT games to start getting the hang of it. Also, I always have trouble remembering what I need to roll to cast what.

[antique_nova]

What was your list? I’m curious about the oblits, you have a specific Tzeentch non-Thousand Sons detachment?

Personally, I'd like to keep it to myself. At least until the warhammer world UK GT is finished for this year, but some have asked me and then bought the list from me. I've also made some slight minor changes since the last GT a few days ago, as I've already seen all the points changes for CA this year by adding some other models. Nothing drastic thank god! My wallet is happy. ^^

 

One reason being that I haven't seen anything like it floating around in the top 10 lists all year round since 8th edition started (as a whole, but parts of it have been used) and because I think that by the time the GT i mentioned if finished, GWS will make enough changes again to the point where I'm no longer convinced that I have the strongest list in the game. (Whether it is or not is up for debate, but I have to be certain that it is and that's what matters to me. :) )

 

But to answer your question, I do not have a specific tzeentch non-TS detachment.

[JimVandy85]

 

 

What was your list? I’m curious about the oblits, you have a specific Tzeentch non-Thousand Sons detachment?

Personally, I'd like to keep it to myself. At least until the warhammer world UK GT is finished for this year, but some have asked me and then bought the list from me. I've also made some slight minor changes since the last GT a few days ago, as I've already seen all the points changes for CA this year by adding some other models. Nothing drastic thank god! My wallet is happy. ^^

 

One reason being that I haven't seen anything like it floating around in the top 10 lists all year round since 8th edition started (as a whole, but parts of it have been used) and because I think that by the time the GT i mentioned if finished, GWS will make enough changes again to the point where I'm no longer convinced that I have the strongest list in the game. (Whether it is or not is up for debate, but I have to be certain that it is and that's what matters to me. :) )

 

But to answer your question, I do not have a specific tzeentch non-TS detachment.

I'm curious about this as well. How are you getting oblits since they are not in the TS dex without having a separate CSM detachment?

[antique_nova]

 

 

What was your list? I’m curious about the oblits, you have a specific Tzeentch non-Thousand Sons detachment?

Personally, I'd like to keep it to myself. At least until the warhammer world UK GT is finished for this year, but some have asked me and then bought the list from me. I've also made some slight minor changes since the last GT a few days ago, as I've already seen all the points changes for CA this year by adding some other models. Nothing drastic thank god! My wallet is happy. ^^

 

One reason being that I haven't seen anything like it floating around in the top 10 lists all year round since 8th edition started (as a whole, but parts of it have been used) and because I think that by the time the GT i mentioned if finished, GWS will make enough changes again to the point where I'm no longer convinced that I have the strongest list in the game. (Whether it is or not is up for debate, but I have to be certain that it is and that's what matters to me. )

 

But to answer your question, I do not have a specific tzeentch non-TS detachment.

I'm curious about this as well. How are you getting oblits since they are not in the TS dex without having a separate CSM detachment?

 

I have a seperate CSM detachment, but not a tzeentch specific one. I thought the question was.

 

Do I have a Tzeentch (specific) non-TS detachment.

 

Was how I read it as I have no tzeentch models in my CSM detachment. I hope that clears things up :)

[Sonoftherubric21]

First lesson: The minute you don't have a Gaze of Fate or CP re-roll for a Perils check....is when Perils will occur. Its a law of nature. 

 

Second lesson: this armies nickname is "spreadsheet" because past 1000 points or so you have so many casters and spells you basically need a spreadsheet to keep track. 

 

Third lesson: I personally use blue beads as a way of keeping track of spell casting. Every psychic phase I put beads equal to the number of spell casts by that caster. Every spell they cast I take away a bead.  This makes keeping track of spell slot usage incredibly easy and quick, you can also see at a glance the number left on the table. I did this because keeping track of 7-10 spellcasters in your head is bordering on impossible. 

[antique_nova]

First lesson: The minute you don't have a Gaze of Fate or CP re-roll for a Perils check....is when Perils will occur. Its a law of nature. 

 

Second lesson: this armies nickname is "spreadsheet" because past 1000 points or so you have so many casters and spells you basically need a spreadsheet to keep track. 

 

Third lesson: I personally use blue beads as a way of keeping track of spell casting. Every psychic phase I put beads equal to the number of spell casts by that caster. Every spell they cast I take away a bead.  This makes keeping track of spell slot usage incredibly easy and quick, you can also see at a glance the number left on the table. I did this because keeping track of 7-10 spellcasters in your head is bordering on impossible. 

 

1. I've only periled twice in five games. Once for my Shaman and once for Ahriman. What I learnt from that is whenever I get perils, I'll always roll a 6 and lose 3 wounds. -.- (I had a reroll CP, but didn't bother using it, because I always save it to ensure that I get a specific spell off!)

 

2. Haha. I think you need to call it the "superior" spreadsheet.

 

3. That's a good idea. I think if you have blue dice then you can use that too.

 

4. I ONLY just realised that I can use each stratagem only ONCE PER PHASE. I thought that it was only ONCE PER PLAYER TURN. God dammit! That would have helped me a lot! Because I would have then used veterans of the long war in both my shooting and assault phases!

 

Also, I found that it's very helpful if you have a single sheet of paper with ALL the spells you are going to cast and your stratagems. For example:

 

Stratagems - Use in this order

Cabalistic Focus (1CP): Use before attempting to manifest a psychic power with a THOUSAND SONS PSYKER that is within 6" of 2 other friendly THOUSAND SONS PSYKERS. Add 2 to the Psychic test.

 

Veterans of the Long War (1CP): When a HERETIC ASTARTES INFANTRY or BIKER unit is selected to attack in a Shooting or Fight phase. Add 1 to all wound rolls for the unit until the end of the phase. 

 

Endless Cacophony (2CP): At the end of your Shooting phase. Select a HERETIC ASTARTES SLAANESH INFANTRY or BIKER unit – that unit can immediately shoot again.

 

Veterans of the Long War (1CP): When a THOUSAND SONS INFANTRY unit is selected to attack in a Shooting or Fight phase. Add 1 to all wound rolls made for the unit until the end of the phase.

 

Cycle of Slaughter (2CP): At the end of the Fight phase. Select a TZAANGOR unit from your army – that unit can immediately fight an additional time.

 

Psychic Powers

Cast in this order. All psychic powers have an extended range of 6”. Always cast warptime last to exhaust all enemy deny rolls first or to make them forget about it.

 

Smite (WC5): The closest visible enemy unit within 18" of the psyker suffers D3 mortal wounds. If the result of the Psychic test was more than 10, the target suffers D6 mortal wounds instead.

 

Infernal Gaze (WC5): Select an enemy unit that is within 18" of the psyker and visible to him and roll 3 dice. The target suffers one mortal wound for each roll of 4+.

 

Weaver of Fates (WC6): Select a THOUSAND SONS unit within 18" of the psyker. Until the start of your next Psychic phase, the invulnerable save of that unit is improved by 1 (to a maximum of 3+).

 

Prescience (WC7): Select a HERETIC ASTARTES unit within 18" of the psyker. You can add 1 to all hit rolls made for that unit until the start of your next Psychic phase.

 

Glamour of Tzeentch (WC7): Select a friendly THOUSAND SONS unit within 12" of the psyker. Until the start of your next Psychic phase, your opponent must subtract 1 from any hit rolls they make for models that target that unit.

 

Death Hex (WC8): Select a visible enemy unit that is within 12" of the psyker. Until the start of your next Psychic phase, that unit cannot take invulnerable saves.

 

Warptime (WC6): Pick a HERETIC ASTARTES unit within 3" of the psyker. That unit can immediately move as if it were its Movement phase.

 

I know that I can cast smite multiple times, so that's easy to remember and so I don't include it in my spread sheet.

 

Also, the reason why the spells are in the order is normally I have 9 units that can cast 10 spells per turn and I normally go through them in a specific order.

[dbecer01]

Do you guys write numbers on the bases?

[Marshlands]

I think mine is forgetting to roll rubric spells first, and using my CP and gaze of fate rerolls before getting to them...

 

Hellforged vehicles can teach you a similar lesson...

[Prot]

I think mine is forgetting to roll rubric spells first, and using my CP and gaze of fate rerolls before getting to them...

 

Hellforged vehicles can teach you a similar lesson...

 

 

I just had a game where I re rolled a Decimator explosion.... wow. It still exploded and the damage was unbelievable. My opponent was cackling with delight at the ridiculous bad luck I had. So MUCH of my stuff died; Rubrics (half a squad) a Defiler too.... a Sorc on Disk took 6 as well... crazy stuff. 

[dotbackslash]

 

Stratagems - Use in this order

Cabalistic Focus (1CP): Use before attempting to manifest a psychic power with a THOUSAND SONS PSYKER that is within 6" of 2 other friendly THOUSAND SONS PSYKERS. Add 2 to the Psychic test.

 

Veterans of the Long War (1CP): When a HERETIC ASTARTES INFANTRY or BIKER unit is selected to attack in a Shooting or Fight phase. Add 1 to all wound rolls for the unit until the end of the phase. 

 

Endless Cacophony (2CP): At the end of your Shooting phase. Select a HERETIC ASTARTES SLAANESH INFANTRY or BIKER unit – that unit can immediately shoot again.

 

Veterans of the Long War (1CP): When a THOUSAND SONS INFANTRY unit is selected to attack in a Shooting or Fight phase. Add 1 to all wound rolls made for the unit until the end of the phase.

 

Cycle of Slaughter (2CP): At the end of the Fight phase. Select a TZAANGOR unit from your army – that unit can immediately fight an additional time.

 

 

Even though the 2 veterans of the long war are in different decks, i'm sure you can still only use it once because it has the same name it still counts as the same strat.

 

 

 

Also anyone getting much use out of scarab occult now due to the beta bolters?