Doom Herald Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Well, I looked through my coppy of Vigilus Defiant today and went straight to Haarken Worldclaimer. I was, and still am, pretty excited about this guy but when i looked for other rules for CHAOS i found there were none. Further, the full rules for Haarken come with the model anyway. In short, if you want this book just for CHAOS rules, it's a waste. I'm not discouraging anyone from getting it for the campaign it's self or if you just want the book, just letting everyone know not to expect anything that's not there. That said, I can't wait to put Haarken on the battle field, even if Black Legion is on their 3rd named character unit, and would love to hear thoughts people have on fitting him into their armies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strazhakov Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 That was to be expected. It's very likely Vigilus II will be all about the arrival of Chaos and the Black Legion. If you are following the rumour mill, Abaddon is on the way and not far off :D *yay*! Haven't been this exited about 40k in a looong time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216357 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dice4thedicegod Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Haarkonaan’s leadership debuff is good enough that, if I have a detachment spare, I’d consider bringing him alongside my nightlords force (whether in an auxiliary or patrol). Pity his other buff is for melee raptors. (!!!?!?!). I mean, give raptors a shooting buff, or give warp talons a needed melee buff. But why this? It’s like having Astra Militarum master of ordnance give basilisks a melee boost. Why?? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216358 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemon Prince Marbas Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 I'm a bit confused by the lack of Chaos in Vigilus Defiant as the Death Guard have already appeared in a Vigilus story and Haarkon Worldclaimer is held up to be a big deal. If Vigilus is as vital a world as the newest lore alleges, there should be much larger Chaos involvement. I mean look at the number of Chapters and Astra Militarum Regiments involved already! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayniac Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 It is a bit weird. It's frustrating that they put the new formations in Vigilus and only for some armies, rather than at least something for everyone so they don't have some armies with an extra bonus when others have nothing until a later date, if at all. If the formations weren't for matched play it wouldn't be such a huge deal but since they are, now some armies have major advantages again over others.i had honestly thought we had moved away from that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216395 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gederas Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Haarkonaan’s leadership debuff is good enough that, if I have a detachment spare, I’d consider bringing him alongside my nightlords force (whether in an auxiliary or patrol). Pity his other buff is for melee raptors. (!!!?!?!). I mean, give raptors a shooting buff, or give warp talons a needed melee buff. But why this? It’s like having Astra Militarum master of ordnance give basilisks a melee boost. Why?? Wait. You do realize Raptors are a MELEE unit, right? So a lord for a melee unit giving a melee buff doesn't make sense? Wat :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216416 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stofficus Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Haarkonaan’s leadership debuff is good enough that, if I have a detachment spare, I’d consider bringing him alongside my nightlords force (whether in an auxiliary or patrol). Pity his other buff is for melee raptors. (!!!?!?!). I mean, give raptors a shooting buff, or give warp talons a needed melee buff. But why this? It’s like having Astra Militarum master of ordnance give basilisks a melee boost. Why?? Wait. You do realize Raptors are a MELEE unit, right? So a lord for a melee unit giving a melee buff doesn't make sense? Wat They're a really bad melee unit, but a pretty good highly mobile shooting unit. 2x specials w/ a matching combi weapon, making use of that fly ability, and you've got a good nuisance/precision unit. Much more potent than a couple dudes with chainswords. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216427 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cryptix Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Raptors are only regarded as a shooting unit because they can take 2 specials in an MSU, drop down, and kill some termites easily. I'd rather have Raptors get two attacks then have Haarken buff their shooting. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216480 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokugawa Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 -leadership is never a viable tactics for Chaos. Harlequin-centered aeldari list could get reliable -4 or -5 to enemy leadership, and that is still not competitive. No effect against mechanized list, monsters list, nids, orks,etc...This name list is just too long. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216483 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheex Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 The lack of Chaos content doesn't bother me - GW released the contents pages a week or two ago, so we've known for a while that the only Chaos stuff was Haarken. The missions look pretty interesting and I'm keen on the campaign stuff, but the main draw for me was the fact that the book has created a narrative setting with a few interesting biomes. It's easy to imagine any of your battles between now and the release of Vigilus II taking place on any of the 'false continents' of Vigilus. The added rules for Battlezones and War Zones make for some interesting variations, too. However, if you're not interested in narrative stuff and exclusively play Chaos, then this book isn't for you. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216512 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron_Within Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Imo Haarkon Worldclaimer in fluff has been created to be killed off by Calgar or who ever they are pushing. Yes I'm salty. I really like his model but I cannot stand his mediocre rules Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216520 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 It is a bit weird. It's frustrating that they put the new formations in Vigilus and only for some armies, rather than at least something for everyone so they don't have some armies with an extra bonus when others have nothing until a later date, if at all. If the formations weren't for matched play it wouldn't be such a huge deal but since they are, now some armies have major advantages again over others.i had honestly thought we had moved away from that. That's how campaign books work. Factions present in that campaign get stuff. Don't compare it too much with a general supplement book. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216521 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnightmare Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 That was to be expected. It's very likely Vigilus II will be all about the arrival of Chaos and the Black Legion. If you are following the rumour mill, Abaddon is on the way and not far off :D *yay*! Haven't been this exited about 40k in a looong time. Ohhhhhhh yes *rubs palms together* Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216561 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 One change to his rule set to make him worth it. Shadowy allies. That's it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChazSexington Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Calm down, y'all. Everything was pointing at Chaos being in the second Vigilus book. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
techsoldaten Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Calm down, y'all. Everything was pointing at Chaos being in the second Vigilus book. Ughh... Jar Jar things... One might assume Haarken claiming the world for the Warmaster foreshadows the arrival of the Warmaster. Hoping this means new Chaos models as well as rules. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216589 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron_Within Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 If they Re-release the Chaos Codex I will be unbelievably happy, if it's a Vigilus part 2 with extra rules for Chaos Space Marines... okay. It's just for the Black Legion etc. I would be a lot less happy. I mean Iron Warriors are very popular and they get so little love. I mean an updated Chaos Space Marine Codex would be the best case scenario and would explain why we got 0 love in Vigilus book 1. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216594 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayniac Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 If they Re-release the Chaos Codex I will be unbelievably happy, if it's a Vigilus part 2 with extra rules for Chaos Space Marines... okay. It's just for the Black Legion etc. I would be a lot less happy. I mean Iron Warriors are very popular and they get so little love. I mean an updated Chaos Space Marine Codex would be the best case scenario and would explain why we got 0 love in Vigilus book 1. Yeah but this is GW. It'll probably be Codex: Black Legion or some crap (although Codex: Traitor Legions or Codex: Black Crusade or something might be good for all legions). I'm hopeful because we're pretty sure it means new models (although I'm converting my Iron Warriors with a mix of MkIII and the current CSM kit, I'll do the same with the new kit if it's true multipose and not garbage like the Plague Marine kit), but unless Vigilus Book 2 has updated sheets for most of the chaos units, I'm not expecting to get an 8.5 codex as cool as it would be. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216596 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Imo Haarkon Worldclaimer in fluff has been created to be killed off by Calgar or who ever they are pushing. Yes I'm salty. I really like his model but I cannot stand his mediocre rules Personally, I intend on using him an awful lot, just designed a list around him using 25 raptors for a 2k list. I think for his incredibly low points cost (comparatively) he is great. But YMMV! I would imagine one of the things coming with vigilus part 2 will be a Raptor contingent of some variety, though this is speculation its an obvious choice given that Haarkon has the Raptor keyword. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216627 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khornestar Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 On one hand, I think assuming it will be for Black Legion only is the safe bet. On the other hand, there were loyalist chapters like Black Templars that seemingly aren’t a part of the narrative but got a “formation” page. Please World Eaters. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216628 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 On one hand, I think assuming it will be for Black Legion only is the safe bet. On the other hand, there were loyalist chapters like Black Templars that seemingly aren’t a part of the narrative but got a “formation” page. Please World Eaters. I would think the "Theme" of defiant 2 will be Black Legion specifically, but the actual rules will be usable by any "non-marked" legion. Though obviously, this is total conjecture on my part. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216640 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayniac Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 I hope so. I really don't want them to regress back to Rogue Trader era where you had the 4 cult legions and Black Legion and that was it, everything else fell under one of those (like Night Lords and Word Bearers were Khorne IIRC, Alpha Legion and Iron Warriors were Slaanesh I think) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216654 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kraken Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Haarkonaan’s leadership debuff is good enough that, if I have a detachment spare, I’d consider bringing him alongside my nightlords force (whether in an auxiliary or patrol). Pity his other buff is for melee raptors. (!!!?!?!). I mean, give raptors a shooting buff, or give warp talons a needed melee buff. But why this? It’s like having Astra Militarum master of ordnance give basilisks a melee boost. Why?? Wait. You do realize Raptors are a MELEE unit, right? So a lord for a melee unit giving a melee buff doesn't make sense? Wat Raptors are not a melee unit. Not with a single attack and chainsword only. Meanwhile they have plenty of options for ranged. The Warp Talons are supposed to be the melee variant and even they are not very good at it. Raptors are crap at melee and Haarken buff is completely pointless. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216660 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayniac Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 I think GW is intending for them to be a melee unit, even if it doesn't turn out that way. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheex Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Calm down, y'all. Everything was pointing at Chaos being in the second Vigilus book. [Moustache twirling intensifies] But yeah, reading the fluff in Vigilus Defiant - there is a part that specifically says in no uncertain terms that Abaddon will be there to claim Vigilus personally in 80 days. Doesn't mean he'll necessarily get a model update, but... Unrelated, there's also a sly wink and a nod to all the people complaining that OldMarines are obsolete. Couldn't help but smile at that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352379-vigilus-defiant-chaos/#findComment-5216911 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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