Doom Herald Posted January 5, 2019 Share Posted January 5, 2019 For a fun project army, I am working on a Leadership busting army. As a result, I'm putting together a list of abilities that interact with enemy leadership. With Haarken being an expert on terror, I'm hopeful to see more Leadership interactions in the future of Vigilus. I have included rules that generate and enhance Chaos Spawn in-game since there are a fair amount of them. Strategies and thoughts on how to assemble a fear based army are very welcome. Other Chaos Factions will have similar lists on the appropriate pages. Daemons: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352937-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/ Other Chaos: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352945-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/ UNIT TYPE FACTION EFFECT RANGE/TARGET Haarken Worldclaimer HQ Black Legion -1 Enemy Ld 18" Aura Zhufor the Impaler HQ World Eaters, Skulltakers +1 to enemy morale tests 6" Aura Noxious Blightbringer Elite Death Guard -1 Enemy Ld, -2 if Psyker 7" Aura Chaos Decimator (Butcher Cannon) Elite <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons -2 Ld if a model is slain 36" Heavy 4 Hellforged Contemptor Dreadnought (Butcher Cannon) Elite <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons -2 Ld if a model is slain 36" Heavy 4 Chaos Spawn Fast Attack <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons -1 Enemy Ld 1" Aura Raptors Fast Attack <LEGION> -1 Enemy Ld 1" Aura Mutualith Vortex Beast Heavy Support Thousand Sons -1 Enemy Ld (X3) 9" , 1 Enemy Unit Hellforged Land Raider Proteus (Accursed Phylactory) Heavy Support <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons -1 Ld 9" Aura Hellforged Sicaran Venator (Malignitas Beam Laser) Heavy Support <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons Wounds if 3D6 >= Ld 36" Heavy 1 Hellforged Deredeo Dreadnought (Butcher Cannon Aray) Heavy Support <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons -2 Ld if a model is slain 36" Heavy 8 Hellforged Deredeo Dreadnought (Dual Malignitas Saker) Heavy Support <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons Wounds if 3D6 >= Ld 48" Heavy 2 Hellforged Leviathan Dreadnought (Butcher Cannon Aray) Heavy Support <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons -2 Ld if a model is slain 36" Heavy 8 Magnus The Red Lord of War Thousand Sons Creates Spawn Melee, Enemy Characters Hellforged Cerberus Heavy Destroyer (Malignitas Beam Cannon) Lord of War <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons Wounds if 3D6 >= Ld 72" Heavy 4 Chaos Hell Talon (Warp Pulse Bombs) Flyer <LEGION>, Death Guard, Thousand Sons 1 /battle, -1 Enemy Ld 1 Unit that has been moved over Icon of Despair Chaos Icon <LEGION> , Death Guard -1 Enemy Ld 6" Aura on Unit Terror Tactics Legion Trait Night Lords -1 Enemy Ld (X3) 6" Aura Lord of Terror Warlord Trait <LEGION> Enemy rolls 2D6 for Morale and used highest D6 6" Aura Maelstrom of Torment Warlord Trait Crimson Slaughter -1 / -2 enemy Ld 6" / 9" Aura Dolorous Knell Relics of Decay Death Guard Enemy rolls 2D6 for Morale and uses highest D6, possibly deal Mortal Wounds 7" Aura Trophies of Slaughter Relics of the Legion Black Legion -1 enemy Ld 6" Aura Crown of the Blasphemer Artefacts of the Word Bearers Word Bearers -1 enemy Ld 6" Aura Flayer Artefacts of the Night Lords Night Lords Kills with this weapon count as 2 for morale Melee The Endless Grin Artefacts of the Emperor's Children Emperor's Children Lord of Terror effect & -1 enemy Ld 6" Aura Armor of Abhorrence Artefacts of the Emperor's Children Emperor's Children 1 additional enemy flees in failed morale 6" Aura Fated Mutation Strategem Thousand Sons Re-roll attack qty, and choose mutation Tzeentch Chaos Spawn The Flesh Change Stratagem Thousand Sons Turn Character into Tzeentch Chaos Spawn TS Infantry Character Brutal Subjugation Strategem Black Legion / Bringers of Despair Models slain by this unit count as 2 for morale Black Legion Terminator BRINGERS OF DESPAIR Terror Strike Strategem Host Raptorial When an enemy is destroyed by a HOST RAPTORIAL unit, enemies get -1Ld while within 6" of HOST RAPTORIAL units this turn JUMP PACK HOST RAPTORIAL unit Prey on the Weak Strategem Night Lords +1 to hit vs enemies with lower Ld Night Lords Unit Flay Them Alive Strategem Night Lords When an enemy is destroyed by a NL unit, NL units gain 12" Lord of Terror effect. Night Lords Unit Gift of Chaos Psychic Power Dark Hereticus Discipline Creates Spawn 6" , Enemy Character Bolt of Change Psychic Power Discipline of Tzeentch Creates Spawn 18" , Enemy Character Treason of Tzeentch Psychic Power Discipline of Tzeentch Roll 2D6 vs enemy Ld for temporary control 18" Enemy Character Litany of Despair Prayer Prayer to the Dark Gods Enemy units roll 2D6 for morale and use the highest D6 6" Aura Notes: 1) The Night Lords Stratagem Vox Scream and the Night Lords Relic Vox Daemonicus are useful for shutting down auras that improve enemy morale. 2) The Lord of Terror warlord trait says enemies roll an additional D6 for morale and you discard one. Other similar abilities say enemies roll 2D6 and you discard one. This possibly allows for rolling 3D6 with you discarding two, following RAW. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
dice4thedicegod Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 I was thinking of a night lord /raptors (and chaos spawn) force with a daemon supreme command detachment, so I could add: Keeper of secrets, for the two slaanesh powers cacophony and phantasmagoric (one gives -1 ld within 12 inches, the other is 2d6 mortal wounds less leadership) Be’lakor, for his inbuilt -1 ld within 12” Lord of change for treason oftzeentch. Third detachment would have haarken worldclaimer and probably cultists and another hq, for cp farming. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229020 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreaterChickenofTzeentch Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 As a note, Treason of Tzeentch has no restrictions on what Character to target. Hello Castellans and Pask. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 Huh, just noticed that if you don't go all in with the Night Lords trait but still plan to do some LD shenanigans you might as well go with Black Legion and get to use Abaddon on top of it. NL: Raptors (-2LD) + JP Lord (-1LD) = -3LD BL: Raptors (-1LD) + Haarken (-1LD) = -2LD Really just a small difference. Sure NL can do that with non-Raptor units as well but what are NL without Raptors. Sure NL can stack the debuff even higher but when is that really necessary? I think it's much more interesting that BL can get almost the same result but get access to all the BL love, especially Abaddon. Heck the new sourcerer model revealed yesterday might be yet another awesome special character for BL since the Rumour Engine was hinting at a Sourcerer with a different backpack than this one has. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229144 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dice4thedicegod Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 My leadership shenanigans army (1996 points): Outrider detachment (nightlords): Chaos lord w/jump pack and claws of the black hunt Chaos sorcerer w/jump pack & plasma pistol (& mark of slaanesh, intoxicating elixir) 5 Raptors (champ w/ power sword & plasma pistol, 2 raptors with plasma guns) 5 Raptors (champ w/ power sword & plasma pistol, 2 raptors with plasma pistols) 1 Chaos spawn 5 Terminators with dual lightning claws (yes, I know they’re terrible value - but they lookcool. Would probably be far better to field my obliterators instead for about the same cost) Supreme command detachment (daemons) Be’lakor Lord of Change w/baleful sword (treason of tzeentch power) Keeper of Secrets (phantasmagorica and cacophony of slaanesh powers) Wrathful Bloodthirster w/armor of scorn (there to be a turn 1 bullet magnet) Battalion detachment (black legion): Haarkon worldclaimer Daemon prince (talons) 10 cultists 10 cultists 10 cultists If haarkon, the keeper and be’lakor are fairly central, then that will be a 12” radius bubble of -3 leadership in the middle of the board before even getting to any nightlords, raptors, or the chaos spawn effects. Which will help with the cacophony and treason psychic powers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229161 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghorgul Posted January 6, 2019 Share Posted January 6, 2019 You should append your list with this: Index: Forces of Chaos UNIT/EFECTTYPEFACTION/DISCIPLINEEFFECTRANGE/TARGET Butcher Cannon (weapon option to Decimator, Contemptor) Weapon<Legion>; <Mark of Chaos>; Daemon; Daemon Engine-2 ld to unit that suffered casualties from this weapon until end of turn. Not cumulative with itself. 36" Butcher cannon array (weapon option to Leviathan, Deredeo) Weapon <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos>-2 ld to unit that suffered casualties from this weapon until end of turn. Not cumulative with itself. 36" Accursed Phylactery (on Land Raider Proteus)Unit - Unit upgrade <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos>; All units within aura suffer -1 to their Ld 9" Sicaran Venator (Malignatas Beam Laser) Unit - Unit Weapon <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos> Wounding done as 3D6 and compare result to target Ld, wounds when above. 36" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229393 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 6, 2019 Author Share Posted January 6, 2019 You should append your list with this: Index: Forces of Chaos UNIT/EFECT TYPE FACTION/DISCIPLINE EFFECT RANGE/TARGET Butcher Cannon (weapon option to Decimator, Contemptor) Weapon <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos>; Daemon; Daemon Engine -2 ld to unit that suffered casualties from this weapon until end of turn. Not cumulative with itself. 36" Butcher cannon array (weapon option to Leviathan, Deredeo) Weapon <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos> -2 ld to unit that suffered casualties from this weapon until end of turn. Not cumulative with itself. 36" Accursed Phylactery (on Land Raider Proteus) Unit - Unit upgrade <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos>; All units within aura suffer -1 to their Ld 9" Sicaran Venator (Malignatas Beam Laser) Unit - Unit Weapon <Legion>; <Mark of Chaos> Wounding done as 3D6 and compare result to target Ld, wounds when above. 36" I will be going through the Forgeworld indexes once I complete the Daemons Codex, Gellerpox Infected, and Renegade Knights. There are a LOT of options in the Indexes that are wonderful compliments to terror. I was thinking of a night lord /raptors (and chaos spawn) force with a daemon supreme command detachment, so I could add: Keeper of secrets, for the two slaanesh powers cacophony and phantasmagoric (one gives -1 ld within 12 inches, the other is 2d6 mortal wounds less leadership) Be’lakor, for his inbuilt -1 ld within 12” Lord of change for treason oftzeentch. Third detachment would have haarken worldclaimer and probably cultists and another hq, for cp farming. Watch the wording of the Daemons Ld penalties closely, some of them are actually only -1Ld in the morale phase. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 6, 2019 Author Share Posted January 6, 2019 The DAEMONS list has been added to their board. Forge World effects not yet added. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreaterChickenofTzeentch Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 Huh, just noticed that if you don't go all in with the Night Lords trait but still plan to do some LD shenanigans you might as well go with Black Legion and get to use Abaddon on top of it. NL: Raptors (-2LD) + JP Lord (-1LD) = -3LD BL: Raptors (-1LD) + Haarken (-1LD) = -2LD Really just a small difference. Sure NL can do that with non-Raptor units as well but what are NL without Raptors. Sure NL can stack the debuff even higher but when is that really necessary? I think it's much more interesting that BL can get almost the same result but get access to all the BL love, especially Abaddon. Heck the new sourcerer model revealed yesterday might be yet another awesome special character for BL since the Rumour Engine was hinting at a Sourcerer with a different backpack than this one has. Night Lords get a 6in range on Terror Tactics. They don't even have to charge. Many of the other options do, though that can be addressed somewhat with the Nurgle Icon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229635 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 Forge World Units have been added. I'm about to add the Forge World DAEMONS list and the miscellaneous Renegades list (Included Knights, Titans, Gellerpox, and Heretics and Renegades). Please let me know if I missed any. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229668 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 Butcher Cannons have a rule that says "This modifier is not cumulative." How would you interpret that? It doesn't stack at all? It doesn't stack with other Butcher Cannons? What about the Butcher Cannon Array? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229675 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 From what I've checked, we have a potential of -13 Ld from all HERETIC ASTARTES sources before Morale phase. This is not counting the bonus penalty Blightbringers deal to psykers. DAEMONS can add -5, not counting Be'lakor since his only occurs in the Morale phase. Renegade Knights can add -3 and Gellerpox Infected can add -1. Titans, if you're willing to use them can add a further -2. If you consider Butcher Cannons to stack with other penalties, we get a further -2 (-4 if you consider arrays seperate). Keep in mind that Hellforged Contemptors have been erratad to have HELLBRUTE as a keyword, meaning they get Terror Tactics. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229681 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshlands Posted January 7, 2019 Share Posted January 7, 2019 If only psychic shriek were still a thing! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229691 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 7, 2019 Author Share Posted January 7, 2019 If only psychic shriek were still a thing! We atleast have Cacaphonic Choir. If you throw it in on the Slaanesh daemons Lord of War, you have a -2 Ld monster with phantasmagoria for an additional -1, and a psychic power that does 2D6 - enemy Ld as mortal wounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5229718 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted January 10, 2019 Author Share Posted January 10, 2019 So, the forge world butcher cannon lists it as a "Decimator Butcher Cannon." Can anyone tell me for sure that it is easily compatible with a Contemptor, or am I going to have my work cut out for me? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5232100 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted April 1, 2019 Author Share Posted April 1, 2019 The list has been updated with Vigilus Ablaze and new CSM rules. If I missed anything please let me know. Also, I renamed the thread to Grimoire Nostramo, it seemed fluffier with the background on Haarken. Given the new rules, it seems like a Black Legion detachment with Haarken and terminators mixed with a Night Lords detachment might be pretty good for morale busting. Trophies of Slaughter on a BL HQ, maybe Terminator Lord/Sorc for brutal subjugation, Termies for same reason, Haarken. Night Lords for Terror tactics. Also, a Host Raptorial Crimson Slaughter detachment might work well. -2 Ld with 9" Aura on an Apostle with the Morale prayer, -2 Ld for Nurgle Icon on Raptors, -1 for Host Raptorial strat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5288531 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted April 13, 2019 Author Share Posted April 13, 2019 Wrong thread. Sorry. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5296072 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gederas Posted April 13, 2019 Share Posted April 13, 2019 So, the forge world butcher cannon lists it as a "Decimator Butcher Cannon." Can anyone tell me for sure that it is easily compatible with a Contemptor, or am I going to have my work cut out for me? Iirc, Augustus b'Rass converted a Decimator Butcher Cannon to fit on a Night Lords' Contemptor. It took a little work because the connection points aren't exactly the same (I forget which is which, but one of the weapon's connection points is a 'male' connector, whereas the other is 'female') and he had to make a mold of one (I believe it was the Contemptor parts), but it can work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5296089 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted April 13, 2019 Share Posted April 13, 2019 If not just stick magnets on them and have them be a bit bigger. Could all flush out with a paint job! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5296109 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 Sorry to resurrect this but we can now add Chaos Knights to this list, the relic Traitors Mark is -1ld within 12", -2 within 6", and the warlord trait Aura of Terror makes the opponent take morale on 2d6 picking the highest within 12", and charges made within 12" are at -1 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5348365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted July 17, 2019 Author Share Posted July 17, 2019 Sorry to resurrect this but we can now add Chaos Knights to this list, the relic Traitors Mark is -1ld within 12", -2 within 6", and the warlord trait Aura of Terror makes the opponent take morale on 2d6 picking the highest within 12", and charges made within 12" are at -1Knights can be found in the the link on the first post of this thread titled "Other Chaos." I will fully update Knights rules once I get the new Codex, this weekend. I will also add the Contorted Epitome to the Daemons list this weekend. Edit: I really hope they change the Forge World keywords; an Atrapos with -3 Ld and forcing the worst roll out of 2 would be sweet. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5348454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Herald Posted December 9, 2019 Author Share Posted December 9, 2019 Updated with Faith and Fury rules. Please let me know if I missed anything. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/352910-grimoire-nostramo-list-of-enemy-ld-interacts/#findComment-5443609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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