Imperial knights query

[aura_enchanted]

So I'm wondering for a list I'm working on would the errant or the paladin be a better super heavy aux detachment. I don't really have points do better. I think at best I could manage like a warden the castellan and the other series 3 knight are just right out not feesable to put in the army.

 

Also house or freeblade?

 

My main issue is anti super heavy warfare and anti tank

[Lord Raven 19]

The paladin is more versatile and longer range. I would go with it.

In a super heavy auxiliary detachment house traits are not allowed so a freeblade would probably be better.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

You can still use the strats though.

[Loshkins]

Why not just get a Telemon or three? 

[aura_enchanted]

Why not just get a Telemon or three?

 

pretty sure that is forgeworld and while I already have one forgeworld piece in the army (and another two on the shelf) I'm not certain I can afford it. Assumin the telemon is 400 points the knight errant clocks in at 415 after wargears and I can get him now as opposed to paying a whole lot more and waiting 3 months

[librisrouge]

The knight paladin, much to my chagrin, is the worst of the Imperial Knights. It's gun just tries to do too much and kinda falls flat at both while costing more. Pretty much the problem with all jack-of-all-trades in 40k. Shame, since it is my favorite knight aesthetically.

 

I would run the knight errant. It is cheaper, for one. It's gun has a clear purpose in smoking high value targets. AP -4 isn't to be ignored and S9 puts it above other melta weapons. Also, if you want it to be more general purpose, give it the gun hat.

[aura_enchanted]

My default choice was the errant simply because I've always liked his visual presentation. A melts gun wielding maniac with a sword always made me happier then I'd like to admit.

 

And I do have repairs and modifiers to his shooting and melee in the list via rerolls, +1 bs, and repair auras (though the repair is of poor quality).

 

My only regret is that I have no way of making his saves Better as my 2k list beyond giving the enemy another threat his size to shoot at. I can only hope that is enough

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I’d go for the one that can take the avenger Gatling cannon and upgrade it to the relic weapon.

[FelipeFlops]

 

Why not just get a Telemon or three?

pretty sure that is forgeworld and while I already have one forgeworld piece in the army (and another two on the shelf) I'm not certain I can afford it. Assumin the telemon is 400 points the knight errant clocks in at 415 after wargears and I can get him now as opposed to paying a whole lot more and waiting 3 months

 

 

Just on the Telemon front, the most expensive version (Twin Arachnus Storm Cannons) come in at 272pts. Which for a 2+, 4++, 6+++ T8 platform kicking out either 4 S9 AP-4 3 Damage or 12 S7 AP-2 1 Damage shots is respectable. Can't forget the 5 shot heavy bolter up top either. 

[noigrim]

Imao crusader/caatellan with ion bulwark is your to go choice

[aura_enchanted]

heres the list im currently working with. the errant is the current placeholder but i can drop a devestator squad and get a series 2 knight. i cant really afford to drop any more models and take a castellan or a forge knight so im really limited here to those 4 and i suppose the canis rex knight the one with the crazy beam gun

 

edit: it would help if i posted the list

 

battalion detachment 

HQ: 

land raider excelsior + rhino primaris (575) 

Troops: 

1x5 intercessors, 1 aux grenade launcher, sgt with power sword (89) 

1x10 tactical squad, 1 heavy bolter, 1 plasma gun (151) 

1x5 intercessors, aux launcher and power sword (89) 

Elite: 

deredeo dreadnaught, aelios missile launcher, anvilus autocannons, twin heavy bolter (200) 

1x5 deathwing knights, maces and flail, storm shields (185) 

Primaris ancient (69) 

heavy: 


1x5 devestators, 2 lascannons (110) 

1x5 devestators, heavy bolter, plasma cannon (96) 

Fast: 

1×6 Ravenwing bike squad, plasma gun, melta gun, chainswords, Sgt with power sword (155) 

super heavy aux detachment 

1x1 Imperial Knight Errant: heavy stubber, thermal cannon, reaper chainsword, house raven 

total points 1999/2000 

[Stray]

The knight paladin, much to my chagrin, is the worst of the Imperial Knights. It's gun just tries to do too much and kinda falls flat at both while costing more. Pretty much the problem with all jack-of-all-trades in 40k. Shame, since it is my favorite knight aesthetically.

 

I would run the knight errant. It is cheaper, for one. It's gun has a clear purpose in smoking high value targets. AP -4 isn't to be ignored and S9 puts it above other melta weapons. Also, if you want it to be more general purpose, give it the gun hat.

 

Libis is quite right. All things being equal, the Paladin is mathematically the worst Knight you can field. That isn't to say it's terrible, it's just that the RFBC doesn't compete favourably with either the Thermal Cannon, or Avenger, and yet is more expensive than both. It's your least competitive option as such.

 

Given your stated options, the Errant will generally be a better bet. As others have suggested though, I'd personally field a Warden or Crusader IF you're really looking purely at Questorus Chassis. The Avenger is just generally great, outclassing everything else up to T7, and even then, still puts out about half the expected wounds of the far more specialised Thermal Cannon.

[H311fi5h]

If you want good firepower against high value targets that doesn't eat up your CP like the Castellan you can take a House Krast Crusader with Headman's Mark and Ion Bulwark. It does serious damage against other titanic in particular, but really it's good against anything. You should be able to fit one into your list. I generally advice against using the single gun knights.

[Thousand Eyes]

Personally I think you might want to go for a Gallant, drop the guns and go charging in. That thing will attract all the firepower and leave your army fine. It is even possible to get off first turn charges with full tilt. You might hit screening troops, but you can consolidate into things.

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

I think you all are selling the range of the RFBC short. 72" is leverage. Added to the 12" move you can terrorize the whole board from any corner. I add the 72" missile pod to double down. You can really stretch an enemy with range games. Add in some good terrain placement for even greater leverage.

[Stray]

It's not the range anyone has an issue with really, it's the lack of reliable performance vs the other two main weapon options - neither of which could really be described as 'short range' to begin with.

 

A 72" range is impressive, but how often is it actually needed? Knights don't have much of a threat projection problem.

 

The RFBC isn't bad it just doesn't compare favourably with our other options in any category other than range. And in most games that 72" reach just isn't needed as much as reliable firepower. It's just too swingy.

[Black Knight]

From what I have always read you need to get your knights into melee to make their points back even with the crusader. So yes 72 is nice but you should always be running into the frey.

 

Or have things changed?

[H311fi5h]

From what I have always read you need to get your knights into melee to make their points back even with the crusader. So yes 72 is nice but you should always be running into the frey.

 

Or have things changed?

 

That depends entirely on what you're facing. Knights can die very quickly in close combat since you don't have an invulnerable save (unless taking the Sanctuary relic). They also really don't like getting surrounded by things they can't walk over falling back (bikes etc.)

A Crusader is quite potent in the fight phase. But you have to be selective with your engagements. 

[Stray]

 

A Crusader is quite potent in the fight phase. But you have to be selective with your engagements. 

 

 

You're both quite right I think, with the above being the key statement.

 

A river dancing Knight is very capable in the assault phase. And with the high cost of any Knight unit, you absolutely want to be taking part in that phase wherever you are able. But yes, assault is also an area where we are vulnerable, so clever positioning, and leaving yourself with open escape routes are key. Possibly this is even the area that separates the decent Knight general from the truly great one.

[hermanista]

And the Krast house trait helps make up for it when you're not so great (like me)

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

I go out of my way to use the 72" reach. I'll place my knight early in a corner to get a reaction from my foe. Do they try to get out if range by placing units in the far opposite corner? They are still not safe. They are forced to ignore it or stretch to get in range to shoot or assault. When they do the counter is there with 12" moves. That's not even considering the relic.