Shadowspear and Dark Angels

[JJD]

Scouts are 4PL and tactical and intercessor are both 5PL so with the extra special rules you would have to assume they would be towards the top end of that points range.

 

Scouts might be getting edged out.

[UtariOnzo]

I think scouts have a place as cheap meatshields if these units are on the slightly pricier end, just depends how many points you want to throw at the unit rather than spend elsewhere.

[JJD]

They have the same stats at intercessor’s with extra rules on top you have to assume they will be a point or two more per model.

[lhavoc]

Well the message is out in Warhammer Community and the title of the mini-codex is “Adeptus Astartes: Vanguard Space Marines”. Can we even take them as DA?

[Isual]

Well the message is out in Warhammer Community and the title of the mini-codex is “Adeptus Astartes: Vanguard Space Marines”. Can we even take them as DA?

 

They have the blanc <chapter> keyword, so there is still hope ;).

[Darmor]

Overall the release is OK, but... I don't know, the units are interesting, the models are OK (except for autocannon guys), but these guys are definitely not from my DA army. Black Knights, Company Veterans, Deathwing Knights, Company Champion, Master from Dark Vengeance... and these more "generic Sci-Fi Marines" just don't fit into the theme. Maybe as a new project, side army of "New Vanguard Space Marines Chapter", but not DA.

[MaxB]

Model-wise I'm a bit 'meh' on this release. Very tech looking marines which is cool but steps away from the gothic grim dark look that I like and that DA epitomise.

 

Rules look pretty cool for the Infiltrator marines - setting up like scouts but also pushing opponent deepstrikers back 12". Great screening potential. Price will be the clincher though.

 

Same with the jumpy-autocannon guys - priced right this could be an alternate for the Azrael castle. Has anyone seen stats on their guns?

 

This is all assuming DA can actually take these units.

[Solrac]

Model-wise I'm a bit 'meh' on this release. Very tech looking marines which is cool but steps away from the gothic grim dark look that I like and that DA epitomise.

 

Rules look pretty cool for the Infiltrator marines - setting up like scouts but also pushing opponent deepstrikers back 12". Great screening potential. Price will be the clincher though.

 

Same with the jumpy-autocannon guys - priced right this could be an alternate for the Azrael castle. Has anyone seen stats on their guns?

 

This is all assuming DA can actually take these units.

 

I think the Infiltrators will topple the Scouts for competitive games if they are 17 - 18 pts per model. All the rules for scouts with the Primaris stat line AND a 12" no deepstrike bubble with auto wounding bolters on Hit rolls of 6? yes please. Not to mention their bolters are rapid fire so take advantage of the beta bolter rules.

 

The Accelerator Autocannons on the Suppressors are 48" Heavy 2, S7 -2 D2. It's a pitty they are only a max unit of 3. Don't think I'll be buying any anytime soon. I'll be interested to see how these compare points wise to a Rifleman Ven Dread.

 

The Exterminators are intriguing me the more I read their rules. Again the max 3 in a unit is disappointing but the 3 different ammo types on their sniper rifles makes them so versatile. As long as they are no more than 20pts per model it would be worth taking 3 units of 3 to sit out of LOS an snipe weak characters or kill easy units for ITC Kill a unit points.

[Skorp]

I'm curious how the infiltrators will compare point wise to taking a phobos lt. with regular scouts.

 

I'm very intrigued by the heroes in phobos getting to scout move. What a librarian with righteous repugnance could do up in their face turn one with a warlord with master of manoevre is dirty.

 

Just overall the ability to almost deep strike first turn and be in their face. Makes sense why the capt and lt dont have power weapons.

[shabbadoo]

Th artwork had me thinking the Suppressor Squad simply had grav chutes, which would be suitable, but they have jump packs instead.  I guess 48" range weapons need to be able to be moved around a lot to get in range, and so as to impose a -1 penalty to hit.  Now, if those accelerator autocannons were somewhat shorter ranged ***Assault*** weapons, this would actually not be a needless combination. Makes me look forward to the release of a dedicated Primaris close combat unit which will have the Pondorous rule and be armed with combat knife (because Primaris' Str 4 AP 0 attack options are sadly lacking :/).

 

That this stuff bears The Mark of Guilliman at least irrefutably confirms who is the better tactician between him and The Lion.   I like all of the models/unit entries well enough, except for the Suppressors. Exterminators will likely put the final nail in the coffin of Scout Snipers. Better armor, more Wounds, and a better gun. They will likely cost about 30 points, but they will be worth it (and the models do look very cool).

[Grand Master Raziel]

One other interesting thing about the Exterminators is that they are a Heavy Support choice. Assuming they are in the range of 50-60pts for a unit, we now have a relatively cheap Heavy Support choice to help us fill out Brigades. One we won't feel too bad about spending the points on too.

The Suppressors are interesting, but they don't have a good unit to suppress for. Also, they make me wonder why there wasn't at least one Ultramarines officer who could say to Guilliman, "Hey boss, wouldn't it make more sense to give the accelerator autocannons to the Hellblasters and the plasma incinerators to the Suppressors?"

I suppose being able to take a unit of 10 Hellblasters with accelerator autocannons would be ridiculous, but they could limit them to units of 5. And would they be more ridiculous than a Castellan?

[BlackTriton]

Boy do I love the infiltrator,

I expect them to be 16-17 PPM, same stats as the intecessor with worst weapon and some utility ability.

GW undervalues anything that is not raw power, and I expect infiltrator to be agressivly pointed to both sell the models and help the faction.

 

Eliminator are super nice, filling both the no-Los and sniper niche at the same time for an expected 19-22 PPM. and they look so good!

 

Suppressor... they do not bring much to DA, maybe BA and SW will have more of a use for them.

[JJD]

Overall the release is OK, but... I don't know, the units are interesting, the models are OK (except for autocannon guys), but these guys are definitely not from my DA army. Black Knights, Company Veterans, Deathwing Knights, Company Champion, Master from Dark Vengeance... and these more "generic Sci-Fi Marines" just don't fit into the theme. Maybe as a new project, side army of "New Vanguard Space Marines Chapter", but not DA.

I feel much the same. They just don't feel very dark angel.

 

Maybe they will grow in me.

[JJD]

Maybe I just need to see some in robes.

 

Come on GW give me robes.

[JJD]

One other interesting thing about the Exterminators is that they are a Heavy Support choice. Assuming they are in the range of 50-60pts for a unit, we now have a relatively cheap Heavy Support choice to help us fill out Brigades. One we won't feel too bad about spending the points on too.

The Suppressors are interesting, but they don't have a good unit to suppress for. Also, they make me wonder why there wasn't at least one Ultramarines officer who could say to Guilliman, "Hey boss, wouldn't it make more sense to give the accelerator autocannons to the Hellblasters and the plasma incinerators to the Suppressors?"

I suppose being able to take a unit of 10 Hellblasters with accelerator autocannons would be ridiculous, but they could limit them to units of 5. And would they be more ridiculous than a Castellan?

Sorry to multiple post but the thing with the hellblasters made me spit out my drink. That is spot on.

[Solrac]

It doesn't look like the supressors have jump packs. Their 12" move comes from their trampoline shoes.

[JJD]

All I can think is that the multipart kit either allows them to be built without jump pack to save points or there is another weapon that makes more sense. Hopefully both.

[G8Keeper]

Let's take a minute to appreciate how we can now cast Mind Wipe with a psyker equipped with Eye of the Unseen and the new power (separate new psyker) that's also -1 Ld for a total of -3.  Then we can cast Trephination with Empyric Channeling just to make sure and potentially take 5 wounds off an enemy character. More shenanigans could be had with Reivers and Asmodai.

[Gederas]

Let's take a minute to appreciate how we can now cast Mind Wipe with a psyker equipped with Eye of the Unseen and the new power (separate new psyker) that's also -1 Ld for a total of -3.  Then we can cast Trephination with Empyric Channeling just to make sure and potentially take 5 wounds off an enemy character. More shenanigans could be had with Reivers and Asmodai.

And people said Night Lords are the kings of Leadership shenanigans :lol:

[UtariOnzo]

There was some debate earlier about if we were getting these units.

 

Given a colour scheme for a Dark Angels Vanguard was in the recent article ( https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/05/mar-5-shadowspear-focus-vanguard-unitsgw-homepage-post-4/ ), along with Space Wolves and Blood Angels, I think it’s safe at this point to assume we’ll be able to use them.

 

Love the look of the Librarian, wonder if DA equivalents will get Inner Circle keyword like the other Primaris Librarians?

[Solrac]

There was some debate earlier about if we were getting these units.

 

Given a colour scheme for a Dark Angels Vanguard was in the recent article ( https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/05/mar-5-shadowspear-focus-vanguard-unitsgw-homepage-post-4/ ), along with Space Wolves and Blood Angels, I think it’s safe at this point to assume we’ll be able to use them.

 

Love the look of the Librarian, wonder if DA equivalents will get Inner Circle keyword like the other Primaris Librarians?

 

There will most likely be a page at the front of the Vigilus Vanguard Marines mini codex in Shadowspear that will say these units can be used with Dark Angels, Clood Angels, Space Wolves etc. Just like when the Repulsor, Primaris Chaplain, Primaris Apothecary came out and no one but Space Marines had codex's.

 

It would be silly to exclude all marine armies as they will lose a lot of money.

[HandsWithLegs]

In the article on WHC about the vanguard forces they show off a warlord trait that lets you pick a friendly and enemy unit and the friendly unit adds 1 to attacks against the enemy unit. Hopefully we get this stuff, I really want that for my hellblasters

[Isual]

In the article on WHC about the vanguard forces they show off a warlord trait that lets you pick a friendly and enemy unit and the friendly unit adds 1 to attacks against the enemy unit. Hopefully we get this stuff, I really want that for my hellblasters

 

That would be awsome 

[Grand Master Raziel]

When I first saw the Librarian, I thought it was Primaris Ezekial.

[ValourousHeart]

In the article on WHC about the vanguard forces they show off a warlord trait that lets you pick a friendly and enemy unit and the friendly unit adds 1 to attacks against the enemy unit. Hopefully we get this stuff, I really want that for my hellblasters

 

Well according to the second to last paragraph in the WHC article we will be.

 

 

 

What’s more, all of these new units can join armies hailing from any of the First Founding or successor Chapters, so you’ll soon be able to add these powerful new weapons to your arsenal.