Kasrkin101 Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 Hi everyone! I've been lurking around these parts for about a year and a half, and thought that it was finally time make a profile and get involved. To give some context for this post, I have amassed a fair sized collection of models for my Angels Sanguine army (more than a company worth) but I have painted practically none of it. Instead, for the last six months or so I have been watching painting tutorials, surfing the forums and working on one model at a time, trying to get the perfect techniques for painting red and black. I believe I have finally found a method I like, and at about the same time Games Workshop announced they were turning one of the stores in my city into the Warhammer Championship Store, as well as holding a tournament there in April. I rather spontaneously grabbed a ticket, and now I will be playing there in less than two months. This means that I have a firm time limit on developing, building, testing and painting this list. My only tournament experience was a good 4 or 5 years ago, a duo tournament where my duo partner and I came dead last with the worlds least competitive Codex Space Marines and Dark Eldar lists (though we won the sportsmanship award!). I don't really expect to do much better this time round, but I am aiming to be at least somewhat competitive and hopefully win a couple of games. I will include my current list below, and I would really appreciate any feedback, advice, criticism or comments you have to offer. I'm hoping it is ok to post this in the main forum rather than the army list specific one. I intend to use this post to develop my army list, and as a log of the building, testing and painting of the army, culminating with news of how I do at the tournament. Rules: 3 detachments max, 1750pts, 5 missions from Eternal War CA2018 Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [5CP, 533pts] **+ HQ +** Captain [124pts]: Jump Pack, Storm shield, Thunder hammer Librarian Dreadnought [142pts]: 1. Quickening, 6. Wings of Sanguinus, Furioso fist, Storm bolter **+ Troops +** Intercessor Squad [89pts]: Auxiliary grenade launcher, Bolt rifle, 4x Intercessor - Intercessor Sergeant: Power sword Intercessor Squad [89pts]: Auxiliary grenade launcher, Bolt rifle, 4x Intercessor - Intercessor Sergeant: Power sword Intercessor Squad [89pts]: Auxiliary grenade launcher, Bolt rifle, 4x Intercessor - Intercessor Sergeant: Power sword Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) [1CP, 606pts] **+ HQ +** The Sanguinor [150pts] **+ Elites +** Sanguinary Ancient [76pts]: Angelus boltgun, Power fist Sanguinary Guard [224pts] - 7 x Sanguinary Guard: Angelus boltgun, Power fist Vanguard Veteran Squad [156pts]: Jump Pack - 2 x Space Marine Veteran: 2x Lightning Claw - 3 x Space Marine Veteran: Power sword, Storm shield - Veteran Sergeant: 2x Lightning Claw Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Astra Militarum) [5CP, 611pts] Regiment: Cadian **+ HQ +** Company Commander [30pts]:Chainsword, Laspistol Company Commander [30pts]: Chainsword, Laspistol **+ Troops +** Infantry Squad [40pts]: 9x Guardsman - Sergeant: Chainsword, Laspistol Infantry Squad [40pts]: 9x Guardsman - Sergeant: Chainsword, Laspistoll Infantry Squad [40pts]: 9x Guardsman - Sergeant: Chainsword, Laspistol Infantry Squad [41pts]: 9x Guardsman - Sergeant: Boltgun, Chainsword **+ Heavy Support +** Basilisks [324pts] - 3 x Basilisk: Heavy Bolter Heavy Weapons Squad [33pts] - Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar - Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar - Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar Heavy Weapons Squad [33pts] - Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar - Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar - Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar Total: [14CP, 1750pts] The general strategy will be to control ground and objectives with the guard infantry and intercessors, and aim to remove screens and scoring units with them + the mortars. The sanguinary guard, ancient and sanguinor will be aiming to destroy the highest priority targets - slam captain and librarian dreadnought can go with them if needed, but I have some flexibility with where I can send them, especially if I make the ancient warlord. A similar situation with the vanguard veterans - they can go in on the main strike, clear screens, escort a character or hunt backline units depending on the situation. At this stage I will be using 1CP for a second relic, giving the captain the angels wings and the ancient the standard of sacrifice. The basilisks will hopefully provide long range anti-armour from out of LoS, and I will also look to use them to thin out or destroy threats to the sanguinary guard (infantry rocking plasma, etc). I'll be needing to order in the Sanguinor, an IG heavy weapon squad and 2 basilisks if I go with this list. Let me know what you think, I'm going to get to building and painting the units I am reasonably certain will be in the final list like the sanguinary guard and smash captain. I'll throw up WIP photos as soon as I construct a little light/photo box so my hand isn't filling up the picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted February 27, 2019 Share Posted February 27, 2019 Looks like you're lacking anti-tank. Your only options there are the Captain and the Librarian dread. Both units who want to punch things in the face which means your opponents tanks have zero pressure turn 1 and possibly turn 2 as well. I'd include at least one Devastator squad with Heavy Bolter, Missile Launcer, 2xLascannon. HB and ML for Mortal wound spam via Stratagem. You probably also should ask the TO whether you have to write down relics and warlord traits in your list or whether you can decide on the fly. Many tournaments require you to decide beforehand and write it down in your list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasrkin101 Posted February 27, 2019 Author Share Posted February 27, 2019 Yeah, I was kinda worried about that. Previous versions of the list contained two such devastator squads, but in a few test games I played against a friend their performance was quite disappointing. I'll give them another whirl, perhaps it was just new model syndrome. I had also considered running 2 (or more) dreadnoughts with twin lascannon and missile launcher, but I was concerned that including just a couple of vehicles would draw the enemy anti-armour fire, especially if I came up against something like a castellan. The hope was the basilisks would be able to hide and put out some firepower, but I can replace them if need be - I haven't bought the models yet. A devastator squad with that armament comes to 150pts. Do you think I should drop the vanguard veterans, replace the intercessors with scouts and drop a sanguinary guard model or reorder the list some other way? I'm having a fair amount of trouble working around the 1750 pts limit. In regards to warlord traits and the relic, they do need to be recorded on the army roster. The choice to use CP to get more relics is up to you at the start of each battle. I just left them out of the roster at this stage because I'm going to play around a fair bit and try different things during my test games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasrkin101 Posted April 2, 2019 Author Share Posted April 2, 2019 So over the last month, I have gone through about 40 permutations of this list, and not really been happy with any of them. I think I've finally got to the stage where I have remembered that I'm not expecting to win, so I should just come up with a list and stick with it - I can learn from this tournament and make adjustments for future events. Plus, between all the painting and building required and full time university, I am running out of time - only a month left before the event. One thing I did learn from play-testing lists is that I really dislike long-ranged anti-tank right now - I've been having absolutely terrible luck with them, and giving devastators and hellfire dreadnoughts the re-roll support they need to do their job reliably will take away too many points from the things I actually want to include in the list. So my list as it stands: Battalion 1 - Blood Angels - 5CP Captain - Thunder Hammer, Storm Shield, Jump Pack - Relic: Angels Wing - 124pts Librarian Dreadnought - Storm Bolter, Powers: Quickening, Wings of Sanguinius - 142pts - Warlord: Artisan of War Scouts Squad - 5 Scouts, Combat Knives - 55pts Scouts Squad - 5 Scouts, Combat Knives - 55pts Scouts Squad - 5 Scouts, Combat Knives - 55pts Aggressor Squad - 3 x Boltstorm Gauntlets and Frag Launchers - 111pts Aggressor Squad - 3 x Boltstorm Gauntlets and Frag Launchers - 111pts Battalion 2 - Blood Angels - 5CP Chaplain - Bolt pistol, Jump Pack - 90pts The Sanguinor - 150pts Scout Squad - 5 Scouts, Bolters - 55pts Scout Squad - 5 Scouts, Bolters - 55pts Scout Squad - 5 Scouts, Bolters - 55pts Vanguard Veterans Squad - Sergeant w/ Thunder Hammer, Storm Shield (32pts) - 3 x Veteran w/ Thunder Hammer, Storm Shield (32pts) - 5 x Veteran w/ Chainsword, Storm Shield (16pts) - Jump Packs - 235pts Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment - Imperial Knights - House Terryn Knight Gallant - Heavy Stubber - 352pts Total: 13 CP, 1645pts Sanguinor and Chaplain will be travelling with the vanguard veterans. All the scouts will deploy close, and the gallant will be aiming to get into combat ASAP - big distraction carnifex - I plan on using exalted court to bring his invuln to 4+, and then rotate ion shields for a 3+, so I expect he should be able to tank for at least a turn or two most of the time. Aggressors and scouts will be taking care of the screens, hopefully opening space for the characters, vanguard vets and gallant. Settling on this core list lets me get the majority of the modelling and painting sorted while giving a me a few options for the last ~100pts to decide on during some final play-testing. I can free up more points by adjusting the vanguard veterans and/or dropping the Sanguinor for a lieutenant. Options I am considering are: 3 more aggressors, reinforcement points for an assassin (I only have a culexus currently, looking to get an eversor), changing the knight to a crusader for fire support, fitting in another assault unit (death company or sanguinary guard) or putting in some intercessors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasrkin101 Posted April 2, 2019 Author Share Posted April 2, 2019 Currently working on cleaning up the Sanguinor so I can prime him on the weekend and get him painted next week. Seems to be a pretty good model despite being finecast, not many holes and all the detail seems to be there, so mostly just removing the flash and bridges. Bought this primed Librarian Dreadnought from a friend a few months ago. I ripped off the heavy flamer and magnetised it back on, scraped off a bunch of mold lines and filed down some rough patches where sprue attached. Just need to finish magnetising the arms on the knight and he is ready for painting - I'll be painting him in the colours of Hawkshroud. I really like the lore of Hawkshroud and think the yellow colour scheme will make a nice centrepiece - it also lets me build the heraldry of the Angels Sanguine into the knights own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I'm sorry I missed the original post!! What was wrong with that first list? It looked deadly. The basilisks and mortars looked scary as. The new list is very, very different, but I guess can work. Agressors will be good for clearing chaff. Id definitely go with the Eversor, great synergy with this list. Culexus isnt worth it imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasrkin101 Posted April 2, 2019 Author Share Posted April 2, 2019 The original list is definitely something I would like to try and run sometime down the line, but there were two main issues with it - a lot of feedback I got from other places was that they feared I didn't have enough screening to prevent the basilisks from being hard locked in combat. The other, probably even more significant issue being that Imperial Guard was my first army from years and years ago, and I only have 1 basilisk in my collection. GW has them listed as temporarily unavailable online, and it seems to also be unavailable everywhere else I've checked (online and local). I have strongly considered keeping the guard battalion and running a pair of leman russ alongside the knight, but that of course cuts significantly into the points I can spend on blood angels. The current plan is to blitz through as much infantry as I can, and then use melee to tie up and/or destroy as many of the enemies heavy hitters as I can each turn, but I am worried about how little firepower I have available (most recently I was planning out the possibility of using imperial guard autocannons to fashion storm cannon arrays for my leviathan and bringing that). I've been really enjoying the battle reports and list ideas in your own thread, and any advice you can give to a neophyte like myself is much appreciated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I see the issues!! Personally, with the vanguard (forward elements, rather than the unit name) you had in the first list, you would not have had to worry about them being tied up. The focus would have been far, far away from them. 40 grunts would have been MORE than enough to screen. With a unit of scouts in the place of intercessors too, you could have pushed them back even further. I think it was the scariest version of the list - despite it still being possible to tweak to taste/efficiency. The more pressing issue, as you said, is the availability of the models themselves. That's fair enough. The knight list is a big shift from the first, and I think will play entirely differently (not necessarily better or worse, that will depend on your meta). But, do us a favour, share some reports and feedback of the missions, what worked and what didnt. What shifted you away from the Sang Guard and what pushed you towards aggressors for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 maybe 1 Wyvern, 1 Tank Commander and one Bassy - using the vigilus emperors wrath. So, you could rock: Tank Commander - las, plas sponsons, battle canon Commander 3x 10 Grunts 3x Mortars WyvernBasilisk If my quick math is correct, it should work out near identical in points. The detachment allows you to fire twice, and Cadian rules make you shoot really well - the Battlecannon can also be upgraded to that relic cannon - which is gnarly as. slight "mod" note, though - try keep the thread to the discussion of tactics and reports and benefits of each unit and their performance -that way it can stay in the main area. Otherwise, it will have to get shipped off to the list building subforum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Are Verlo Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I have to echo what other posters have said. The first list is not lacking anti-tank@1750 3 basilisks, smash captain, libby dread and SG should cover anti-tank. I’d actually say you are a bit light on anti-horde, but not critically light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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